24 replies to this topic

[Odd Thomas]

The 2 builds under consideration:

1) King Crab- 4 X UAC5 + 3 ML (for use during jam and for lights)

2) Banshee- 3 X AC5 + 2 LPL
Banshee- 3 X AC5 + 4 MPL


How do they compare? One more effective/durable?

Thanks

Edited by Odd Thomas, 20 April 2016 - 12:27 PM.

[Aethermech]

Having played the KGC with just about every ballistic setup I can tell you a few things. One it's lots of fun to toss potatoes at people. Two you can switch the uac5 and the ac5 with each other and nothing really changes other than one shoots faster but jams, the other is constant. As far as durability I haven't run a banshee yet but I have noticed people tend to single out the KGC really fast and hammer on them til they die. Lrm's abuse the KGC a bit to. Everything from top down is CT except the little shoulder parts that mount the missles/lasers. I like ac5 more than the uac5. But if you like higher bursts the uac5 will do better. Missles/lasers serve the same role on all but the 0000. If you go with ML instead of MPL you can mount ams. Depending on upgrades you can stack lots of ammo or enough ammo. And if you go with an xle you can cut your weight down pretty good but gain risk. I'm not sure if the KGC is still in the trial mech but if it is I'd say play that one for a bit and see what you think. I think it mounts 4xuac5 and 3mpl.

Edited by Aethermech, 20 April 2016 - 10:12 AM.

[AmazingOnionMan]

The main difference between a King Crab and a Banshee is that the Banshee is generally a bit more well-rounded and has a slightly higher estimated life expectancy. The King Crab will be focused down the instant it is spotted (unless you're in a lurmcrab, in which case you'll be able to put out a few volleys before a Jenner or another light devil cores you out from behind).
A ballistic King Crab that is allowed to waddle into a good position is however worth an entire lance in itself.

[Sky Hawk]

Forumwarriors could help you more, if you had said something about your favored playstyle or showed your planned Smurfy builds from those two Mechs..

But, in short: Banshee is faster and have higher ballistic hardpoints.. and King Crab looks better..

[Odd Thomas]

Appreciate all the replies.
Didn't comment on playstyle as I'm looking to become more versatile. Have been brawling mostly till now.
Was looking for a hybrid of sorts or mid/long range, based on players feedback

I did, however want dakka involved.

Thanks

Edited by Odd Thomas, 20 April 2016 - 11:11 AM.

[Ingga Raokai]

I dabled around the BNC a few months ago, and they are ok i suppose. It will have the arms as the shield because toros weapons.
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...9d9ef80e435254c

I feel like KGC is more reliable, ofc that is personal preference.
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...a115f53b0996c56


And like said above, BNC with AC5 for stability, or KGC with UAC5 for more dakka.

Now, with solo pug q, KGC, you want to be a bit more aggresive, otherwise, you willo left behind or your teammates way too passive because seeing an assault not moving. (at least the way I do). In team drop, it might be slightly different because of better coordination, but generally, KGC in any queue play similar.

I'm not sure with BNC but I'll try it again.


Just remember, one is lighter and tall, and the other one is heavier and wide. (although it is only 5t differ)

Edited by Ingga Raokai, 20 April 2016 - 07:47 PM.

[Rear Admiral Tier 6]

both are good,banshee plays like a big medium,zoidberg is more of a traditional assault in the role department.

[TheLuc]

The Banshee is a durable Mech but I kinda feel its a bit boring to play, the King Crab while having lots armor the fact it will be focused negate that factor, on the other hand it has more options and overall more fun to play.

here is a suggestion for the Banshee 3E
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...9bb5ef1bdcf3999

and here is for the King Crab
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...1e7eb49d50290fb

[Dee Eight]

Armor differences are minor... its 5 tons of mech mass seperating them. That amounts to only about 20 points of extra armor capability. Both are at the low end of the scale for quirks. Banshee's get nothing but weapon quirks but they're better percentages than the KCG gets. The bonus armor on the KCG arms doesn't justify them as automatically better to me given the size of the CT hit box.

People know KCG's for the AC/20s but only one variant suits them at all. The 0000 doesn't have any ballistic quirks at all but has 4 missile hardpoints with a 15% cooldown. I myself would run it with SRM6 w/artemis, reduce the AC size to LB-10Xs since you can group without ghost penalty, they've reduced the spread on them, they shoot way further and they shoot 1.5 seconds faster. The 000B get a mere 5% ball cooldown but includes artemis and dbl heatsinks with better energy quirks. That's the one I'd run LRMs with, and AC2/5's on and MPL for the close in final weapons. The -000 is the only one I'd keep the AC20s on as its quirked specifically for them. With the two that have FF armor, I'd pay the c-bills to switch to standard armor and use the crit spaces for endo steel instead. I know many mechs have FF because the lore has them that way, but on assaults especially you're getting less usable tonnage from FF than Endo Steel. Thank god all my Kodiaks will come with Endo already, otherwise I'd be using my pre-order c-bills bonus to convert them all.

Banshee's are mostly oriented around energy weapons and virtually all of them its torso weapon hardpoints only, so that limits AC sizes if you love XL engines. Of the four BNC's, the 3S has the most energy hardpoints but is quirked mostly towards medium lasers. The 3E has AC5 favoured quirks but with all 4 ballistic hardpoints in the right torso you are limited to just a pair of them. You could use a couple AC2s with them and setup a nice alternating dakka rate. The 3M is also oriented around a large medium laser battery, and the hero mech is basically a 30 ton heavier Thunderbolt SE. Same energy/Large pulse quirks but with the added bonus of a nice AC10 ballistic quirk. I see a lot of players go for like 5 LPLs on them but myself I'd just run 3 (since you can only group fire 3 without ghost heat) with an AC10 (which will shoot further for less heat). Both weapons get 20% extra range, but the AC starts out 85 meters better in optimal range.

Edited by Dee Eight, 24 April 2016 - 08:48 AM.

[Kimberm1911]

Obviously you should buy both. However, they are vary dissimilar. I think your first choice should depend on what you want play style wise. Ask yourself what you already like to pilot, and then go from there.

The Banshee is my personal favorite mech. (To play with, I'm a bit of a snob when it comes to mech art, and the banshee disappoints me.) The best banshee variant is the 3m, at least in the current meta. There isn't much that can laser vomit as efficiently as that beast can, and the amount of punishment it can take is absurd. However, it is very ugly......... that's really its only downside (Besides the typical assault downsides; being slow, typically being focused down, getting left on the frontlines to die while your cowardly team hides 200 meters behind you etc. etc.). The Banshee 3e is still pretty good, but it gets outclassed by the Mauler and King crab in terms of dakka potential. It's saving grace is that it has better hardpoint placement and shields then the king crab, and has back up weapons and can dead-side unlike the Mauler. The Banshee 3s is a fun mech. Most people say it's the worst banshee, because it is, but it's super fun to play around with. 3lpl high mounted with AC/20, check, 5 LPL with a deadside that can zombie with a lpl laser, check, 6 mpl with AC/20, check. It's only downside is its small engine cap, but................ I never found that a problem. ON to DE KING CRABBY!!

The King crab is a bit more like what a "traditional" assault should feel like. Whereas the banshee sits at 450 meters and melts everything under its furious gaze, the king crab "waddles" into the fray unleashing hell with its dual AC/20's, while tanking like a boss and making the atlas pilots green with envy cause they don't have dual AC/20. The only downside to the King Crab is that you'll run the same build on all variants, and it won't be dual AC/ 20's.......... Quad UAC 5 is where it's at with the king crab.

Anyways, you can't go wrong with either. Unless you're looking for meta, in which case the Banshee is the best option.

[Captain Alt F4]

I run both mechs, I love both mechs... but in different ways.

The King crab I use for mid-long range engagements - either the 4 UAC5 build mentioned, or Twin Gauss & PPC, or Twin Gauss/ 3ERLL. The gauss builds pack a punch. I run my PPC version with an XL 350. This makes the beast, fast, manerverable and more heat efficient. It also gives it an XL so don't take too much fire on your ST's.

The Banshee I use either the 3M with LPL's/ML or the 3E with 3AC5's 2LPLs. These are the long end of short to mid range direct fire setups - about 200 m close than the KGC, and can brawl when you close.

Remember each setup has a max total effective range. That is the range at which primary weapons to max damage. That is the range try and operate at. so the UAC build is 600m, the Gauss/PPC is 540, the LPL on the Banshee is 400 odd.

I don't use the banshee for straight up brawling, instead I use the atlas for brawling.

Edited by Captain Alt F4, 28 April 2016 - 07:36 PM.

[theta123]

Its very difficult to compare both mechs, i would say= Get both.

[Tordin]

I like to use this setup, even in FW. It confuses, staggers and supress foes at at least two ranges. Added BAP so you have some heads-up against someone shutting down to suprise you. A bit situational, still.
Also could add two large pulse lasers and two medium lasers instead of 4 mpls with some tweaking.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...50a7ac9054d95db

Could also maybe shave of some more armor to get another half ton for another case, remove BAP, put ammo in arms and have the cases in side torsos.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...31a1a4e77f78a8c

The King Crab is also a great mech, but you better be more aware of your environment and as opposite of the Banshee, if you lose the arms you bett have some good backup weapons in the torsos.

Edited by Tordin, 01 May 2016 - 03:44 AM.

[Odd Thomas]

Thanks for all the useful info..
So far tried the KC with 4 X UAC5 and some ML. Damage done over matches range from 800+ down to 100+.
Slow, must keep moving ( luck plays a role in where you choose to move), hard to keep up with others, lights hunt you down, need longer face exposure to do significant damage (as opposed to a 70-80 alpha Atlas)... Luck of the map,, heavy reliance on team member play & their mech builds as I plod along... find myself abandoned fairly often....maybe bad placement choices on my part..

I like the Dakka, ...will practice... then try Banshee.

Edited by Odd Thomas, 03 May 2016 - 03:43 PM.

[jss78]

That sounds like the champion build of the King Crab. I tried it when it was available as a Trial mech, and it's really nice as a pug mech (with all the usual caveats as far as piloting a 54 kph mech in solo queue). UAC/5's are just a nice weapon, just the right range profile to be useful in most circumstances. They're especially nice when you have four of them (so it's unlikely all will jam at the same time...).

There's little i'd change with the loadout, although I might try running 2xAC/5 (4 ton ammo) + 2xUAC/5 (6 ton ammo) for more damage potential and less jamming.

[TheLuc]

I have Both, The Banshee doesn't get focused as much but good players knows its a threat so lets say its close to a second choice to put it down. All in all the Banshee 3E is great fun, put 3X AC5 on there and the rate of fire is really good and in close quarter combat players tend to back up as soon as they can giving extra shots.

Here is a suggestion
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...cae8bb02a0e6d36

so 3X AC5, a PPC for those long range shots and 2 med Lasers as backup, at 40% cooling its easy to manage and almost full armor.

The King Crab, 4X AC5 on chain fire is really scary, its really loads of fun to play especially in close quarters, like I wrote before the king Crab tends to get focused but the armor and just the raw firepower gives time to put down lots of damage before getting disabled. It may get focused more than average but the King Crab is really there to give some hurt and tons of it. Durable, really depends on situation.

Here is my Suggestion for the KGC,
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...3e46a62fafe9d9f

So 4X AC5s to put to sleep the opposition, 2 med lasers plus a SRM4 as backup and a LRM5 for targets of opportunity. at 36% cooling is really reasonable and if you don't alpha you will be able to fire none stop...ouch.

seriously get both, start with the one the most easy on the pocket if you have to, forget about the Ultra AC5, its an over rated weapon. The regular AC5 is lighter, cheaper, doesn't jam and doesn't heat up as quickly as the Ultra version.

Edited by TheLuc, 03 May 2016 - 10:31 PM.

[CrimsonSteele]

I'd say banshee. I have some exp in assaults and tried the kingcrab as a trail and it attracts to much attention
Here's a build.

[smurfy]http://mwo.smurfy-ne...801b70238d19e03[/smurfy]

Note that this is just speculation. I have no exp in piloting a banshee. Do with this build as you will.

[Karl the Plumber]

One thing I'm surprised no one mentioned yet: a very significant difference (for me) is weapon convergence. The Banshee puts all the ACs and therefore all the AC shots in the same place. With the KC you have your ACs in your arms, so you do have to think about convergence of fire. This also makes the BNC more capable when corner poking.
It can make or break your experience with the mech (depending on your playstyle).

[Rock Roller]

It seems that in a couple of weeks with the mech rescale and quirk review (with scale) you might want to wait before making a choice. Everything above may be subject to change. I am in the same boat as you and looking at another assault now. Currently I chose poorly and got a Victor. Fun mech but very behind the curve right now. But in for a penny in for a pound; just finished mastering it. Want to make sure my next Assault is competitive next month.

[hordes1ayer2]

Both have there perks but i would go banshee. i have also been looking into this and i have seen that the banshee is better because of higher mounted weapons and you can hit the light lil ******* that come to core you from behind