15 replies to this topic

[SkaerKrow]

I have all of the Highlander IIC mechs, and I have been able to get decent numbers out of each variant, save one. The IIC-A is, if my experience is anything to go on, possibly the worst Assault Mech in the game. What am I doing wrong with this mech, how can I make it shine? I've tried boating cERLLs, cLPLs, a mix, LRM boating, SRM boating, none of it works. Not one bit.

[Rear Admiral Tier 6]

boat heatsinks

edit: adjust armor values to taste

Edited by Rear Admiral Tier 6, 05 March 2016 - 01:25 AM.

[SkaerKrow]

Rear Admiral Tier 6, on 05 March 2016 - 01:23 AM, said:

boat heatsinks

edit: adjust armor values to taste

Thanks, that did the trick! Barring the two light mechs on my team that seemed to think that my lasers were free candy or something.

[Wintersdark]

Rear Admiral Tier 6, on 05 March 2016 - 01:23 AM, said:

boat heatsinks

edit: adjust armor values to taste

That's basically the build I run too. Occassionally, when I'm feeling the need to make it worse for fun, I swap out the torso LPL's for ERPPC's.

It's a bit too hot (though still cools fast) but has a satisfying BWOOSH from the PPC's.

[Nightshade24]

I do not know, I left it 100% stock and do quite well in it...

ER PPC's not your weapon of taste?

[Wintersdark]

Nightshade24, on 05 March 2016 - 02:34 PM, said:

I do not know, I left it 100% stock and do quite well in it...

ER PPC's not your weapon of taste?

The stock loadout is pretty terrible. 3 ERPPC's? 1 LRM 20 and 1 SSRM6? STD270?

Yikes.

[Nightshade24]

Wintersdark, on 05 March 2016 - 03:42 PM, said:

The stock loadout is pretty terrible. 3 ERPPC's? 1 LRM 20 and 1 SSRM6? STD270?

Yikes.

It's like an Awesome 9M and 8V put together with a heavy upgrade and with Jumpjets.
People like playing the Awesome 9M with streaks and ER PPC's, People like playing the 8V with LRM's and PPC's. People like having jumpjets too!

So why not have a mech with all 3?

Yes- I know. I am not the most meta person out there. After all the meta is only a meta. Does not affect me or the mechs I use. It only affects what shoots me and what I shoot at and that doesn't leave me a problem with the 3 ER PPC, LRM 20, and SSRM 6 Highlander IIC A.

It also doesn't give me a problem in an atlas with an Ac 20, LRM 20, SRM 6, 4 medium lasers. Or a Stalker with 2 LRM 10, 2 SRM 6, 4 medium lasers, and 2 large lasers.
Nor does it give me a problem with timberwolfs with LRM's, raven with NARC, Warhawk with ER PPC's, a Highlander with a single LRM 20, etc. Guess my MW2-4 skills really pays off for using mechs with more than 1 weapons spammed over.

[SkaerKrow]

Nightshade24, on 05 March 2016 - 02:34 PM, said:

I do not know, I left it 100% stock and do quite well in it...

ER PPC's not your weapon of taste?

They just didn't work out for me. I run them to decent effect on one of my Hellbringers, but they were just lackluster on the IIC-A. Maybe if I tried running them exclusively, without trying to use the missile slots? The cLPL build is working out better than I could have hoped however, so I'm going to stick with that for now.

[Wintersdark]

Nightshade24, on 05 March 2016 - 08:59 PM, said:

It's like an Awesome 9M and 8V put together with a heavy upgrade and with Jumpjets.
People like playing the Awesome 9M with streaks and ER PPC's, People like playing the 8V with LRM's and PPC's. People like having jumpjets too!

So why not have a mech with all 3?

Yes- I know. I am not the most meta person out there. After all the meta is only a meta. Does not affect me or the mechs I use. It only affects what shoots me and what I shoot at and that doesn't leave me a problem with the 3 ER PPC, LRM 20, and SSRM 6 Highlander IIC A.

It also doesn't give me a problem in an atlas with an Ac 20, LRM 20, SRM 6, 4 medium lasers. Or a Stalker with 2 LRM 10, 2 SRM 6, 4 medium lasers, and 2 large lasers.
Nor does it give me a problem with timberwolfs with LRM's, raven with NARC, Warhawk with ER PPC's, a Highlander with a single LRM 20, etc. Guess my MW2-4 skills really pays off for using mechs with more than 1 weapons spammed over.

You misunderstand. I'm not pushing meta or nothing, and I never do. I am, after all, a frequent proponent of all sorts of other builds.

Likewise, I have no fear of running mechs with 3-4 weapon groups.

However, a Highlander with a standard 270 engine? That's a VERY poor choice. It's already slow and cumbersome even with a 325. And when you can take a clanxl, why take a standard engine at all?

I'm all for non-meta builds, but that doesn't mean they need to be bad builds. 3 CERPPC's are extremely hot. The CLRM20 is a very terrible weapon, worst of all the Clan LRM's (Note: I'm ALL FOR LRM's alongside other weapons in builds!), and one ssrm6 is basically completely pointless. At close range, a single ssrm6 won't even make a locust hesitate, and all that and the standard engine means you don't have nearly the heat sinking capability to actually use those three CERPPC's.

[Wintersdark]

For example, if I wanted to run a conceptually similar build, I'd have used this:

HGN-IIC-A (F/B allocation needs fixing, obviously)

It loses one ERPPC (you can't use three to any effectiveness due to heat, even ignoring ghost heat), but keeps two in the arm for better aiming.

It upgrades to two SSRM6's, for a 24pt SSRM strike, and maintains the LRM20 at range.

It moves 10kph faster, sports four more DHS.

Yes, at the cost of a couple jump jets (still has one for maneuverability) but Class 1 Hoverjets are an AWFUL investment with the current JJ's.


It's still not an amazing build, but it's conceptually the same and FAR more capable in combat.

[Nightshade24]

Wintersdark, on 05 March 2016 - 09:38 PM, said:

You misunderstand. I'm not pushing meta or nothing, and I never do. I am, after all, a frequent proponent of all sorts of other builds.

Likewise, I have no fear of running mechs with 3-4 weapon groups.

However, a Highlander with a standard 270 engine? That's a VERY poor choice. It's already slow and cumbersome even with a 325. And when you can take a clanxl, why take a standard engine at all?

I'm all for non-meta builds, but that doesn't mean they need to be bad builds. 3 CERPPC's are extremely hot. The CLRM20 is a very terrible weapon, worst of all the Clan LRM's (Note: I'm ALL FOR LRM's alongside other weapons in builds!), and one ssrm6 is basically completely pointless. At close range, a single ssrm6 won't even make a locust hesitate, and all that and the standard engine means you don't have nearly the heat sinking capability to actually use those three CERPPC's.

Before we continue I just want to make this clear...
... yea not really- The thought of using a Clan XL on the highlander never came across my mind I just never had the problem with the standard 275. The speed is about equal to that of a traditional king crab, atlas, direwolf. etc.
My Mauler also goes that slow and I got no problems with it and my Urbanmech runs even slower.

However this isn't an "excuse"... it's more of an explanation. The thing is speed didn't and still doesn't bother me to much and that's probably why I never upgraded. However I think this stemmed from my theory crafting which in short basically went along the lines of this for 90 tonners+.... XL engines are rather pointless as they take up to much space for how much tons the save... if I got max slots and still 5 tons left remaining I do not like that build... which a quick pinch to smurfy showed me... It also showed me that my Highlander IIC-A lost a heatsink in the process of making room for an upgrade or equals it for a meagre speed boost... I do not want to spend 5 mill c-bills on a minor change I do not need. An impact to my durability and survivability, etc... The standard engine is suitable enough for me and/or endo steel.

Now off the topic of clan engines...

3 Cl ER PPC's is very hot yes. But it isn't so hot that a 90 ton mech can't handle it. I mean seriously. an 85 ton mech runs it with ease. A 85 ton clan mech has 4 ER PPC's and runs it with ease. Why is a 90 ton mech suffering with it?

With double basics the mech surpasses my goal of heat efficiency % of 30% (it lands on 31%).However that's alpha striking like a silly goose. I will not be snipping with SSRM 6's nor will I be brawling with LRM 20's... so...


On a heat neutral map...
3 ER PPC's:
35% Cooling ratio
Alpha strike heat 45.0 (+18.9 ghost heat.) (I will not be alpha striking... well willy nilly that is... I did 1 alpha knocked out a wolfhound earlier who was trying to annoy me hehe...)

3 ER PPC's + LRM 20
33% cooling ratio
alpha strike heat: 51.0

1 SSRM 6
464% cooling ratio
4.0 alpha heat.

On a cold map ( Borreal vault)
1 ER PPC
115% (never over heating)

2 ER PPC's:
59% cooling ratio.

3 ER PPC's:
40%


3 ER PPC's + LRM 20
37%

1 SSRM 6
522%

So far so good, Me being a ghost bear fan and always like cold maps it goes well so far... however let's say I've dropped on terra therma....well my general cooling ratio is 27%...
1 ER PPC:
89%

2 ER PPC:
46%

3 ER PPC's:
31%

3 ER PPC's + LRM 20
29%

SSRM 6:
407%


So far as far as I am aware I can handle 3 ER PPC's heat on any map. Handling it + LRM 20's however will be a no-go for hot maps, okay for neutral maps, and good for cold maps... and my medium range back up weapon SSRM 6 is available even when I am at my hottest.
If I am on a very hot map I can just fire in pairs and fire the third when I really need to... overall a-okay.


Just to reiterate- the heat capacity is 62.4 and from max heat to 0% heat takes 16.3 seconds to cool. (that I should remind you is not how long I need to fire again but to simply be fully cool again.)

So far so good (at least for me). The mech can easily handle 3 ER PPC's. It can easily handle it like any other ER PPC boat out there. The LRM 20 is good for when you are on a cold
etc...
I know ER PPC's are not the best weapon in game for clans... maybe it's to do wit hthe fact 5 damage is wasted into splash and the Large pulse laser has it's damaged buff to the point that MW: O's large pulse laser does more damage than the ER PPC... crazy!
However it still has the advantage for pinpoint damage and longer range so that's what I like using it for. If I do not want to run ER PPC's on a highlander I got the other ones. Not the end of the world.

The single SSRM 6 is not intended to make mechs run in fear. It's intended to not be nearly defenseless if someone gets 270 meters from me. Using ER PPC's would be bad at 270 meters and cloesr, the heat output is so high for the little damage it does for that range it's pointless. SSRM 6's does a lot less heat and is heat neutral on all maps alone. It also does nearly as much damage as an ER PPC. It is 12 damage afterall and if a Locust isn't running away from a single SSRM 6 and a single ER PPC he's probably dead already. a locust has what... 4.3 tons of armour max? 2-4 SSRM 6 volleys is already enough to core parts of the Locust. if it hits from the same direction a few times (targeting 4 components). Throw in a single ER PPC and that's a dead locust in under 6 seconds (or random lol ER PPC alpha and insta kill... however that leaves me vulnerable for 9 seconds). A lot of my builds carry a single LRM 15 or 20, or a single SRM 6.

This includes but not limited to... Raven, shadowhawk, Centurion, Atlas, Kingcrab, Direwolf, Warhawk, Hellbringer, Summoner, Highlander, Highlander IIC, Thunderbolt, Battlemaster, etc. It's something I'm used to. it's present a lot in lore and canon, it's present a lot in previous MW games, it's present in a lot of stock build sof mechs in MW: O, and it's present in my builds too.
Alright, for you a single SRM 6 is worthless. Fine by me to each their own. However I think it's quite important for a well ballanced mech and if I ever got a spare missile slot and tons for a build. If my build is closed range it'll be a LRM 20 or 15. If I am a long range build it's a SSRM 6 or SRM 6. (I normally avoid SSRM's if I got no bap or ECM however this mech has 3 er ppc's which can fully disrupt an enemy... so yea.).


On topic of LRM 20. debatable. LRM 20 does more damage than an LRM 15. That's basically all I need for a single LRM launcher. If I had somewhere to put the tonnage I save from downgrading the LRM 20 to a LRM 15 I'm more than welcomed but if I remove your useless SSRM 6 and downgrade your useless LRM 20 for a LRM 15 to get a 4th ER PPC I do not think we get into a better situation for where my mech sits for you. /shrugs.

[Wintersdark]

Nightshade24, on 05 March 2016 - 11:21 PM, said:

Before we continue I just want to make this clear...
... yea not really- The thought of using a Clan XL on the highlander never came across my mind I just never had the problem with the standard 275. The speed is about equal to that of a traditional king crab, atlas, direwolf. etc.
My Mauler also goes that slow and I got no problems with it and my Urbanmech runs even slower.

...

THIS IS WHY YOUR BUILD IS BAD. You haven't thought about it at all. Not because you want to run LRM's, ERPPC's, and SSRM's on one build (people would say it's bad for that too, but I respect that). Your build is bad because it's bad at what it's trying to do, and could do just that better. You're just taking a stock loadout, and it's a very badly made stock loadout (at least, for MWO)

You say the Clan XL "takes too much space" - that too, is ridiculous. It takes 4 slots. But a 325XL can hold THREE more DHS than a 270 STD; so you're actually losing 2 slots chosing to go with the 270. 325XL? 19t. 270STD? 20.5t. The XL is lighter and results in a slot SAVINGS.

Quote

So far so good (at least for me). The mech can easily handle 3 ER PPC's. It can easily handle it like any other ER PPC boat out there. The LRM 20 is good for when you are on a cold
etc...
I know ER PPC's are not the best weapon in game for clans... maybe it's to do wit hthe fact 5 damage is wasted into splash and the Large pulse laser has it's damaged buff to the point that MW: O's large pulse laser does more damage than the ER PPC... crazy!
However it still has the advantage for pinpoint damage and longer range so that's what I like using it for. If I do not want to run ER PPC's on a highlander I got the other ones. Not the end of the world.

Try to keep up. I was specifically showing how you could build that highlander better; not saying you should remove the ERPPC's in favour of LPL's.

LPL's are better weapons right now, flat out, but I can respect using a certain type of build.

Quote

Alright, for you a single SRM 6 is worthless

No, a single SSRM6. It's crap because of it's hugely long cooldown + lock on time - if the mech is just darting by, you can't lock. If it's staying and fighting, you're getting MAYBE two shots with it, max, before your dead.

Quote

Fine by me to each their own. However I think it's quite important for a well ballanced mech and if I ever got a spare missile slot and tons for a build. If my build is closed range it'll be a LRM 20 or 15. If I am a long range build it's a SSRM 6 or SRM 6. (I normally avoid SSRM's if I got no bap or ECM however this mech has 3 er ppc's which can fully disrupt an enemy... so yea.).

I'm a bad light pilot. But the day I lost a brawl with an enemy mech that handles exactly like a Direwolf and had essentially ONE weapon capable of hitting me at all, a single SSRM6 firing 12 spread damage once every SIX SECONDS, if I can't win that fight I'd never get into one again.

Quote

On topic of LRM 20. debatable. LRM 20 does more damage than an LRM 15. That's basically all I need for a single LRM launcher. If I had somewhere to put the tonnage I save from downgrading the LRM 20 to a LRM 15 I'm more than welcomed but if I remove your useless SSRM 6 and downgrade your useless LRM 20 for a LRM 15 to get a 4th ER PPC I do not think we get into a better situation for where my mech sits for you. /shrugs.

What? That last paragraph, I didn't say to do any of that. I certainly didn't say take 4 erppcs.

But, an LRM15 does more useful damage than a 20, because the 20 spreads so much it simply misses with more missiles and of those that hit,

Did you see the build I linked? HGN-IIC-A

It's essentially exactly the same as yours, but it's roughly 20% faster, carries more missiles, can fire MORE erppc shots downrange despite having "only" 2.

Boating ERPPC's is bad. The Warhawk sort of manages it (it's still bad at it) because of quirks, but really more than 2 is quite pointless, and even two is very hot.

When I say, "it's very hot" I'm not arguing whether or not "you can deal with it" - that's stupid. You can "deal" with a weapon that generates 50 heat. The problem is when the weapon generates so much heat that you're able to overtake the cooling by such a degree that firing just two keeps you easily at heat cap, 4 means you've got 12 tons invested in ERPPC's that may as well not be there.

Look, run what you want. But when you decide to cut 10kph speed, a massive amount of torso twist rate, 1.5t, and 2 slots because "the 270 is fine"; you kind of lose any footing in your argument as to why your build isn't terrible.

[Nightshade24]

Wintersdark, on 06 March 2016 - 12:08 AM, said:

...

THIS IS WHY YOUR BUILD IS BAD. You haven't thought about it at all. Not because you want to run LRM's, ERPPC's, and SSRM's on one build (people would say it's bad for that too, but I respect that). Your build is bad because it's bad at what it's trying to do, and could do just that better. You're just taking a stock loadout, and it's a very badly made stock loadout (at least, for MWO)

You say the Clan XL "takes too much space" - that too, is ridiculous. It takes 4 slots. But a 325XL can hold THREE more DHS than a 270 STD; so you're actually losing 2 slots chosing to go with the 270. 325XL? 19t. 270STD? 20.5t. The XL is lighter and results in a slot SAVINGS.

I have thought about my build. I just haven't thought about using an XL engine as I didn't have a reason to. I like to use the Highlander IIC-A for long range engagements and I personally have not a single problem with that. I do not need to alpha strike the ER PPC's non stop so ghost heat isn't a problem. I cycle through the ER PPC's and hammer the enemy with high damage. It's an exceptional sniper. Not saying it's the best sniper of this side of outreach or the best sniper that ever tredded Solaris VII.The LRM 20 is there to compliment me on cold maps and to be a method of indirect fire/ cooler long range fire for medium-hot maps. Sure I could be more competetive if I dropped that LRM 20 for something else but I do not care about that.

I am aware the XL 325 is lighter however I do not have the crit slots to spend the tonnage I saved to make it worth while. I am very contempt with my weapons load out. I could change the missiles around a bit however It is nothing to important. the XL 325 is simply a bad engine for my build of choice. However a better question would be if the 270 is the right choice. I could remove some missile ammo for a standard 275/ 280. Maybe go for twin LRM 15's (as they are more compact than a single LRM 20 and take higher tons per slot) and go for an XL 300 or so. Who knows.

Wintersdark, on 06 March 2016 - 12:08 AM, said:

Try to keep up. I was specifically showing how you could build that highlander better; not saying you should remove the ERPPC's in favour of LPL's.

LPL's are better weapons right now, flat out, but I can respect using a certain type of build.

Didn't mention you were the one trying to force me to use LPL's. But it is a weapon of the same tonnage, similar range profile, similar damage, etc. That's why I brought it up as it is the common "go-to" clan energy weapon.
And thank you o7

Wintersdark, on 06 March 2016 - 12:08 AM, said:

No, a single SSRM6. It's crap because of it's hugely long cooldown + lock on time - if the mech is just darting by, you can't lock. If it's staying and fighting, you're getting MAYBE two shots with it, max, before your dead.

Typically when I am firing on a mech- I got my targeting system locked on ®. Normally when I do that- I normally get a lock naturally just my keeping my weapons on the enemy.
Your example has a bit of merit and I am aware that mechs can sip behind cover and I can lose locks and such and the targets that will stick around as you mentioned will probably be people who want to stay in that fight like a full blown atlas.
However it is still far better choice than using an ER PPC in the same instance. However that isn't why I keep it there. It's just a good cheap (for tons/ ammo) damage dispenser. I am aware it's cooldown is drastically higher over the SRM 6 but it's accuracy is drastically higher. Which is something I need for a mech that doesn't have any lasers to hit pesky fast mechs.

I am aware it isn't really the best option- it would be better if I got dual SRM 6's or what ever. However i got 200 mechs or so. I already got a few highlander IIC's with pairs of SRM6's, I got normal highlanders with pairs of SRM 6's, I got atlases with pairs or more of SRM 6's. I chosed it for viarity and it worked best for the Highlander IIC as unlike an atlas this was a mech I needed it the most. I had times where the SSRM 6 /s was very usefull across the highlander IIC's.

Kinda reminds me of a quote... "If it is stupid but it works. It means it isn't stupid"... however I would be lying if I would say using a pair of streak 2's or 4's wouldn't be a better option... it's tempting.

Wintersdark, on 06 March 2016 - 12:08 AM, said:

I'm a bad light pilot. But the day I lost a brawl with an enemy mech that handles exactly like a Direwolf and had essentially ONE weapon capable of hitting me at all, a single SSRM6 firing 12 spread damage once every SIX SECONDS, if I can't win that fight I'd never get into one again.

Well there's a first for everything because it wasn't a first for me to get a kill with that single SSRM 6. However I must say it isn't only the SSRM 6 firing half the time. I can fire a single ER PPC and maintain relatively heat neutral. The ER PPC is very good at exploiting the holes the SSRM 6 causes.

Wintersdark, on 06 March 2016 - 12:08 AM, said:

What? That last paragraph, I didn't say to do any of that. I certainly didn't say take 4 erppcs.

But, an LRM15 does more useful damage than a 20, because the 20 spreads so much it simply misses with more missiles and of those that hit,

Did you see the build I linked? HGN-IIC-A

It's essentially exactly the same as yours, but it's roughly 20% faster, carries more missiles, can fire MORE erppc shots downrange despite having "only" 2.

Boating ERPPC's is bad. The Warhawk sort of manages it (it's still bad at it) because of quirks, but really more than 2 is quite pointless, and even two is very hot.

When I say, "it's very hot" I'm not arguing whether or not "you can deal with it" - that's stupid. You can "deal" with a weapon that generates 50 heat. The problem is when the weapon generates so much heat that you're able to overtake the cooling by such a degree that firing just two keeps you easily at heat cap, 4 means you've got 12 tons invested in ERPPC's that may as well not be there.

Look, run what you want. But when you decide to cut 10kph speed, a massive amount of torso twist rate, 1.5t, and 2 slots because "the 270 is fine"; you kind of lose any footing in your argument as to why your build isn't terrible.

I am aware you didn't say take 4 ER PPC's. but that is what I would do if I got more It isn't the worst idea, I essentually turn into a slightly upgraded warhawk Prime. It also means I can fire my ER PPC's in pairs and control my heat and damage output a bit better. However I am not interested in that. I already got a warhawk prime, and charlie. I am more interested in the blend of missiles and er ppc's here.


I have saw your Highlander and to be honest I missed the flammers the first time I looked at it. Funny. However if I drop to 2 ppc's I basically got a mirror of my highlander 733p to a degree. Besides that I also do like the 3rd ER PPC quite a bit and have to many dual PPC mechs running around. I want a mech to deal high damage at range in [x] ammount of time for my Highlander IIC-A instead of best DPS of ER PPC's. as I got a lot of DPS ER PPC builds running for my assaults and heavies but not many brute-forced firepower mechs for ER PPC's. (Essentually I do massive damage in say 10 seconds than leave to cool down before engaging again- which works well in co injunction with JJ's as they allow you to enter and leave quickly). It's a bit hard for me to explain what I'm trying to say but It's just I like the high early damage output and wait for this mech instead of a lower damage output but constantly over time (which I already got other mechs doing).

To me personally I commonly use standard engines and XL engines on many mechs... only acception being stalker/ atlas as I got no need to ever use an XL on those.... I treat clans reasonable the same. If standard doesn't give me what I want to achieve than that's where XL's come in. Even though I am very contempt with the advantages and pros of the standard 270 despite the cons however through this rather intense debate I found a engine that satisfies my demands. This HGN-IIC-A gives the highest ammount of heatsinks possible for the weapon load out possible (at 23 heatsinks, with XL 325 it would be 21 heatsinks). It's still faster than the Standard 270 as well by around 8 kph... very minute but every bit kind of counts. I typically never take engines above the rating of 300 with the exception of the banshee nad wolfhound. the XL 300 is just the best engine for all weight classes and thus it is the least likely to be 'wasted' if you want to change your build as another mech or build will require it.

[theta123]

My buddy runs this build. Worked in conjunction with my Mauler MX 90 dual AC20 death bringer

HGN-IIC-A

[Wintersdark]

Nightshade24, on 06 March 2016 - 02:20 AM, said:

I am aware the XL 325 is lighter however I do not have the crit slots to spend the tonnage I saved to make it worth while. I am very contempt with my weapons load out. I could change the missiles around a bit however It is nothing to important. the XL 325 is simply a bad engine for my build of choice. However a better question would be if the 270 is the right choice. I could remove some missile ammo for a standard 275/ 280. Maybe go for twin LRM 15's (as they are more compact than a single LRM 20 and take higher tons per slot) and go for an XL 300 or so. Who knows.

But the lighter XL325 also saves you two more crit slots. It's lighter, it saves you space, it makes you faster and more agile. There are literally no disadvantages for it.

The stock IIC-A and my IIC-A, despite carrying essentially the same loadout, my IIC-A will win 100% of encounters together. 100%. It's faster, more agile, can fire more PPC's (24 DHS vs 20).

Stay close? SSRM12 vs. 6. obvious results.

At range? Despite having "only" 2 ERPPC's, it can fire them (even one at a time) more often. More damage downrange = win.

Larger engine allows it to twist faster, spread damage better = better tanking of incoming damage; faster speed allows it to position better and fully avoid damage better.


Everything else aside, staying with a standard engine on a Highlander IIC is terrible. It's sacrificing crits, tonnage, speed, agility, in return for... Surviving if someone takes off both side torsos? lol. You're literally throwing all that away for nothing.




(My flamer IIC-A wasn't the first, I was monkeying around a bit after and forgot, then just shared the link again after, my bad - stripped one DHS and the TC for 2 flamers)

[Nightshade24]

Wintersdark, on 06 March 2016 - 07:34 AM, said:

But the lighter XL325 also saves you two more crit slots. It's lighter, it saves you space, it makes you faster and more agile. There are literally no disadvantages for it.

The stock IIC-A and my IIC-A, despite carrying essentially the same loadout, my IIC-A will win 100% of encounters together. 100%. It's faster, more agile, can fire more PPC's (24 DHS vs 20).

Stay close? SSRM12 vs. 6. obvious results.

At range? Despite having "only" 2 ERPPC's, it can fire them (even one at a time) more often. More damage downrange = win.

Larger engine allows it to twist faster, spread damage better = better tanking of incoming damage; faster speed allows it to position better and fully avoid damage better.


Everything else aside, staying with a standard engine on a Highlander IIC is terrible. It's sacrificing crits, tonnage, speed, agility, in return for... Surviving if someone takes off both side torsos? lol. You're literally throwing all that away for nothing.




(My flamer IIC-A wasn't the first, I was monkeying around a bit after and forgot, then just shared the link again after, my bad - stripped one DHS and the TC for 2 flamers)

The Standard engine has more advantages than you have stated - it also has no penalties upon a ST destruction thus making it more effective after a ST destruction- useful for a mech with evenly spread weapons. A niche advantage to begin with but works well for when that extra edge is useful. As I mentioned, the speed isn't a problem for me and I want more heat dis. However as stated earlier the XL 300 gives a very tempting bonus of 23 DHS over 20 (STD 270) or 21 (XL 325)

I have to say yes, your Highlander IIC build will most likely take the upper hand in close range combat. More specifically anywhere 0m to 355m However combat beyond this can be very close and seeing your ideas of "rolling damage" and trying to use agility, this is in particular where the playstyle of the tripple ER PPC's have an advantage as they can dish out large damage to a pinpoint area and than roll away for an extended time, meaning your lower damage but higher rate of fire makes it a bit harder for you to counter my strikes.

However this is on paper and theory- it would further be boiled down to specifically the skill of you and I and the circumstances. I would love to experiment this battle into practice. I do fear that nothing but ego will be a result. However I trust this will not occur between us. However my main gripe with this is the factor that the Highlander (at least an ER PPC like one here) is not the 'first choice' for a 1 vs 1. The clan doctrines of zellbrigen does demonstrate this...

LRM's and ER PPC's are often a poor choices. ER PPC's not as much as LRM's but in MW: O where 5 damage is put down the toilet via splash making it less like an energy-gauss and more like a...IS PPC.
SRM's, Large lasers, Medium lasers, Streaks, etc are much more common. To be quite frank with you if I did have the pleasure of doing a zellbrigen I would rather use a traditional 3050 or 3052 mech like a kodiak, mad dog, kitfox, etc..

Kodiak... soon™