57 replies to this topic

[Trauglodyte]

I'm disappointed by the redaction of names. 0/10

[SmoothCriminal]

And then PUGs [sometimes] get shamed for not joining one of these illustrious factions...

[Kei Nogareru]

Narcissistic Martyr, on 15 April 2016 - 10:33 AM, said:

Of course not. That's why you chuck them in the river and let the water do the deed for you. Less mess.

You should rename yourself Sadistic Murder

[LegendaryArticuno]

Without names there is no context.
Without context there is no purpose.
Next time don't be so cowardly.

[Johnny Z]

Ori Disciple, on 15 April 2016 - 12:07 PM, said:

This is why I personally steer clear of clans/units/guild/whatever. Almost always drama.

Yes true but its not by nature. Some actually join guilds to eventually break them up and cause drama. Its to be expected actually. Knowing that is the first thing anyone trying to make a guild should know. The guys causing this are extremely good at it to. Usually its tactics like just passively aggressively starting a fight or many other mostly passive tactics.

This is the main reason the larger the guild the more trouble it is. More alts got in, competition from other guilds etc.

Some take it really seriously and this will be ignored probly but its not worth it. Just play your own game is the best way, really. Guilds are just an interesting but hollow idea. Sounds fun but not any more than just being cool and not having to put a brand on friends........ extra dots for emphasis.

This is why I am all for factions because its a neutral way to make teams. Legit players are for this to but some who really do want to be drama queens or worse like they don't want teams they cant control... these guys want only guilds which are basically worthless to creating good game play...

Basically there is nothing wrong with guilds but quite literally scum(definition: those that think ruining everything and everyone will make their garbage better.) will try to use them as greifing tools to just ruin the fun for others. For a variety of reasons, none of them good.

Edited by Johnny Z, 15 April 2016 - 04:26 PM.

[A Bag Full of Puppies]

LegendaryArticuno, on 15 April 2016 - 03:47 PM, said:

Without names there is no context.
Without context there is no purpose.
Next time don't be so cowardly.

Not cowardly and I explain why i redact the names.

If you want to continue the cycle of hate and shaming, thats on you.

For those who know the situation or can identify with it, I just hope it resonates and people make changes. Our community is too small to not try and reinforce what we have.

Edited by A Bag Full of Puppies, 15 April 2016 - 04:21 PM.

[Zordicron]

oldradagast, on 15 April 2016 - 03:11 PM, said:

There are a frightening number of people out there for whom being right is all that matters. They are the types who will actively not fix problems or help others because it is more important to dance around like a bratty toddler shrieking, "haha, you suck! I told you so!" than it is to do anything useful in life. They infest all aspects of life, from government, religion, businesses both big and small, and even among one's personal circle of friends and family, I know a few in my group who will actively disagree with anything anyone says just to pick a fight; if you said "the sky is blue," they'd launch into an argument about why, under certain conditions, it is not, just to "prove" that they are right. Even board games, table-top, etc. degenerates into endless arguments because the fighting and "being right" is all that matters.

Such people can be intolerable in the long-run, and this type of behavior is usually just the more obvious aspect of an overall childish and immature personality. Anyway, I understand how you feel - good luck.

What you describe is the actions of someone that never progressed past the maturity level of a 12/13 year old. I am an "old man" in terms of gamers, and I will tell you this: I do not have any friends like that. I did, when I was but a lad in high school, because that's how life works at that age. But those days are long gone.

Trying to find a group of people on a game, and an internet one at that, that have matured past that stage of life is nigh impossible, and gets harder still the bigger the group of people gets.

The only units to keep that kind of crappy behavior out are the ones where the leadership are super involved and purposed at that very thing. A rare situation indeed.

[Ted Wayz]

Aetes Nakatomi, on 15 April 2016 - 11:19 AM, said:

Got billions in assets on on my characters but even six years on I can't even contemplate logging into that game.

Same here. Over 20 billion in assets but EvE just became so un-fun. Hopefully No Man's Sky will fill my space jones.

Ran a guild of over 300 in an Alliance of over 1100 in Warhammer Online. Made it clear that guild would train players in tiers 1-3 but if they wanted to be competitive in Tier 4 that was what the rest of the Alliance was for. Worked out well because we were clear what our motive was and we stuck with it. And the Alliance let players find what they wanted (PvP, PvE, competitive or chill) without having to leave the group.

So an alliance system would be nice.

[Deathlike]

All I can say this...

Whenever you are consider joining a unit, you kinda want to experience what to expect day to day when you show up... otherwise you're setting your expectations all wrong.

While you can't really predict ultimately how a unit will end up 6 months from now (let alone 12), stability is the most important thing to take note of... sometimes, it's the only thing you can bet on.

Also, you have to be able to respect those at the top of the food chain... even if you disagree. You have to be able to see eye to eye on the majority of things... unless you expect some sort of unlikely result.

I wish I could be more helpful, but that's the best advice I can give you.

[A Bag Full of Puppies]

Deathlike, on 15 April 2016 - 05:04 PM, said:

All I can say this...

Whenever you are consider joining a unit, you kinda want to experience what to expect day to day when you show up... otherwise you're setting your expectations all wrong.

While you can't really predict ultimately how a unit will end up 6 months from now (let alone 12), stability is the most important thing to take note of... sometimes, it's the only thing you can bet on.

Also, you have to be able to respect those at the top of the food chain... even if you disagree. You have to be able to see eye to eye on the majority of things... unless you expect some sort of unlikely result.

I wish I could be more helpful, but that's the best advice I can give you.

So if your saying, "look for a place where you can have you way often enough that you can live with the times when you can't have your way." I would agree with this.

A unit will needs the majority of players to recognize that the should be contributing something along with what the expect to get out of it. That "something" may vary unit to unit, player to player, but it needs to be defined to some degree so that as new members come on, they will know the "house rules" as they come in. If they can't abide, don't waste theirs or your time.

As a side note, this old units handbook said we should act like a family...

...perhaps some in the unit envisioned the brady bunch while others were looking for the kardashians.

We can't control what happens in units beyond our own actions, so my point is that we need to be mindful of what we do as it can come back to haunt us.

[Deathlike]

A Bag Full of Puppies, on 15 April 2016 - 05:24 PM, said:

So if your saying, "look for a place where you can have you way often enough that you can live with the times when you can't have your way." I would agree with this.

That's not what I'm saying.

Basically the question is... "Can I coexist with the unit in the long term?"

If these are the kinds of people you wouldn't want to hang out with in real life, then that unit is probably not for you.

It's not that complicated.

[Nyte Kitsune]

OP's statement reminds me of a group I played Champions Online with (Superhero MMO). We were, past tense, the largest "Super Group", confirmed by Cryptic at the time, called the "Dark Enforcers", we had well over 1000 members split between 7 Different SG's (Dark Enforcers, Dark Enforcers Elites, Etc.). Due to our leader wanting to focus on PvP we started a downward spiral, as many prefered PVE, eventually our "Leader" tired of the lack of interest in PvP and switched to PvP console titles (Halo, CoD, etc.), sadly the Dark Enforcers collapsed in Champions after that. Went from the largest SG to almost nothing with fewer than 16 active members after 3 months, a year later we disbanded entirely.

Conflicts will happen, but its best, except in extreme cases, to just buck up and ignore some people. Now, in MWO, I've gotten lucky, the unit I joined has been good, we've had a few obstacles, the major one was a large breakaway that went to go play clans (Ghost Bear I believe), and a few got big heads and were asked to leave, though I wasn't present when that happened, I was between PCs at the time, glad I missed the drama, though I miss some of the pilots that left us.

All-in-all this is a great unit, and yes, I'll name our unit, just because, they're just a great bunch, HHoD! Mind battled a lot of great players from other units and houses. I especially like when they compliment us on a good defence or attack strategy, which we tend to do the same even if its just a simple "GG", which I only use if I mean it. Find yourselves a good unit that meshes with you, Doesn't matter if you're Davion, Steiner, Marik, Liao, FRR, or Draco's... Fine.. or Clanners, there's a unit out there for you somewhere, but be careful on who you join,if you see suspicious behavior such as a potential hacker team, best not to stick around, report them if you can confirm it, and move on.

[Narcissistic Martyr]

Kei Nogareru, on 15 April 2016 - 03:27 PM, said:

You should rename yourself Sadistic Murder

It was taken... besides you can't spell slaughter without laughter.

[oldradagast]

Zordicron, on 15 April 2016 - 04:23 PM, said:

What you describe is the actions of someone that never progressed past the maturity level of a 12/13 year old. I am an "old man" in terms of gamers, and I will tell you this: I do not have any friends like that. I did, when I was but a lad in high school, because that's how life works at that age. But those days are long gone.

Trying to find a group of people on a game, and an internet one at that, that have matured past that stage of life is nigh impossible, and gets harder still the bigger the group of people gets.

Yep. Sadly, these days finding people without some staggering level of immaturity is nigh impossible. The behavior I describe is just one of the most obvious signs of trouble since it'll be the first to show up, often. Nobody is perfect, but these days, you just have to wonder at some people. Ugh.

Edited by oldradagast, 15 April 2016 - 06:49 PM.

[TLBFestus]

+1 to you OP.

I've been gaming on PC since THE EIGHTIES, and have been gaming online when you did so through a dial-up modem. In that time I have belonged to exactly 2 clubs.

My original club, nod to Old Men Online, had a lot of good people in it. Still does, but I moved on when I realized I was looking for something that the majority there wasn't.

Now for the past 11 years (OMG! 11 years?) I've belonged to TLB, The Lazy B@st@rds. When I first joing TLB they were big into BF1942 and had several competitive teams that did quite well. They hosted a couple of private servers back in the day when you actually rented a machine, installed your own software and could control the entire game, and those servers were very popular.

Internet gaming has evolved, some might say devolved, since then but the primary overall principle of TLB has always been "Just play the d@mn Game", and we've stuck to it.

Our competitive side has atrophied, mostly because our members have got older (and somewhat more mature) and got tired of the constant chest-thumping, epeen and braggado that seems to come with it. We realized that it's hard to enjoy a good, hard fought game when you are dealing with emotionally immature or stunted people that appear all too frequently when "competition" becomes the name of the game.

We choose to enjoy ourselves, and don't sweat the details too much. Even in this game, this fantastically eSport minded game, all too often you find people having a damned aneurism because we lost. IT'S A GAME, get over it. Easily enough said, because I know that I do this for fun, for relaxation and a break from my real world issues. I truly feel sorry for those whose sense of self is so stunted that they need to find validation via a game.

I miss the "old" days where, much like playing in the real world, people expected sportsmanship to be manditory.

[Wintersdark]

TLBFestus, on 15 April 2016 - 08:04 PM, said:

+1 to you OP.

I've been gaming on PC since THE EIGHTIES, and have been gaming online when you did so through a dial-up modem. In that time I have belonged to exactly 2 clubs.

My original club, nod to Old Men Online, had a lot of good people in it. Still does, but I moved on when I realized I was looking for something that the majority there wasn't.

Now for the past 11 years (OMG! 11 years?) I've belonged to TLB, The Lazy B@st@rds. When I first joing TLB they were big into BF1942 and had several competitive teams that did quite well. They hosted a couple of private servers back in the day when you actually rented a machine, installed your own software and could control the entire game, and those servers were very popular.

Internet gaming has evolved, some might say devolved, since then but the primary overall principle of TLB has always been "Just play the d@mn Game", and we've stuck to it.

Our competitive side has atrophied, mostly because our members have got older (and somewhat more mature) and got tired of the constant chest-thumping, epeen and braggado that seems to come with it. We realized that it's hard to enjoy a good, hard fought game when you are dealing with emotionally immature or stunted people that appear all too frequently when "competition" becomes the name of the game.

We choose to enjoy ourselves, and don't sweat the details too much. Even in this game, this fantastically eSport minded game, all too often you find people having a damned aneurism because we lost. IT'S A GAME, get over it. Easily enough said, because I know that I do this for fun, for relaxation and a break from my real world issues. I truly feel sorry for those whose sense of self is so stunted that they need to find validation via a game.

I miss the "old" days where, much like playing in the real world, people expected sportsmanship to be manditory.

I desperately wish I could like this more than once.

This is a major issue I have with most units, on a personal level. I'm an old, tired gamer (apparently, of the same age range) who still loves his gaming but just can not stand all of the above issues.

I'm a bit of an odd duck now, as I hold sportsmanship absolutely paramount and (while I suppose unfairly) I expect it of everyone I drop with too. As most units tend towards heavy membership in their 20's, this means that's often a pipe dream. Sportsmanship isn't much of a thing anymore, unfortunately

[Novakaine]

TLBFestus, on 15 April 2016 - 08:04 PM, said:

+1 to you OP.

I've been gaming on PC since THE EIGHTIES, and have been gaming online when you did so through a dial-up modem. In that time I have belonged to exactly 2 clubs.

My original club, nod to Old Men Online, had a lot of good people in it. Still does, but I moved on when I realized I was looking for something that the majority there wasn't.

Now for the past 11 years (OMG! 11 years?) I've belonged to TLB, The Lazy B@st@rds. When I first joing TLB they were big into BF1942 and had several competitive teams that did quite well. They hosted a couple of private servers back in the day when you actually rented a machine, installed your own software and could control the entire game, and those servers were very popular.

Internet gaming has evolved, some might say devolved, since then but the primary overall principle of TLB has always been "Just play the d@mn Game", and we've stuck to it.

Our competitive side has atrophied, mostly because our members have got older (and somewhat more mature) and got tired of the constant chest-thumping, epeen and braggado that seems to come with it. We realized that it's hard to enjoy a good, hard fought game when you are dealing with emotionally immature or stunted people that appear all too frequently when "competition" becomes the name of the game.

We choose to enjoy ourselves, and don't sweat the details too much. Even in this game, this fantastically eSport minded game, all too often you find people having a damned aneurism because we lost. IT'S A GAME, get over it. Easily enough said, because I know that I do this for fun, for relaxation and a break from my real world issues. I truly feel sorry for those whose sense of self is so stunted that they need to find validation via a game.

I miss the "old" days where, much like playing in the real world, people expected sportsmanship to be manditory.

Yep I'm a Ancient One as my grandson would say.
People were a more civil back then, I think we appreciated not having to drive across town just to play with friends.
Yes there was always that "one" in every group.
But generally people were more civil.
Now every perceived slight is brought instantly to the fore.
Everyone loves an audience I guess.

[Wintersdark]

Novakaine, on 15 April 2016 - 11:09 PM, said:

Yep I'm a Ancient One as my grandson would say.
People were a more civil back then, I think we appreciated not having to drive across town just to play with friends.
Yes there was always that "one" in every group.
But generally people were more civil.
Now every perceived slight is brought instantly to the fore.
Everyone loves an audience I guess.

That loving connection screech will always live fondly in my memories. BBSes, Fidonet, scoffing at how ridiculous that whole "World Wide Web" thing was and how it'd never catch on... *sighs*

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Alistair Winter, on 15 April 2016 - 10:20 AM, said:

With that out of the way... I will now be taking bets on what unit he's talking about.

havent been paying attention to units for better than a year. PM it to me lol

Novakaine, on 15 April 2016 - 11:09 PM, said:

Yep I'm a Ancient One as my grandson would say.
People were a more civil back then, I think we appreciated not having to drive across town just to play with friends.
Yes there was always that "one" in every group.
But generally people were more civil.
Now every perceived slight is brought instantly to the fore.
Everyone loves an audience I guess.

My lifeline stretches to BEFORE there were even modems at all.

[EvilCatEars]

oldradagast, on 15 April 2016 - 03:11 PM, said:

There are a frightening number of people out there for whom being right is all that matters. They are the types who will actively not fix problems or help others because it is more important to dance around like a bratty toddler shrieking, "haha, you suck! I told you so!" than it is to do anything useful in life. They infest all aspects of life, from government, religion, businesses both big and small, and even among one's personal circle of friends and family, I know a few in my group who will actively disagree with anything anyone says just to pick a fight; if you said "the sky is blue," they'd launch into an argument about why, under certain conditions, it is not, just to "prove" that they are right. Even board games, table-top, etc. degenerates into endless arguments because the fighting and "being right" is all that matters.

Such people can be intolerable in the long-run, and this type of behavior is usually just the more obvious aspect of an overall childish and immature personality. Anyway, I understand how you feel - good luck.

Zordicron, on 15 April 2016 - 04:23 PM, said:

What you describe is the actions of someone that never progressed past the maturity level of a 12/13 year old. I am an "old man" in terms of gamers, and I will tell you this: I do not have any friends like that. I did, when I was but a lad in high school, because that's how life works at that age. But those days are long gone.

Trying to find a group of people on a game, and an internet one at that, that have matured past that stage of life is nigh impossible, and gets harder still the bigger the group of people gets.

The only units to keep that kind of crappy behavior out are the ones where the leadership are super involved and purposed at that very thing. A rare situation indeed.

Those evil people acting like 12-13 years old (maybe even actually being 12-13 years old) forcing the guilds to disband. Chasing 40-50+ years old, mature people away. On top of that, they are smart too! How dare they?!
Are that the points you two are trying to make here? If its true, then its either quite sad or actually pretty funny (depending on ones point of view).

Edited by EvilCatEars, 16 April 2016 - 02:21 AM.