42 replies to this topic

[Wing 0]

PGI really needs to go back to the drawing board on this issue. This penalty system needs to be revised. Too much bull **** the system has been causing and its 100% garbage in the way its setup as.

I know I've team killed players before but they were all accidental and I always try avoiding a tk when possible but there are times that you are just unable to and the system really doesn't know how to compensate for situations like that. I had a teammate that caused me to earn a team kill. wasn't my fault the *******'s mech was crit red in the CT when he ran right into me. complete accidental.

Another was when I killed an enemy mech with lasers, and for some reason P.O.S HSR indicated I shot my teammate after and It caused a team kill yet my lasers didn't even touch him from my FOV. when I saw the team damage, it only showed ONE team damage. just one. unfkin believable that this system is causing so much trouble rather than it was ment for. PGI needs to either remove it or fix it.

[Ano]

I've got to say, even in CW I'm struggling to see how it's a massive issue unless an individual on your team has fire control issues (in which case that's a team management issue). I'm no stranger to the odd accidental TK but I've never had more than a 10s penalty so far.

That said, the "forgive" system that some have talked about would be quite a nice thing to have.

[Shadey99]

The easiest thing would be to turn off TK penalties during group play (or just right a simple IF THEN statement that doesn't track TK penalties in group play modes). In a group the group can deal with TK on it's own (and will). PGI doesn't need to intervene.

The whole idea is to get the people in pug play that willfully decide to kill another 'teammate' and need a time out, randomly fire into a melee and kill off their teammates, or who can't shoot straight and so open up when an ally happens to walk in front of them. Basically it's supposed to penalize the guy like the DWF pilot from a match I had this weekend who can't aim and shoots his allied light (me) in the back because he can't seem to aim over my head and not through it. Who btw cost us the game with that since I had the most damage and kills for my team and could possibly have won the match, but I was missing my rear armor and my internals were toast. Oh and Mr. DWF who talked up how I should be more careful? Didn't kill anyone and did sub 100 damage.

[Dee Eight]

The solution on faction drops is if you know you have a penalty coming (and after a TK its obvious you will), well start the penalty clock by trying a quick drop the moment the last CW match ends... then go make a baloney sandwich for whatever time the penalty is. I went pee during a 2 min clock earlier. Ranting and raving like spoiled children is not the solution.

[ChaosK]

Agree with the Forgive Button mentioned being a good option!

Also agree with Team Killing and Damage being double dipping ...

Pure Team Damage is the way to go for me at least with a reasonable threshold that is.
A TK can always be a freak accident even with 1 damage done and should not be penalized harshly.
Doing 200 friendly damage is a different beast all together.

[762 NATO]

Yep, I had my first TK since the patch. It was also my second ever. It was caused by collision damage to a cherry light that was Circle of Death-ing with me against a Black Knight. The single other point of team damage in that match was against me for the collision. Other guy didn't care at all and was laughing about it. I haven't figured out how to put a picture in so if you want it you can email me.

Edited by 762 NATO, 25 March 2016 - 03:02 PM.

[General Solo]

After a week I got my first plenty
10 Seconds (For Disconnect)
Its working as intended

Edited by OZHomerOZ, 25 March 2016 - 04:45 PM.

[Mi Ro Ki]

Fire discipline, such difficulty. Should try it on over 250ms. 1 team damage hasn't earnt me a penalty yet

[Rejarial Galatan]

its just yet another in a long string of bad ideas from russ bullock. opt out of a match? naw, lets just punish ppl for wanting to not play a mode and punish them in the extreme when they find a way to NOT play it.

[Dee Eight]

Don't like it, you know where the doorway to leave is...

[Rejarial Galatan]

Dee Eight, lets see if I am following you correctly: I dont like the idea of being punished for something that isnt my fault, like, say, if I fire off my pair of CUAC10s and the salvo is down range, and YOU walk into my line of fire as that salvo arrives, I should get punished for it coring you? Because YOU walked into the salvo after it was on its way to the enemy you suddenly just had to hug the enemy?

I have a side thought: I think most people just cannot stand it when others on their team survive thanks to either luck or superior tactics and cannot stand that fact.

Edited by Rejarial Galatan, 26 March 2016 - 07:56 PM.

[Dee Eight]

Well if you refuse to pay attention to where your team mates are and think to yourself that maybe... you shouldn't try and fire ultra 10s into a brawl fest from down range... YES...you really should be penalized. For someone who's been playing for 4 years... youre past due to KNOW that by now. I myself had the common sense to know that from day one.... but then maybes its from firing guns among people in the REAL world and knowing there are real consequences to friendly fire.

[Rejarial Galatan]

Dee dee dee.... <clicking derisively> a little lesson in ballistics for you. If I aim my CUAC10's at an enemy whilst I have a CLEAR shot, I lose all control of those rounds once a few things happen. Pay attention now, as you missed this before, and it is my goal to teach you. First thing that happens is a device known as a firing pin will strike a small device called a primer. This causes it to explode. At this moment a larger explosion takes place. This is the rounds primary propellant ignighting, which in turn, causes a very rapid expansion of combustion gasses. This expansion dislodges the projectile from its casing and sends it on its way down the barrel. IF my neurons fire fast enough, I have about 1/1000th of a second at best to change the trajectory, which, according to science is not enough time to process the choice and send the correct physiological response required. It is at this moment the round has completely left the barrel of the weapon in a flash of light and its report, or for you, the sound any fire arm makes when you hear a gun shot. At this exact point, my control over that shot is gone. Physics, God or some other deity is now in the driver seat.
Now, have I lost you? I probably have, so, let me take your preciously precocious hand and point out a few key things, first, the amount of time elapsed between me seeing a clear shot to the salvo of 6 rounds heading down range is 1 to 1.5 SECONDS. Second, the rounds are beyond my control as they are no longer in contact with my mech, the magazine from whence they came, the CUAC10 that sent them. Third, 3-7 seconds later, a convergence is going to occur. A: my rounds arrive on scene, B: you have wandered into my line of fire, C: you now get struck because YOU stepped into the shot, thus shielding the enemy and causing me to damage you.
Now, take note, in my mech, my CUACs are in the cool down phase, meaning, I cannot fire yet. I see my rounds hit you. I laugh at your stupidly selfish act to hump the enemy mech.
Total time elapsed? 3-7 SECONDS.
Now, Dee, please, tell me how it is my fault or my responsibility for you walking into my shot AFTER my shot is on its way. It would be like telling a sniper making a shot of a mile or more he is responsible for a person he did not intend to get shot getting shot AFTER his round is underway and they got in the way in the intervening seconds between round departure and arrival.

Now, should I fire AGAIN whilst you give our lovely enemy his lap dance, then yes, my fault, but, not that first one as you came in after the shot began.

We call this check mate dear. Try again.

[Ircza]

In all of my matches i have NEVER triggered a TK penalty system. I managed to do it in the last match where i purposefully killed my teammate because we were testing a bug out. Then i got 10 seconds. Nothing special. Sometimes i hit a teammate in the shoulder or leg with my lasers if i or he position the mech like an idiot, but still no penalty trigger.

I think it works really well.

[m2wester]

I don't get the whining. Yes, friendly fire happens. No, double punishment for a team kill is at least unusual. 10 s isn't really punishing, and if you regularly get more than 1 strike in a session, you are doing something wrong.

[Jalthibuster]

To Dee Eight and all the other guys who still think this system is sane: My point of making this thread was and still is that it's complete nonsense that a whole premade group (including the person who tk'ed as well as the person who got tk'ed! and even the, up to ten, innocent bystanders) gets taken into collective custody.
Therefore I suggest a forgiveness system or removing the penalty if it happens between members of a premade. (Keep the C-Bill penalty but the rest really needs to go!)

[Dee Eight]

Rejarial Galatan, on 27 March 2016 - 02:26 AM, said:

Dee dee dee.... <clicking derisively> a little lesson in ballistics for you. If I aim my CUAC10's at an enemy whilst I have a CLEAR shot, I lose all control of those rounds once a few things happen

And clearly you didn't grasp the meaning of my statement of...

firing guns among people in the REAL world and knowing there are real consequences to friendly fire.

before trying to act like a mr know it all explaining to someone who knows about shooting at people in the real world... how guns work and the consequences of the decision of pulling the trigger each and every time. Its a good thing your experience is confined to a video game console because you wouldn't last very long in the real world with that attitude.

[General Solo]

Rejarial Galatan, on 26 March 2016 - 07:20 PM, said:

......I dont like the idea of being punished for something that isnt my fault .......

If you team damage a team mate it is your fault

Lack of situational awareness is no excuse

This change was long over due
thx PGI

[SirHitman]

I got my first penalty today to. 10 seconds so not much worth mentioning but i guess it stacks if something more happens? I heard you can get 30 minutes for excessive teamdamage. A simple punish/forgive system should be easy to implement.

I expect that if you actually rejoin the battle after a crash (and participating) you dont get punished. This is the thing i got punished for, my PC crashed loading the map so i was 5 minutes late to the battle, the battle continued for another 3-4 minutes and me doing 400 damage with a few kills.

[Dee Eight]

To rack up the 30 min penalty you have to kill four teammates in 4 hours of real world time. For those who complain they got the TK doing a single point of damage... that's a load of manure... oh sure 1 point to the right critical spot led to the death (ammo explosion probably) but I don't buy the likelihood that you fired a 1 point damage weapon at the time. More likely you fired a whole cluster of weapons and the game only made a record of 1 point because once a mech dies they ghost and everything else passed through... Had their not been that 1 point critical hit... then maybe the teammate wouldn't have died...maybe more would have been recorded for team damage with a TK still... but it still doesn't excuse it being your fault.