1049 replies to this topic

[Imperius]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 11 April 2016 - 04:31 PM, said:

Meta also oft depends on quirks, among other things that can't be derived from just mechlab. Sure there is some mechs have less chance than others, but not everything is easy to tell like the BK vs Grasshopper debate ages ago.

Oh yes so lets just relase the gutter trash mechs that need MEGA quirks to sell "looks at Archer" because that is a sound reasont to add garbarge to the game.

Bishop keeps harping on BALANCE yet quirks are the biggest issue in the world of balance for this game making it extremely convoluted and creating basically tech 2 weapons for some mechs one quirk at a time.

[Bishop Steiner]

1453 R, on 11 April 2016 - 04:38 PM, said:

Solo is a great place for learning how to deal with random nonsensical tomfoolery that would never happen in a tightly-controlled, generally predictable tournament-style fight. It's kinda refreshing, honestly. Especially down here in Idiot Tier where people still do bizarre crazy things all the time.

I'm half a shaved hair from T3...I'm really gonna miss this mosh pit when I manage to break the threshold...

Anyways. Any clue how many of the heat sinks are locked on the Nova Cat, Bishop? A read on the Prime configuration offa Sarna lists 39 tons of equipment - fifteen heat sinks over the standard 10 and twenty-four tons of guns. if that's the pod space count on the Nova Cat...well hell, the Nova Cat may outdo the Night Gyr after all in terms of raw rawrgh, though I can't imagine none of those extra fifteen are hardlocked. Nor can I recall how much tonnage on the base chassis would be sunk into maximizing armor MWO-style.

Either way. Neither machine will wrench me from the cockpit of my Soon™ to be Viper, or my beloved Li'l Susan when I'm in the mood for heavies. Heh, there's just something sweet about that 90kph Clan heavy mark...no amount of dual Gauss-ing on the Night Gyr is going to make up for assault 'Mech level mobility. Ick.

Hmm...wonder what cheeky name I should hang on whatever poor Viper fit ends up my favorite...

only 11 total locked, so none outside the engine. One of it's strong points.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Imperius, on 11 April 2016 - 04:40 PM, said:

Oh yes so lets just relase the gutter trash mechs that need MEGA quirks to sell "looks at Archer" because that is a sound reasont to add garbarge to the game.

So we shouldn't release IS mechs at all because they rely on quirks to be competitive?

Imperius, on 11 April 2016 - 04:40 PM, said:

Bishop keeps harping on BALANCE yet quirks are the biggest issue in the world of balance for this game making it extremely convoluted and creating basically tech 2 weapons for some mechs one quirk at a time.

You realize he dislikes quirks being used for tech balance as well right? Just because that is the way PGI has chosen doesn't mean we should just stop asking for any mech that may or may not need quirks to be useful.

Edited by Quicksilver Kalasa, 11 April 2016 - 04:44 PM.

[Imperius]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 11 April 2016 - 04:43 PM, said:

So we shouldn't release IS mechs at all because they rely on quirks to be competitive?


You realize he dislikes quirks being used for tech balance as well right? Just because that is the way PGI has chosen doesn't mean we should just stop asking for any mech that may or may not need quirks to be useful.

For someone who cries about balance so often it's just funny it's his go 2 to save gutter trash mechs.

Edited by Imperius, 11 April 2016 - 04:48 PM.

[Pariah Devalis]

1453 R, on 11 April 2016 - 04:52 PM, said:

Well then. Thirty-eight tons of pod space, minus whatever amount required to max its armor. That's...considerable. ES over FF works well within the structure of MWO, and means the thing has enough crit space to use those thirty-eight tons. Yeah...that's just a bit ridiculous. Heh, better hope Night Gyr fans get their money's worth soon after release, I could see this becoming the go-to Clan heavy for Gunbaggers. Hardpoints depending, of course.

I know that if we had both, I'd probably not leave either. One for Dakka, one for everything else. Plus, let's face it, the Nova Cat is just dead sexy. Too bad it is out of the timeline slice we're in.

[80sGlamRockSensation David Bowie]

I'm only poking in here to say :


The Madcat MK_II would be far more successful than any alternative single pack mech they are planning.

Also, the Nova cat > Night Gyr.

That is all. Try to keep the name calling to a minimum there TT diehards.

[Imperius]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 11 April 2016 - 04:55 PM, said:

That's generally WHY people cry about balance, because their bad mechs are bad.....

So doesn't not adding gutter trash mechs solve another problem other than wasted effort because mediocre sales?

[Afuldan McKronik]

Nova Cat would be better... As a CJF that pains me to say.

But the Pirahna would be hilarious to run too. That many C-MG chewing threw some back fat armor and getting to the chocolate flavored internals wouldnt take long.

[1453 R]

80sGlamRockSensation David Bowie, on 11 April 2016 - 04:58 PM, said:

I'm only poking in here to say :


The Madcat MK_II would be far more successful than any alternative single pack mech they are planning.

Also, the Nova cat > Night Gyr.

That is all. Try to keep the name calling to a minimum there TT diehards.

The former is not in question. The problem is that Piranha has not yet releas the DLR-1T DeLorean yet, and thusly cannot jump forward in time ten years to pull the thing out of The Future. Currently the game is set in 3053; most of those 'opposing' the mad Cat Mk. II are not doing so because they feel it would be a bad 'Mech, an unpopular 'Mech, or because Imperius is [REDACTED].

We're doing it because when Piranha finally skips ahead in the timeline, we want them to do it for realzies. Not some half-assed garbage where they pull a few MW4 chassis in minus any FutureTech weapons or systems, throw them out there, and say "Huzzah, we're in 3058 now. have fun!"

We want MRMs, rotary autocannons, light/heavy gauss rifles, X-pulse lasers, ATMs, heavy lasers, light autocannons, light and snub PPCs, Bloodhound probes, Angel ECM, superchargers. Funky stuff like Bombast lasers and Thunderbolt missiles. Laser AMS. All of it. We want a time jump to have some meat behind it, so Piranha can bring in some of the crazy FutureTech 'Mechs that rely on these technologies. To do all of that though, they need time to finish Phase 3, probably time to get their engine upgrade sorted, and then time to figure out how in the world to implement and balance all these lovely new toys.

Imperius does not give a single fat flying ferret fart about any of that. He doesn't care about anything at all, whatsoever, beyond getting the damned Mk. II as quickly as he can, whether or not it's good for the game, or even whether or not it sabotages everyone else's chances of getting their favorites in because jumping the gun on the Mk. II short-circuits Piranha's FutureTech plans and ends up short-changing things like the Blood Asp, Nova Cat, or other longstanding community Future Favorites.

Me, personally? I liked the Mk. II back in the MW4 days, had a lot of fun on it. My opinion of it has soured of late due to Certain Parties, but I have no issues with it being introduced. I have issues with it being introduced incorrectly and robbing the rest of us of Cool Freaking Stuff we may yet be able to look forward to.

Which, in turn, is why we're likely getting the Night Gyr and not the Nova Cat. The Nova Cat is a 3059 machine, and many of its better variants rely heavily on FutureTech. It'd be a painful stretch to force it in right now, and the 'Mech would lose a great deal in the downgrading it'd have to endure.

'Sides. Who knows - the Night Gyr is pretty slick too for Gunbagger pilots. Why not give it its time in the sun?

[CK16]

Ok I have been working on school projects all day and I still have some HW today, this thread really blew up....wowser....

Guys I think we can put the Mad Cat Mk II and Nova Cat in the hopeful catagory but unlikely for the next 3.

Night Gyr will be a can opener guys, it will do daka better then the Timber Wolf by far lasers it will be ok.

Also please stop with this whole this mech is garbage or this mech is garbage. I think the only mechs I will let this slip with are the Linebacker and Blacklanner

[Pariah Devalis]

CK16, on 11 April 2016 - 05:18 PM, said:

Ok I have been working on school projects all day and I still have some HW today, this thread really blew up....wowser....

Guys I think we can put the Mad Cat Mk II and Nova Cat in the hopeful catagory but unlikely for the next 3.

Night Gyr will be a can opener guys, it will do daka better then the Timber Wolf by far lasers it will be ok.

Also please stop with this whole this mech is garbage or this mech is garbage. I think the only mechs I will let this slip with are the Linebacker and Blacklanner

Can we include the Crossbow, too? (But it would be a pretty piece of garbage!)

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Imperius, on 11 April 2016 - 05:05 PM, said:

So doesn't not adding gutter trash mechs solve another problem other than wasted effort because mediocre sales?

Not really, again, what makes a mech good could not be defined until the mech gets modeled. It's not all about the mechlab.

Edited by Quicksilver Kalasa, 11 April 2016 - 05:22 PM.

[CK16]

Pariah Devalis, on 11 April 2016 - 05:21 PM, said:

Can we include the Crossbow, too? (But it would be a pretty piece of garbage!)

Ok sure we can throw that on that list!

[Afuldan McKronik]

CK16, on 11 April 2016 - 05:18 PM, said:

Ok I have been working on school projects all day and I still have some HW today, this thread really blew up....wowser....

Guys I think we can put the Mad Cat Mk II and Nova Cat in the hopeful catagory but unlikely for the next 3.

Night Gyr will be a can opener guys, it will do daka better then the Timber Wolf by far lasers it will be ok.

Also please stop with this whole this mech is garbage or this mech is garbage. I think the only mechs I will let this slip with are the Linebacker and Blacklanner

Sarna the Lumberjack I believe. Chainsaw mech. Note that it has been pushed into combat by rebels.

[Imperius]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 11 April 2016 - 05:21 PM, said:

Not really, again, what makes a mech good could not be defined until the mech gets modeled. It's not all about the mechlab.

See: The Archer

[1453 R]

CK16, on 11 April 2016 - 05:18 PM, said:

Ok I have been working on school projects all day and I still have some HW today, this thread really blew up....wowser....

Guys I think we can put the Mad Cat Mk II and Nova Cat in the hopeful catagory but unlikely for the next 3.

Night Gyr will be a can opener guys, it will do daka better then the Timber Wolf by far lasers it will be ok.

Also please stop with this whole this mech is garbage or this mech is garbage. I think the only mechs I will let this slip with are the Linebacker and Blacklanner

NEVERZ. I wantz mez myz fastz fattiez!

...srsly tho. The Lanner would be intriguing, at 119 kph stock, with M.A.S.C. to boot. That's light 'Mech territory but with double the armor/structure of a light 'Mech. I have no idea if it'd actually be good, but it's a machine that does something nothing else in the game does. The Grendel comes close, but those lost ten tons result in a lot of lost durability.

The Linebacker...I'm not actually sure even Clan laser vomit can save it. 97kph on a 65-tonner is a lot less impressive/unusual than 119kph on a 55-tonner. I like me my faster-than-they-should-be 'Mechs, but I just don't think the Linebacker is fast enough for everything else it sacrifices to get there.

[Imperius]

1453 R, on 11 April 2016 - 05:18 PM, said:

The former is not in question. The problem is that Piranha has not yet releas the DLR-1T DeLorean yet, and thusly cannot jump forward in time ten years to pull the thing out of The Future. Currently the game is set in 3053; most of those 'opposing' the mad Cat Mk. II are not doing so because they feel it would be a bad 'Mech, an unpopular 'Mech, or because Imperius is [REDACTED].

We're doing it because when Piranha finally skips ahead in the timeline, we want them to do it for realzies. Not some half-assed garbage where they pull a few MW4 chassis in minus any FutureTech weapons or systems, throw them out there, and say "Huzzah, we're in 3058 now. have fun!"

We want MRMs, rotary autocannons, light/heavy gauss rifles, X-pulse lasers, ATMs, heavy lasers, light autocannons, light and snub PPCs, Bloodhound probes, Angel ECM, superchargers. Funky stuff like Bombast lasers and Thunderbolt missiles. Laser AMS. All of it. We want a time jump to have some meat behind it, so Piranha can bring in some of the crazy FutureTech 'Mechs that rely on these technologies. To do all of that though, they need time to finish Phase 3, probably time to get their engine upgrade sorted, and then time to figure out how in the world to implement and balance all these lovely new toys.

Imperius does not give a single fat flying ferret fart about any of that. He doesn't care about anything at all, whatsoever, beyond getting the damned Mk. II as quickly as he can, whether or not it's good for the game, or even whether or not it sabotages everyone else's chances of getting their favorites in because jumping the gun on the Mk. II short-circuits Piranha's FutureTech plans and ends up short-changing things like the Blood Asp, Nova Cat, or other longstanding community Future Favorites.

Me, personally? I liked the Mk. II back in the MW4 days, had a lot of fun on it. My opinion of it has soured of late due to Certain Parties, but I have no issues with it being introduced. I have issues with it being introduced incorrectly and robbing the rest of us of Cool Freaking Stuff we may yet be able to look forward to.

Which, in turn, is why we're likely getting the Night Gyr and not the Nova Cat. The Nova Cat is a 3059 machine, and many of its better variants rely heavily on FutureTech. It'd be a painful stretch to force it in right now, and the 'Mech would lose a great deal in the downgrading it'd have to endure.

'Sides. Who knows - the Night Gyr is pretty slick too for Gunbagger pilots. Why not give it its time in the sun?

It doesn't stop tech 2 from coming... that is another strawman...

Where were you when Kodiak 3 was released...

[Metus regem]

Pariah Devalis, on 11 April 2016 - 05:21 PM, said:

Can we include the Crossbow, too? (But it would be a pretty piece of garbage!)

Don't for get the Battle Cobra.....

[Afuldan McKronik]

Remember, Black Knight was decried as DOA.

[Y E O N N E]

Afuldan McKronik, on 11 April 2016 - 05:32 PM, said:

Remember, Black Knight was decried as DOA.

It was DoA until they re-quirked it.