52 replies to this topic

[GreyNovember]

To be fair, what do you want us to do?

"GAH! MY teammate is engaging an enemy and is on cooldown, but he opened up his ST! I'll finish it off so he doesn't get shredded by return fire from his target!"

If it bothers you that much, there's always going rambo. Great fun if you can find a light alpha boat to do it in.

[Darian DelFord]

Wait a sec.

So if I take out a side torso, I get a comp destroy as well for the arm, and a bump in damage done for the armor and internals for the effected arm?

[Rizzelbizzeg]

Darian DelFord, on 29 January 2016 - 03:49 AM, said:

Wait a sec.

So if I take out a side torso, I get a comp destroy as well for the arm, and a bump in damage done for the armor and internals for the effected arm?

I didn't think it worked like this, I'd be very surprised if it did. I thought it was like Jman said:

Jman5, on 28 January 2016 - 09:57 PM, said:

I really need to test this in a lobby. I've seen this claim thrown around here and on Reddit, but I'm pretty sure arm health does not get added onto your damage nor does it contribute to KMDD when you just shoot a ST off.

If this were true you would be getting something like 700+ damage out of a single atlas solo kill if you took out ST and CT, which is common. The damage numbers would suddenly be through the roof if the game was tacking on arm health to your damage.

now I'm curious about this too. I could gladly help test in like 4 hours or so heh

[ReverseBurgler]

Alistair Winter, on 28 January 2016 - 09:46 PM, said:

All these challenges based on doing damage are unfair, because they favour assault mechs and heavy mechs anyway, which typically do more damage.

But the point isn't to make fair challenges. The point is to make you buy all the best robot Pokemons to collect maximum gold coins. That's the name of the game.

What would be a better metric to measure player performance?

[Revis Volek]

crustydog, on 29 January 2016 - 01:31 AM, said:

Now kids, it's called "Kill Secured" and don't forget your back armor!

Your fellow warriors are so concerned about your well being that sometimes they will risk shooting through you to get that enemy mech properly squared away:)

IF they are face hugging, you're damn right i will. Thats just as bad IMO.

[MysticLink]

SkyHammyr, on 28 January 2016 - 09:40 PM, said:

Nice.

"We need to focus fire and shoot open locations...
Wait! Stop Stat Stealing me!!!"

OMG this made my day LOL.

[Revis Volek]

Rizzelbizzeg, on 29 January 2016 - 10:36 AM, said:

I didn't think it worked like this, I'd be very surprised if it did. I thought it was like Jman said:


now I'm curious about this too. I could gladly help test in like 4 hours or so heh

I'm almost 100% positive it doesn't work like this, I catn recall ever shooting off a ST and seeing TWO Component Destroyed Scored in the rewards as they pop up on the screen. Its always one...unless you peice meal the guy by taking the arm FIRST then the ST.

Which can happen in the blink of an eye if its say a CDA with hardly any armor or something. Literally the dmg you do while getting your lasers target on the ST can rip an arm off of some of those builds as well as the ST shortly after.


But please, some one who is home in front of their game share the results!

Edited by Revis Volek, 29 January 2016 - 11:17 AM.

[Alistair Winter]

ReverseBurgler, on 29 January 2016 - 11:11 AM, said:

What would be a better metric to measure player performance?

Good question. In my experience, the best challenges have been the ones where PGI designs a special algorithm to determine whether or not you get a point. Something like 10 points for every kill, 10 points for every kill assist, 30 points for a win, 1 point for every 50 points of damage, etc. In those cases, it's easier for light mechs to get 10 assists than it is for assault mechs, but assault mechs have an easier time getting the damage bonuses. You could add other stuff, I guess. TAG kills and what not.

In the long run, the best way to determine performance is WLR, ultimately. If you're evaluating match by match, you're going to end up with some sort of arbitrary system no matter what (and people will change their playstyle accordingly), so you at least have to make it fair for all 4 weight classes.

[Roadkill]

Jman5, on 28 January 2016 - 09:57 PM, said:

I really need to test this in a lobby. I've seen this claim thrown around here and on Reddit, but I'm pretty sure arm health does not get added onto your damage nor does it contribute to KMDD when you just shoot a ST off.

If this were true you would be getting something like 700+ damage out of a single atlas solo kill if you took out ST and CT, which is common. The damage numbers would suddenly be through the roof if the game was tacking on arm health to your damage.

I've been curious about this, too, so if you see me online give a holler and I'll help you test it.

I've had many games where Occam's Razor said that arm health was being added when I blew out a side torso. I'm certainly willing to believe there's another answer, but it really fits with my experience.

[JC Daxion]

Alistair Winter, on 28 January 2016 - 09:46 PM, said:

All these challenges based on doing damage are unfair, because they favour assault mechs and heavy mechs anyway, which typically do more damage.

You know i don't find this at all with KMDD.. If i wan't to win the KMDD i load up a mech with an AC20, and some back up weapons.. I don't run my typical laser mechs or mechs i hit higher damage with. My AC-20 or dual 5's or 10's i can always shread a mech fast, before they stack up lots of damage.. I played like 40+ matches in my energy timber, and made it about half way through the last time they did this. I they loaded up a UAC20 and 3 ML's and finished it in 10 matches, even though my over damage went down.

I ran it on my IS account in my centurion.. i've done others in my Deaths Kneel.. (nice pin-point and good damage)

to me it favors mechs that can pin-point and do high damage quickly.. mechs that are DPS based have a much harder time, as that is typically what i play.


But this challenge??? you get 1m c-bills.. not even a reward really.. not that i am complaining about it, just saying.. if i need to run more matches i got more c-bills anyway.

Edited by JC Daxion, 29 January 2016 - 11:29 AM.

[butchly13]

Jman5, on 28 January 2016 - 09:57 PM, said:

I really need to test this in a lobby. I've seen this claim thrown around here and on Reddit, but I'm pretty sure arm health does not get added onto your damage nor does it contribute to KMDD when you just shoot a ST off.

If this were true you would be getting something like 700+ damage out of a single atlas solo kill if you took out ST and CT, which is common. The damage numbers would suddenly be through the roof if the game was tacking on arm health to your damage.

If this is true, I'd better start practicing my aim so I can get some 1000+ damage matches by targeting almost-dead STs with arms still intact. Damage point stealing like a boss

Edited by butchly13, 29 January 2016 - 11:27 AM.

[wanderer]

Quote

But the point isn't to make fair challenges. The point is to make you buy all the best robot Pokemons to collect maximum gold coins. That's the name of the game.

If you're buying packs left and right to get those extra million spacebucks for each, the problem has nothing to do with kill stealing and everything to do with diminished mental capacity.

Also, KMDD is light-years better than straight kills. I just wish that instead of tacking on damage towards KMDD, side torso blowing an arm off would give you only "component destroyed" rewards.

[butchly13]

wanderer, on 29 January 2016 - 11:28 AM, said:

If you're buying packs left and right to get those extra million spacebucks for each, the problem has nothing to do with kill stealing and everything to do with diminished mental capacity.

Also, KMDD is light-years better than straight kills. I just wish that instead of tacking on damage towards KMDD, side torso blowing an arm off would give you only "component destroyed" rewards.

I agree. If you don't damage the arm and go straight for the ST you should only get points for the ST. Should keep KMDD more honest instead of giving a bonus to the person who destroys the ST with a SPL and good timing.

[Kenneth Kell]

SkyHammyr, on 28 January 2016 - 09:40 PM, said:

Nice.

"We need to focus fire and shoot open locations...
Wait! Stop Stat Stealing me!!!"

Sadly i did see someone say this in a match the other day in all Caps..lol

[Sagamore]

butchly13, on 29 January 2016 - 11:31 AM, said:

I agree. If you don't damage the arm and go straight for the ST you should only get points for the ST. Should keep KMDD more honest instead of giving a bonus to the person who destroys the ST with a SPL and good timing.

Yes. This is the point of my thread.

As far as I know it does work this way, arm health contributing to Damage score on ST kill. While blowing off side torsos I get high damage in a match (easy 700+). Would like to see it tested for science in a private lobby though.

Kenneth Kell, on 29 January 2016 - 11:40 AM, said:

Sadly i did see someone say this in a match the other day in all Caps..lol

Was it me? I said it to be glib in one match when I saw Accused and Alistair in my game who had both commented on this thread.

[Roadkill]

Sagamore, on 29 January 2016 - 03:39 PM, said:

Yes. This is the point of my thread.

Easy fix: stop trying to farm damage yourself and just core your targets. If you core the target, then all that light can do is come by and give you the KMDD.

I understand what you're saying, but it's such a minimal problem - and one that has a solution you can implement yourself - that I really don't see the point in PGI changing anything.

[LordNothing]

its not a kill steal if the other guy did more damage than you.

the usual mode of a kill steal involves one player doing a lot of damage and then overheating, and another team player saves his butt by getting the kill before he can headshot the first player. kmdd prevents that from happening, in that case the first guy gets the kmdd, and the second guy gets the killing blow.

want to do a lot of damage, use a lot of srms and ballistics. high alpha laser builds are good in teamplay games where you can hump alpha and wait to cool down for the next one. when going for kmdd you want to be able to sustain fire. lerms can also work, but i wouldn't depend on others for locks, they will likely not so you dont get their kmdd.

Edited by LordNothing, 29 January 2016 - 04:52 PM.

[Bilbo]

Roadkill, on 29 January 2016 - 04:44 PM, said:

Easy fix: stop trying to farm damage yourself and just core your targets. If you core the target, then all that light can do is come by and give you the KMDD.

I understand what you're saying, but it's such a minimal problem - and one that has a solution you can implement yourself - that I really don't see the point in PGI changing anything.

This. The only reason, really, to wing a target is if you are fighting it alone and need to strip firepower quickly(IS XL engines withstanding). If teammates are around just shoot it in the chest until it falls over.

[Accused]

Honestly if you're blowing that side torso to get rid of that arm it should reward you. I don't think it does though, however let's not forget component damage transfer either. I think that's still a thing.

[Ex Atlas Overlord]

El Bandito, on 28 January 2016 - 10:00 PM, said:

There is no "kill stealing" in MWO. Unlike League of Legends, there is no benefit in "feeding" a single player kills.
See the enemy = shoot it until its dead. Simple.

As longs you get a cbill reward for something people will find a way to "secure" it.