41 replies to this topic

[Bishop Steiner]

Though I run it like a bastardized 3C.
RFL-3N


Thing is, it's Quirks make it a very good AC10 carrier. And I have always felt AC10s to be criminally underrated. (Their sustainable damage vs PPC on heavier units is fantastic.) So it's kind of like peas and carrots for me.

Torso Yaw: 120 °
AC/5 COOLDOWN: 5.00 %
BALLISTIC COOLDOWN: 20.00 %
BALLISTIC VELOCITY: 40.00 %
ENERGY RANGE: 10.00 %
ACCELERATION RATE: 50.00 %
DECELERATION RATE: 50.00 %
TORSO TURN RATE (YAW): 45.00 %
TURN RATE: 35.00 %

With modules and fast fire (37% cooldown), that's a fresh cap to pop every 1.5 seconds. for a very sustainable heat load, unless I get too free with the laser. With the Vel Buff, that's 1330 m/s which isn't Gauss territory by any means but it makes almost any shot out to 700-800 yds pretty easy, unless facing fast Lights.

While it has no Structure Buffs, it is very agile for it's size, and slapping a 280 into it makes it more than mobile enough to compensate and to spread damage decently. Yes, it's a Glass Cannon, but it's one with enough mobility to survive most times.

Laughably, it ends up making a better RFL-3C than the actual 3C does. (Though the 3C Quirks overall fit the Lore design accurately, being a little tougher than the 3N. But the toughness doesn't replace being able to kill stuff faster.)

Have actually managed to outduel several TimberWolf and Black Knight builds tonight because they would hit their heat cap so fast, and I could just focus fire to one torso or the other, while staying nice and chilly.

Funnily enough, I find this mech far easier to stay alive and do decent damage in than any of the Archers.... a Mech that is supposed to carry twice as much armor. But has far worse hitboxes.

Maybe it's my Medium Mech Jock mentality. I'm used to being out gunned, out-armored and outmaneuvered by almost everything on the battlefield, and so to me, this mech does indeed run like a big Medium. But a Big Medium with 2 rapid fire BFGs strapped to the arms.

Further proof that Good, Bad or Ugly, it's how a mech fits an individual that really matters. I am by no means pronouncing the RFL good. But it feels good to me.

I'm actually having more fun it it than all my more anticipated Marauders, Warhammers and Archers. Now I'm seriously considering upgrading to the Collectors for it. (Guess I should have grabbed that instead of the Legend Killer, which TBH, has not clicked with me)

Go figure, right?

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 21 March 2016 - 01:27 AM.

[jss78]

Yup, AC/10's really come alive for me with some decent quirks. They're usually kind of tough to use out to their maximum effective range, but a good velocity quirk really helps that.

They also pair really well with ML's.

[Hit the Deck]

I guess it's similar to your HBK-4G in a way, no wonder you like it!

[DovisKhan]

I'll probably get it for next month since there's no other mech coming and I'll want those 30 more days of premium time that are attached to the bundle.


That said it's probably the only one so far that i'm considering also getting the hero add-on


The quirks are crazy good, + some structure and one of very few mechs that can use an Lb-X, and that's pretty unique

LASER DURATION: -10.00 %
LB 10-X COOLDOWN: 10.00 %
BALLISTIC COOLDOWN: 15.00 %
LB 10-X SPREAD: -10.00 %
ENERGY COOLDOWN: 10.00 %
ENERGY HEAT GENERATION: -5.00 %
ADDITIONAL STRUCTURE (CT): 10.00
ADDITIONAL STRUCTURE (LT): 7.00
ADDITIONAL STRUCTURE (RT): 7.00
ADDITIONAL STRUCTURE (LA): 5.00
ADDITIONAL STRUCTURE (RA): 5.00
ADDITIONAL STRUCTURE (LL): 7.00
ADDITIONAL STRUCTURE (RL): 7.00

Edited by DovisKhan, 21 March 2016 - 01:42 AM.

[Hit the Deck]

DovisKhan, on 21 March 2016 - 01:39 AM, said:

The quirks are crazy good, + some structure and one of very few mechs that can use an Lb-X, and that's pretty unique

What if they change the quirks in the future?

[Bud Crue]

I run my Firebrand with the same build but can manage a std engine. That's part of my problem with the Riflleman, most of the builds I have come up with are already being carried on other mechs of similar weights (5 tons) and so not sure what to do with it. Frankly, I have the same problem (at least for the moment) with the Archers. Ah the difficulties of too much choice. I am sure somehow I will make do.

[Bishop Steiner]

DovisKhan, on 21 March 2016 - 01:39 AM, said:

I'll probably get it for next month since there's no other mech coming and I'll want those 30 more days of premium time that are attached to the bundle.


That said it's probably the only one so far that i'm considering also getting the hero add-on


The quirks are crazy good, + some structure and one of very few mechs that can use an Lb-X, and that's pretty unique

LASER DURATION: -10.00 %
LB 10-X COOLDOWN: 10.00 %
BALLISTIC COOLDOWN: 15.00 %
LB 10-X SPREAD: -10.00 %
ENERGY COOLDOWN: 10.00 %
ENERGY HEAT GENERATION: -5.00 %
ADDITIONAL STRUCTURE (CT): 10.00
ADDITIONAL STRUCTURE (LT): 7.00
ADDITIONAL STRUCTURE (RT): 7.00
ADDITIONAL STRUCTURE (LA): 5.00
ADDITIONAL STRUCTURE (RA): 5.00
ADDITIONAL STRUCTURE (LL): 7.00
ADDITIONAL STRUCTURE (RL): 7.00

Just be careful, buy a mech based on the quirks alone, and it tends to come back to haunt. My knock on the LK is that to be effective one tends to need higher level of cooldown than the LK has, IMO.

Biggest thing though, is very similar to the Tempest. The Structure quirks are pretty modest, and it comes at the expense of ANY agility quirks. Without those, I don't feel the structure quirks amount to enough to matter. For me anyhow, the big thing with some of the other RFL models is that agility really allows you to track fast mechs, and to peek, poke and get out of jams.

It MIGHT work for your play style. That's the big unknown...none of us know what works for you. Just putting it out there as something to consider.

[Bishop Steiner]

Bud Crue, on 21 March 2016 - 01:52 AM, said:

I run my Firebrand with the same build but can manage a std engine. That's part of my problem with the Riflleman, most of the builds I have come up with are already being carried on other mechs of similar weights (5 tons) and so not sure what to do with it. Frankly, I have the same problem (at least for the moment) with the Archers. Ah the difficulties of too much choice. I am sure somehow I will make do.

Fire brand has 20% ballistic cooldown and 40% velocity boost for em?

Also, I find the RFL shields it's STs a lot easier than the jager. Also, if you're running a STD engine, it's a 250-255std with my loadout. Which leaves you at 67 kph after tweak to my 81,
FIREBRAND
And with half the accel/decel, etc.

Structure's better, for sure, but it's better to avoid being hit than to be able to "take a hit", IMO.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 21 March 2016 - 02:32 AM.

[DovisKhan]

Bishop Steiner, on 21 March 2016 - 02:25 AM, said:

Just be careful, buy a mech based on the quirks alone, and it tends to come back to haunt. My knock on the LK is that to be effective one tends to need higher level of cooldown than the LK has, IMO.

Biggest thing though, is very similar to the Tempest. The Structure quirks are pretty modest, and it comes at the expense of ANY agility quirks. Without those, I don't feel the structure quirks amount to enough to matter. For me anyhow, the big thing with some of the other RFL models is that agility really allows you to track fast mechs, and to peek, poke and get out of jams.

It MIGHT work for your play style. That's the big unknown...none of us know what works for you. Just putting it out there as something to consider.

fair point if it's sluggish at turning then i would pass


42% lbx cooldown reduction post mastery/module is enticing though

[Bishop Steiner]

DovisKhan, on 21 March 2016 - 02:40 AM, said:

fair point if it's sluggish at turning then i would pass


42% lbx cooldown reduction post mastery/module is enticing though

I'd rather stick to the CN9-D for that. 57% cooldown, and a much faster mech, which IMO is vital to using LB-X well, since outside 300 meters, their spread makes them iffy. But whichever way you choose, let us know what works for you.

[Bishop Steiner]

Hit the Deck, on 21 March 2016 - 01:35 AM, said:

I guess it's similar to your HBK-4G in a way, no wonder you like it!

I believe you are correct, sir. Even moves at the same speed, I believe. I can tank a little more in the HBK, but can hit at greater range with the RFL, so it kinda evens out.

[Roughneck Cobra]

It is good, I enjoy mine, but it is just 60 Tons of break into pieces versus a Bounty Hunter, I'll stick to that when it comes to value for money! (Plus my BH II doesnt need an XL!)

[Bud Crue]

Bishop Steiner, on 21 March 2016 - 02:31 AM, said:

Fire brand has 20% ballistic cooldown and 40% velocity boost for em?

Also, I find the RFL shields it's STs a lot easier than the jager. Also, if you're running a STD engine, it's a 250-255std with my loadout. Which leaves you at 67 kph after tweak to my 81,
FIREBRAND
And with half the accel/decel, etc.

Structure's better, for sure, but it's better to avoid being hit than to be able to "take a hit", IMO.

I admit that the quirks make a compelling case, but I'll live with the Jagger for now just for the extra survival-ability of the std (btw, compared to your posted build above I run mine with only 4 tons of ammo and the legs shaved a bit, lets me run a std 270, so moving at 72kph with speed tweek).

I also note that if we are just looking at quirks (yes I have to gouge out my eyes to ignore the VAST superiority of the Rifleman's hardpoint locations) its hard to argue with a Quickdraw IV-4 with its 30% cooldown and 25% velocity bonus for something closer to par with your Rifleman proposal. That said, the hardpoint locations of the Rifleman does make it a better build. I run a 2 ac10 IV-4 with an XL and which includes the 2 ML, and a version with a std engine but which drops the lasers...both perform REALLY well in later waves on CW hot maps.

My fear is that I will try the Rifleman, like it better, and then have no idea what to do with my IV-4s (I'm serious...I love my IV-4s!) Its hard enough to make a viable build with them, let alone to make one that has become one of my favorite mechs, only to have this "new" upstart ruin their function! Damn hardpoint creep.

[Bishop Steiner]

Bud Crue, on 21 March 2016 - 07:41 AM, said:

I admit that the quirks make a compelling case, but I'll live with the Jagger for now just for the extra survival-ability of the std (btw, compared to your posted build above I run mine with only 4 tons of ammo and the legs shaved a bit, lets me run a std 270, so moving at 72kph with speed tweek).

I also note that if we are just looking at quirks (yes I have to gouge out my eyes to ignore the VAST superiority of the Rifleman's hardpoint locations) its hard to argue with a Quickdraw IV-4 with its 30% cooldown and 25% velocity bonus for something closer to par with your Rifleman proposal. That said, the hardpoint locations of the Rifleman does make it a better build. I run a 2 ac10 IV-4 with an XL and which includes the 2 ML, and a version with a std engine but which drops the lasers...both perform REALLY well in later waves on CW hot maps.

My fear is that I will try the Rifleman, like it better, and then have no idea what to do with my IV-4s (I'm serious...I love my IV-4s!) Its hard enough to make a viable build with them, let alone to make one that has become one of my favorite mechs, only to have this "new" upstart ruin their function! Damn hardpoint creep.

yeah, never clocked with my IV-4 so it don't hurt my feelings. Maybe after the rescale I'll try Quickies again.

Been thinking about going all "Shotgun Sally" on it with a 255xl, 2 JJ, 2xLB-X, 2x MPL and 4 tons ammo, just to do something different.
IV-FOUR

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 21 March 2016 - 11:01 AM.

[Bud Crue]

Yep that works too. I call mine "The Hobo".

[Bishop Steiner]

Bud Crue, on 21 March 2016 - 12:23 PM, said:

Yep that works too. I call mine "The Hobo".

Hobo with a Shotgun. Nice!

[Cy Mitchell]

It is such a pleasure reading a thread where a player takes a Mech and finds a way to make it work for him instead of the normal threads where players are whining about how bad a Mech is.

Not every Mech has to be "Tier 1" to become a formidable weapon in the hands of the right pilot.

Thanks for the informative thread

[C E Dwyer]

Bud Crue, on 21 March 2016 - 01:52 AM, said:

I run my Firebrand with the same build but can manage a std engine. That's part of my problem with the Riflleman, most of the builds I have come up with are already being carried on other mechs of similar weights (5 tons) and so not sure what to do with it. Frankly, I have the same problem (at least for the moment) with the Archers. Ah the difficulties of too much choice. I am sure somehow I will make do.

its MWO system, the Rifleman had more armour than the Jager in lore, and I guess when the Jager came out, none expected ever to see the rifleman in game

[Volthorne]

Bishop Steiner, on 21 March 2016 - 01:21 AM, said:

Have actually managed to outduel several TimberWolf and Black Knight builds tonight because they would hit their heat cap so fast, and I could just focus fire to one torso or the other, while staying nice and chilly.

Oh man, I do the same thing my my 3N. Feels great watching a tryhard eat dirt. But, even though twin 10s was SUPER tempting, I use the stock AC/5s - chain fire 'em and the hurt just doesn't stop (the "get f*cked" train has no brakes!). Pretty much the only thing that can out-shoot you is an Assault, and even then it can be down to the wire.

[Bishop Steiner]

Rampage, on 21 March 2016 - 12:37 PM, said:

It is such a pleasure reading a thread where a player takes a Mech and finds a way to make it work for him instead of the normal threads where players are whining about how bad a Mech is.

Not every Mech has to be "Tier 1" to become a formidable weapon in the hands of the right pilot.

Thanks for the informative thread

It's a fine balance. Some mechs are genuinely bad, overall. Yes a few people can make them work, but if 99% of people can't make the Trebuchet effective, the 1% who can don't really make it a "good" chassis. It's more about something in said chassis clicking with their playstyle.

That said, I do prefer to find workable builds. My underlying rule though is it has to be in the "spirit" of the original design. If I have to turn an Archer into a laserboat to make it "work" then it's a failed, bad design because the Archer is supposed to be a Missile Machine, specifically Long Range missiles, and in the 3025 and 3050 TROs was pretty much the best in the business at it, for the Inner Sphere.

And I totally admit, it's me holding my Warhammers back, not the other way around. But I refuse to make them int Quad Ballistic Nipple stump arms, or bland vanilla Laser Vomit, just to "redeem" the purchase. A Warhammer without PPCs in the arms, and spewing laser vomit, is a Flashman, or Grasshopper or Black Knight... NOT a Warhammer.

It's one thing to see the occasional "off the reservation" build running around. But when the vast majority in no way resemble their actual design.... it says PGI failed somewhere (usually multiple somewheres, starting with how arms work, lack of sized hardpoints, not assigning quirks to the hardpoint instead of the chassis, etc).

And that's sad. At no point is it "good" for the game when it' saturated with chassis all running variables of the same build.