10 replies to this topic

[razenWing]

For some reason, people tend to believe that wearing the same unit tag and/or form group privately... maybe cozy up over TS/Gamevox/others make you tier 1 veterans automatically.

So I want to play with people around my tier, I need to go to quick play, where people can't really be organized.

I want to play with my friends and try strategies, but we get rolled in group queue.

Like, is it THAT hard to implement a tier-ing system in group play as well? I want to play with friends AND play against people around the same skill level. It's not a farfetched concept. We shouldn't have to choose one over the other.

(Hence, already made thread in features and suggestions about the group tiering and pilot tier retention)

So to recap, just because Bob and I decide to play together don't automatically make us THAT much more kick@ss than Jenny and Brittany, who might be both tier 1 in individual skill. It's not fun to be rolled over and over again by Jenny and Brittany when individually they are both 4 tiers higher than us.

In summary and to make this simple:

Bob + razen =/= Jenny + Brittany

NOT THE SAME

[Col Jaime Wolf]

this isnt the mechwarrior game you are looking for (waves hand slowly)

[Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood]

There is tiering in group queue.

The game gets an average PSR of each team and tries to match them as best as they can.

The other team might have much better organization though with some of their most tactical players leading and calling targets for the team to focus on.

Even still if you get a team that happens to have a lance of tier 1 guys who also are all playing very coordinated and keeping in a tight pack there isn't much the enemy team can do if they aren't more organized and able to quickly eliminate that threat.

I've seen some comp tier units in group queue before go through a match in under a minute with just a 4 man team doing the majority of the work.

[Wintersdark]

Dakota1000, on 10 April 2016 - 09:40 PM, said:

There is tiering in group queue.

The game gets an average PSR of each team and tries to match them as best as they can.

The other team might have much better organization though with some of their most tactical players leading and calling targets for the team to focus on.

Even still if you get a team that happens to have a lance of tier 1 guys who also are all playing very coordinated and keeping in a tight pack there isn't much the enemy team can do if they aren't more organized and able to quickly eliminate that threat.

I've seen some comp tier units in group queue before go through a match in under a minute with just a 4 man team doing the majority of the work.

This is true, but:

Populations in the solo queue are good enough during major play times to get largely single tier matches. During major play times. During off hours, +/- 1 tier, and even +/- 2 tiers happens.

That's in the solo queue, which sees 80% of the players.

The group queue NEVER has enough players to get good tier based matchmaking. Add to that the difficulty inherent in the tetris game the matchmaker has to play to get teams that fit together: Say you're a group of 9. That means, for you to have a match, you have to be matched with a group of 3. There's no other options. If there's only one group of 3 searching for a match, it's going to be matched with you even if their average is 2 tiers away from your average (individual players could be any tier).

So, it's not about how easy or hard it is from a coding standpoint, it's simply impossible. There just aren't enough players.

So, when you're playing group queue, you get what you get.

[Kotzi]

Equip as many Lasers as you can and fill it up with Heatsinks. That will make you Tier 2 instantly in skills, at least. Regarding Matchmaker, she is a female dog.

Edited by Kotzi, 10 April 2016 - 10:33 PM.

[Fang01]

On principle I'd like to get rolled by Jenny and Brittney...

[razenWing]

Wintersdark, on 10 April 2016 - 10:18 PM, said:

This is true, but:

Populations in the solo queue are good enough during major play times to get largely single tier matches. During major play times. During off hours, +/- 1 tier, and even +/- 2 tiers happens.

That's in the solo queue, which sees 80% of the players.

The group queue NEVER has enough players to get good tier based matchmaking. Add to that the difficulty inherent in the tetris game the matchmaker has to play to get teams that fit together: Say you're a group of 9. That means, for you to have a match, you have to be matched with a group of 3. There's no other options. If there's only one group of 3 searching for a match, it's going to be matched with you even if their average is 2 tiers away from your average (individual players could be any tier).

So, it's not about how easy or hard it is from a coding standpoint, it's simply impossible. There just aren't enough players.

So, when you're playing group queue, you get what you get.

Really? I get the impression that this is not the case. Maybe you are right with the population for why I can't perceive this. Because it's frustrating to see like 4 kcom or MS or whatever other top units when individually and knowing some of the people you are grouping are just tier 5.

(That's not to say all KCOM, MS, and other top units are all tier 1, but at least they seem to play at much higher capacity)

[Nyte Kitsune]

Sadly grouping may or may not help in matches, either Quick Play or CW. I do however prefer to drop as a lance with guys from my unit as at least that means we are working together, If we can get everyone else to work with us, great, if not, its better than balling up with the rest of the pugs which seems to be common practice with many pugs. Mind I do solo drop as well if no one from the unit is available.

[Druarc]

It's a fast way to learn, when I started I grouped with friends, I was happy if I got assist and 100+ damage

[Wintersdark]

razenWing, on 11 April 2016 - 12:10 AM, said:

Really? I get the impression that this is not the case. Maybe you are right with the population for why I can't perceive this. Because it's frustrating to see like 4 kcom or MS or whatever other top units when individually and knowing some of the people you are grouping are just tier 5.

(That's not to say all KCOM, MS, and other top units are all tier 1, but at least they seem to play at much higher capacity)

Huh? That's what I said. PSR Matchmaking works in the solo queue, but with reduced populations doesn't work in the group queue.

Edit: This isnt a flaw of PSR, it's simply a logistical reality.

It tries to match group average PSR's but simply can't in a lot of instances. It uses group average PSR ONLY, so yeah T1's can play with T5's even if everything is working well. But the group queue may not have hard caps, I'm not positive. It supposedly does (again using group average not individual) but I would be unsurprised to learn it would eventually just match anyone in order to make matches happen.

As I said above, the Tetris game means that particularly for certain group sizes it's very difficult to build a match, requiring specific other group sizes to make things happen.

Since the introduction of the group queue, I've recommended allowing solo players to "opt in" to fill spots in the group queue as well as solo, as this would take a lot of that load off the matchmaker.

For example, see my group of 9 above. Currently, it REQUIRES a 3 man group to make a match. What if there's only 1 three man group in the queue, and it's many tiers away? Or what if there are none?

With a few (not a lot would) solos opting in, the MM could grab a solo and a 2 man as well: much more likely to not only make a match in the first place, but to make an appropriately tiered one.

Edited by Wintersdark, 11 April 2016 - 12:33 AM.

[Triordinant]

Fang01, on 10 April 2016 - 10:35 PM, said:

On principle I'd like to get rolled by Jenny and Brittney...