51 replies to this topic

[Kotzi]

Because people are forced by "voting" to play modes they dont want.

[Thunderbird Anthares]

MechWarrior849305, on 03 March 2016 - 11:39 PM, said:

I've just... LOLed. To have scouts... for what? To cap enemy base instead? Yeah, what a twist

Furthermore - have scouts in PUG match, where you have to deal with what mechs PGI random gave to your team.

The same demand as to ask for TEAMPLAY in PUG matches

i know, its kind of naive to ask for teamplay in PUGs, but it DOES happen... its not unheard of...

generally the matchmaker assigns a couple of lights to each team, asking a little scouting of them is not unreasonable, and they can do it while looking for fat assaults to chew on

[NextGame]

who cares if people are salty. It's called As-salt for a reason.

The aim of the game is to win.

[Jaqir]

If only there was a way to prevent the games from ending prematurely by capping.

[Clownwarlord]

Jaqir, on 03 March 2016 - 11:53 PM, said:

If only there was a way to prevent the games from ending prematurely by capping.

There is ... it is called defending your base.

[Thunderbird Anthares]

Jaqir, on 03 March 2016 - 11:53 PM, said:

If only there was a way to prevent the games from ending prematurely by capping.

you mean like... few turrets with reasonable positioning and armament?

[Jaqir]

Thunderbird Anthares, on 03 March 2016 - 11:56 PM, said:

you mean like... few turrets with reasonable positioning and armament?

More in line with what the comment above yours suggested, actually. Turrets don't really fix the issue of people feeling free to derp around while the base is under attack, just slightly slows down the process of capping. Though sure, couple of them to give those sneakier lights something to shoot at before they get to make camp probably wouldn't hurt.

[Kyynele]

If you spend more time waiting for a match than in the match, and don't even get to shoot anything which means you get no money or xp from the match either, I'd say it's quite natural to get annoyed.

1 or 2 mechs capping isn't going to be any problem however, this pretty much requires both teams to either unknowingly pass each other by, or the majority of one of the teams to be players who always get instant matches and don't care if they don't actually get to play some of them.

So, the "saltiness" is typically either towards the game mode in general when the unfortunate absolutely nothing happens, or simply not understanding that the capping guys didn't lose several minutes of their life waiting for nothing like the complainer did.

[Widowmaker1981]

I absolutely love it when im leveling mechs (get 2x XP, move on to next mech), get an assault game voted in and then a bunch of awesome, lovely people go cap instantly so my double XP is wasted (2x nothing is .. nothing). I LOVE THAT.

No, wait. I hate it, with a passion.

Don't mind conquest, because its not possible to end the game crazy early. Assault is just skirmish with an idiot trap.

[Ghogiel]

Capping in assault happens a lot more in low tiers than tier 1, it happens more in group queue as a troll than pugs as well.

Turrets made the gamemode a boring form of skirmish. It turned into a camp fest because lights couldn't tackle the base turrets fast enough to make a base play worth it. That's even if the teams moved far enough away from the bases, because the enemy turrets kept them from rushing in, and the safey of their own kept them more static, it just limited the dynamics of movement. Any light mech base approach signaled to the enemy 2mins before being able get past the turrets, unless they didn't mind taking aimbotted leg dmg from the turrets. It was, and still is a bad game mode. I've many times more base caps/attempts at base caps since turrets were removed.

Edited by Ghogiel, 04 March 2016 - 06:10 AM.

[Soldier91]

Thunderbird Anthares, on 03 March 2016 - 11:16 PM, said:

yeah, why did they remove turrets anyway... seems like a really bad thing to do

Lights mechs didn't have enough firepower/range/armor to take out the turrets or were so damaged by the time they needed to cap you'd lose the players you need to actually get a capture in time. Seemed like when turrets were around in quickmatch assault bravo and or charlie lance would have to both help attack the base usually. Without turrets lights seem a lot more useful in that mode now.

[SuomiWarder]

Assault would be better if the bases were closer together, not so far from the middle that only alight can get back in time to stop a cap. They should be capture points a team has to actually assault to capture. Like the name of the game type. Not a rear supply depot or comms bunker that isn't really defended.

[CMDR Sunset Shimmer]

Just to put in my two cents, I'll quick cap if I can. Why? Because a win matters more than a loss.

If the match draws out and we loose, I'd rather have won and gotten less money.

Because at the end of the day, none of this matters, and my only real gage for anything, is is win/loss.

[Lugh]

Personally I love CAPCLOWNS



They tend to be easy to Pop, they are capping because either they :
1- lack the skills to compete in a shoot out
2-are so damaged they cannot contribute any other way.

When it's 1, and you can run about on the cap point with them and have your team roll back to finish them off, they wins are fun.

If they are doing it and they HAVE the skills to compete in a shoot out, well then, they'll earn that cap and some points too.

[GRiPSViGiL]

El Bandito, on 03 March 2016 - 10:28 PM, said:

Well, there is *** in Assault too.

Generally Assault quick cap win is shunned because the essence of MWO is basically mech to mech combat, and earning rewards to get the next gundam. Assault mode violates both. Now, if there is a BIG reward bonus for cap win, or the bases are actually harder to take than just standing still within a square...

People should just learn to vote out Assault mode in the voting screen or deal with its mechanic. PGI did promise a rework of the Assault mode.

If there was more depth to the game winning matches would matter. All matches were suppose to matter once upon a time ago. Quick play matches should be tied to CW in some way so wins mattered that way a quick cap would be something that actually needed defended against essentially making Assault not the worst game mode.

The community wrecks any game modes that are not skirmish by playing them all like a skirmish match which just continues to keep the game stale. Hopefully Domination game mode can breath a little life into this game finally.

Lugh, on 04 March 2016 - 07:16 AM, said:

Personally I love CAPCLOWNS



They tend to be easy to Pop, they are capping because either they :
1- lack the skills to compete in a shoot out
2-are so damaged they cannot contribute any other way.

When it's 1, and you can run about on the cap point with them and have your team roll back to finish them off, they wins are fun.

If they are doing it and they HAVE the skills to compete in a shoot out, well then, they'll earn that cap and some points too.

Capclowns? LOL clever. Well Skirmderps exacerbate the staleness of MWO considering we have had 3 game modes for a long time. Domination is long over due and very welcomed from my standpoint. It may need respawn to really shine though.

[Lily from animove]

clownwarlord, on 03 March 2016 - 11:26 PM, said:

WHY NOT DEFEND YOUR BASE?!?!

Just asking? It seems pretty simple ask you scouts to find the enemy while you sit at base and then travel out and meet the enemy. OMG people are so lazy.

because information is ammunition and so the steiner lance has to scout the enemy base.

But the problem is deathballing. if you have scouts go out they will be killed by the murderball and then the murderball comes for the rest. So in most cases the murderball is needed to defeat the murderball in the way the current Assault is designed.

Edited by Lily from animove, 04 March 2016 - 07:23 AM.

[Zerberus]

Discussion about the cap mechanic itself aside, I much prefer Assault and conquest to skirmish and always have.

Skirmish is what we had in the very beginning of closed Beta. The same "run and hide" mentality that people complain about today is the reason it was replaced by today`s assault. And for a week or so everyone was happy when that happened.

Then sometime later conquest was introduced. Shortly after, the cap whining on assault as we know it today started. This was, what, 2011-2012 IIRC?

Eventually skirmish was reintroduced a bit more than a year later , and turrets were intorduced to assault to further differentiate it. Cap times overall were lengthened to the point where a heavy mech could not realisticly cap without a module and still get into the fight on conquest . That´s how hard the overall capwhining was, so hard that in the process of appeasing a few excessively vocal few it literally invalidated the gameplay design of another unrelated mode for I think 3 -4 months or so.... Despite the cap points being moved closer together on many maps, most notably Alpine, also predominatly as a direct result of the low-engine-low brain-high alpha crowd that "can´t get anywhere fast enough to make a difference" that was now in their Deathball heaven called Skirmish.

Then the turrets were suddenly too hard (and admittedly, they did cheat pretty hard), turning assault into skirmish with a smaller area of operations because the base could only realistically be taken with a full lance or more. Just like the whiners wanted... But THEY were all now tied um in their Hulk Smash Mech skirmish matches and couldn´t have been happier... except for their new boogeyman, the one assault removed, the "run and hide last mech".

So, eventually turrets were removed from assault again, who knows how many weeks if not months of dev time wasted, just becasue we have a lot of entitled players that shout and flame harder than they think. And as a direct result, here we sit today, having the exact same discussions we had 3 years ago, and the game has barely moved forward...

And most of the whiners STILL haven´t learned how to either not move away in the first place and defend, or simply return to base to do the same. Which is why they continue to whine instead of getting good.

Now they say "it´s becasue we have to play modes that aren´t skirmish". And THAT is complete ********, becasue many were still whining even while we still had mode selection.
Ironically, all assault as it stands today (and in its original implementation) does is expose just how tactically inept most players are, and most people don´t like having their own stupidity flashed in front of their eyes on a regular basis... the smart ones stop doing stupid things while the (generally more vocal) stupid ones try to complain until it´s easy enough that even they can understand it... which is why we have skirmish at all, and why we´ve come full circle on assault.

I would actually propose leaving assault as it is, and making the "rework" into a new game mode altogether.... for example a melange between CW and current assault..... an actual base with some amount of reinforcement and maybe a turret or 2, maybe say 3 structures, one of which must be destroyed while the other 2 are "bonus targets"... but the defenders must actively leave the enclosure if they want to scout or rush, and once they do it´s open.

Solves the "standing in a square" argument from people with no imagination of abstract concepts.
Solves the "boohoo, fast lights and me need 5 minutes to turn around because only bought 200 engine" from people that don´t understand that the time to return is the same as the time you needed to get where you are (if it was one of those fabled instant cap rushes that suppposedly happen 30 seconds into every match).

Unfortunately, most of the other problems (with any game mode) can´t be solved by the devs, simply because their roots generally lie in ingorance and /or a false sense of entitlement and /or illusions of grandeur and /or utter user incompetence.

The problem is that this constant dumbing down of the game to the point where an infant can be competitive on an iPad is the slow death of teh Battletech and simulation aspects that many of os came here for in the first place.

TL;DR :MW:O has already gone from "The Thinking Man´s Shooter" to "The Drinking Man´s Shooter", I´m not really much a fan of making it even more "The Whining Man´s B***h" than it already is....

Edited by Zerberus, 04 March 2016 - 07:55 AM.

[Mystere]

TechaNinja, on 03 March 2016 - 10:24 PM, said:

They ***** that you are a scrub/noob for not fighting them head on and capping them out.
Yet funny enough they put the salt in Assault.

Well they are salty because their favorite mode -- Skirmish -- was added only because of their whining and was never planned. They want MWO as merely mindless "Rock 'Em, Sock 'Em Robots" and not a thinking person's shooter it's supposed to be.

El Bandito, on 03 March 2016 - 10:28 PM, said:

Well, there is *** in Assault too.

Generally Assault quick cap win is shunned because the essence of MWO is basically mech to mech combat, and earning rewards to get the next gundam. Assault mode violates both. Now, if there is a BIG reward bonus for cap win, or the bases are actually harder to take than just standing still within a square...

People should just learn to vote out Assault mode in the voting screen or deal with its mechanic. PGI did promise a rework of the Assault mode.

Well, the payout for assault was bigger long ago. But these same people were extremely salty about that too.

Sigilum Sanctum, on 03 March 2016 - 10:38 PM, said:

I hardly ever vote for Assault because theres always this collection of potatoes who instantly want to cap.

Like, why?

No ones getting paid *******.

Well, I get paid in tears, the vast flowing rivers of male nerd-rage tears that capping produces.

Edited by Mystere, 04 March 2016 - 07:40 AM.

[mogs01gt]

TechaNinja, on 03 March 2016 - 10:24 PM, said:

They ***** that you are a scrub/noob for not fighting them head on and capping them out.
Yet funny enough they put the salt in Assault.

Because the current design of Assault sucks and capping gives jack squat for cbills. Plus if you cap and your team isnt ready, you've now made it 12v11 for your team.

[GRiPSViGiL]

Zerberus, on 04 March 2016 - 07:34 AM, said:

And most of the whiners STILL haven´t learned how to either not move away in the first place and defend, or simply return to base to do the same. Which is why they continue to whine instead of getting good.

Now they say "it´s becasue we have to play modes that aren´t skirmish". And THAT is complete ********, becasue many were still whining even while we still had mode selection.
Ironically, all assault as it stands today (and in its original implementation) does is expose just how tactically inept most players are, and most people don´t like having their own stupidity flashed in front of their eyes on a regular basis... the smart ones stop doing stupid things while the (generally more vocal) stupid ones try to complain until it´s easy enough that even

I agree completely. There are good players that don't want depth in gameplay as well. I get your point though and even a good player who refused to play a game mode any other way than skirmish is flawed in skills to a certain degree but more stubborn than bad most likely.