35 replies to this topic

[Kumakichi]

I can appreciate the Steam player are trying to figure things out and learning to play MWO. I dont mind losing more than winning. I've had huge losing streaks too. What bugs me is that obvious higher tiered players in decked out expensive clan mechs drop in games and tear everybody to ribbons. I know its PGI's fault and not theres. But does the tiered system do anything?

[Cabusha]

Much like WOT, match maker giveth and taketh away.

[Dingo Battler]

crashlogic, on 06 February 2016 - 12:11 PM, said:

Okay I just lost 12 in a row. I don't mind losing, its just a streak thing. But how the teams have lost is just horrid. I say don't go in the middle on Mordor..they go in the middle on mordor and lose. Don't nascar on Caustic. The team goes nascar on caustic. Loss. I tell a lance not to go in the tunnel on frozen city and separate from the rest...they do that. Loss. I say defend in assault on polar, they attack, loss. Don't fight in the choke points on Viridian, they do, loss. Four mechs run off to cap on Canyon, the rest of the team does not. Loss.
Where do these teams come from? and why so many today? Its like I am in tier 5 hell.
The only bright spot has been playing mordor with a team that sorted out that the middle was death, we defended the base in assault and one. Thanks to you guys.
Done

While I empathise with your losses in a row, the ones highlighted in black are terrible for PUG.

PUG always fights in the eye in modor, because all PUGs from tier 5 to 1 will try to take the center, and kill other PUGs who try to come in, so its pretty much the most important spot on mordor in PUG. I understand units will fight around the eye, with some NASCARing, but that's because units have the ability to push en-masse into the eye. No such thing in PUG.

Defend in assault only works for units who have a plan, know how to defend and move around. Even then, its an uncommon strategy for units. For PUG, all you're doing is asking to get surrounded and picked off. Defend never ever works in PUG.

PUG does what PUG wills. KISS always works in PUG. Don't tell them not to fight in a certain place, they'll stay in that place just to spite you. Everyone hates a mechcommander, especially in PUG games. You're not their boss nor commander.

The best you can do in PUG is tell them to stick together, that's it, and even then, you have to be nice about it. If you don't like their strategy, you can suggest something, but the moment you command them, no one will listen, certainly not me.

I play this game to forget about work and bosses, not to be worked and bossed around by some noob.

[Sorbic]

Escef, on 06 February 2016 - 06:33 PM, said:

What I think is hilarious is that half of your advice is bad or situational.

Don't go center in Terra Therma? They did and lost? Really, so what do you think the other team did? Guess what, they went center! Only they did so in a smarter fashion than your team did!

Don't Nascar on Caustic? So, what did the other team do? Odds are they did some Nascaring, too.

Defend on Assault on Polar? Defending in an assault match is usually a loss, but so is going about the attack stupidly.

Don't fight in the choke points in Viridian? Honestly, don't fight in the choke points anywhere, unless you're outnumbered and can use the choke to your advantage.

Four mechs ran off to cap on Canyon? Assault or Conquest? In assault, a properly timed cap can split the enemy team and leave your main force with a numbers advantage. In conquest, so long as they rejoin the fight after one cap, can be really awesome.

Defend the base in Therma assault, holy carp, that's your success story? That's ceding initiative to the other team, more often than not that's a loss.

Yeah I always have a laugh at players who berate "nascar = loss you idiots" one side or the other for losing due to doing something like nascar'ing. I am not a fan of it but more often that not the other team did the same darn thing. They just did it better or got a lucky first kill.

Edited by Sorbic, 07 February 2016 - 04:54 PM.

[Novakaine]

KBurn85, on 07 February 2016 - 04:39 PM, said:

While I empathise with your losses in a row, the ones highlighted in black are terrible for PUG.

PUG always fights in the eye in modor, because all PUGs from tier 5 to 1 will try to take the center, and kill other PUGs who try to come in, so its pretty much the most important spot on mordor in PUG. I understand units will fight around the eye, with some NASCARing, but that's because units have the ability to push en-masse into the eye. No such thing in PUG.

Defend in assault only works for units who have a plan, know how to defend and move around. Even then, its an uncommon strategy for units. For PUG, all you're doing is asking to get surrounded and picked off. Defend never ever works in PUG.

PUG does what PUG wills. KISS always works in PUG. Don't tell them not to fight in a certain place, they'll stay in that place just to spite you. Everyone hates a mechcommander, especially in PUG games. You're not their boss nor commander.

The best you can do in PUG is tell them to stick together, that's it, and even then, you have to be nice about it. If you don't like their strategy, you can suggest something, but the moment you command them, no one will listen, certainly not me.

I play this game to forget about work and bosses, not to be worked and bossed around by some noob.

Well that's just sad.

[sycocys]

Just saw someone "sniping" with Small Lasers. Posted a magnificent 16 damage because he managed to hit with a few when the other team bum rushed him - and he backed away without firing again.

GG close after that match, if that's going to be the quality of the MM/players tonight there's no sense in playing.

Edited by sycocys, 07 February 2016 - 07:41 PM.

[Trauglodyte]

I keep teetering between tier 2 and tier 3, thanks to the horribads that play and, at times, my own god awfulness. But, it is shocking to watch how poorly people play after I get whacked. I saw someone in T2 the other night playing with the newbie arrow and arm lock the entire time. Saw someone else play an almost entire game - I got screwed, again, by a lucky heady shot via Artillery in the first 2 min of the game - in 3rd person. You want to try to tell these mooks what to do?

[VirtualRiot]

Honestly I think no one saying anything is what increases your chances on winning because then it wont be like, 4 guys listen to you and the rest dont and people get split up. Just flow with the pug wave

[Revis Volek]

adamts01, on 06 February 2016 - 01:49 PM, said:

Solo que is horrid, absolutely horrid. Group up to save your sanity.

Very often i play ONE solo match and then promptly EXIT GAME and go play something else.

If a decent amount of unit members aren't on i should say...

[MrMadguy]

Simple answer: Tier 3 - is PSR Hell.

[Paigan]

Escef, on 06 February 2016 - 06:33 PM, said:

What I think is hilarious is that half of your advice is bad or situational.

Don't go center in Terra Therma? They did and lost? Really, so what do you think the other team did? Guess what, they went center! Only they did so in a smarter fashion than your team did!

Don't Nascar on Caustic? So, what did the other team do? Odds are they did some Nascaring, too.

Defend on Assault on Polar? Defending in an assault match is usually a loss, but so is going about the attack stupidly.

Don't fight in the choke points in Viridian? Honestly, don't fight in the choke points anywhere, unless you're outnumbered and can use the choke to your advantage.

Four mechs ran off to cap on Canyon? Assault or Conquest? In assault, a properly timed cap can split the enemy team and leave your main force with a numbers advantage. In conquest, so long as they rejoin the fight after one cap, can be really awesome.

Defend the base in Therma assault, holy carp, that's your success story? That's ceding initiative to the other team, more often than not that's a loss.

This.

Also, I noticed it matters very much how you say advice at the beginning.

For example:
If you just say "Don't nascar", then most people will think "Then what else should we do, the map is still a big round mountain."
If you say "Please don't nascar away from assaults", then more often then not, people will actually wait for fatties.

And honestly: nascaring per se isn't bad. If you nascar around the hill in one big death ball, assaults INCLUDED, you'll probably win in a PUG game because you eat up all the left-behinds.
It's abandoning parts of the team or spreading out too much that is bad.

If you just say "don't nascar" without a reasonable explanation or sound alternative, it usually shows that you don't have much idea of the game and shouldn't have said anything in the first place.
My guess is: and that's where the OP's 12 loss-streak comes in.

Edited by Paigan, 08 February 2016 - 02:05 AM.

[Benjamin357]

Paigan is right regarding nascar, especially on Caustic. In solo queue, the team that calls out something against nascar typically goes for a standaround party instead, and loses badly. The aggressor generally has the advantage of picking engagement, element of surprise, and shooting those in the back that run. Other mistakes, not pushing obvious advantages - like when a lance goes to the wrong cap on Canyon / Tourmaline conquest, why not put them down quickly, then regroup? Tunnel vision on center of the map frequently means an opportunity lost. Same goes for door standing on Terra Therma, or dink-diving the platform on Manifold/Canyon/Mining - so many attack vectors that it usually means a loss. Base defense strategies can work, assuming that they are from defensible positions with firing lanes; more likely just another standaround party.

[Mister Blastman]

Accused, on 06 February 2016 - 05:12 PM, said:

Get gud and carry harder, Mt. Tryhard is steep.

Tired of nascar? Become the leader of the race. Tired of going middle? Be first in and last out, Tired of chokepoints, blow through them.

#pug4lyfe

At least be fair--the solo queue has been crap the last few days. I've lost every single drop it seems in the last ten or twelve attempts and not due to my efforts, but the six other sub-100s I get every drop.

But I have a rule... lose four in a row, alt-f4 and play something else.

[Eregion]

KBurn85, on 07 February 2016 - 04:39 PM, said:

Everyone hates a mechcommander, especially in PUG games. You're not their boss nor commander.

The best you can do in PUG is tell them to stick together, that's it, and even then, you have to be nice about it. If you don't like their strategy, you can suggest something, but the moment you command them, no one will listen, certainly not me.

I play this game to forget about work and bosses, not to be worked and bossed around by some noob.

And this is why noobs are noobs. No teamwork because they cannot be "bossed".

I hope you don't play in FP.


If I find a leader in QP I'll follow his orders, because a "bad plan is better then no plan".
In FP, if there are no groups or if we are the only group, I always try to lead. And I always find somebody like you, who usually do the exact opposite of the rest of the team.

Those are the occasions I would like a "kick" button.

Edited by Eregion, 08 February 2016 - 08:15 PM.

[crashlogic]

Paigan, I was not as curt in offering advice as I was in ranting in my post. But you are tier one, How often do you play with or against tier five opponents? Escef is being short sighted in assuming that things didn't happen the way I said they did, my suspicion from his comments is that he does not play at the bottom end very much either. I'm tier 3, do I see teams that you haven't seen at least since the whole steam thing, and probably since before PSR. Maybe you have a tier 4 alt account, but I'm not guessing. Look I know when I am playing with a bunch of tier 1 and two guys, even if my team loses. They stay together and cooperate, communicate and have some sense.
At the bottom tiers teams don't go in the middle on terra therma in a coordinated pattern, rather 6 of the go in one entrance, two in two others and two stay on the trail waiting to get in the middle. Everything is bottled up, and then the team get cut up peicemeal because they got flanked.
In tier four and five (and maybe even tier three) all nascar accomplishes is that he team gets spread out and the enemy concentrates and cuts them up. There is also a big difference in the way a tier one team moves around the middle on Caustic, and NASCAR. A good team concentrates and moves as a unit, and sure that might feel like nascar, but its far from the same thing.
I wouldn't say defend in assault no matter what, but on Polar, which is very open, teams coming across the marshmallow middle have little cover. At low tiers the lights go off to cap the enemy, the assaults get left behind and everyone else gets torn up in the middle.Picking defense makes it more likely the team will stay together and take advantage of the hard cover in the trenches.
Again, fire lanes and good position and such are what tier 2 players do. Tier 5 players run about and hope they don't get to much damage. coordinated pushes, mutual support, and even basic going in the same direction are lost. Its not tunnel vision on the middle of the map that is the issue at low tier, its four guys on Tourmoline lining up along a ridge, four heading into the valley of death, and the assaults simply trying to get to the fight.
I play a lot in the solo pug queue, I know its vicissitudes well. But the day I wrote this, it was a long string of really really bad teams.

[SuomiWarder]

I'm tier five from thousands of games in sub-pat weird mechs. I just had a streak of 14 losses with 4 wins in 18 games as a pug. Weird thing was most of those losses my team didn't do anything really stupid. The other team wasn't great. The only possible constant I saw was that usually the other wise had more firepower or more guys with unit tags on their name.

Sometimes you just catch a bad streak. When you do it is hard not to find all kinds of fault with your team mates. You find what you intend to find.