30 replies to this topic

[Kdogg788]

In the few scouting matches I've played, I've come to believe that the major imbalance in scouting is not IS vs. clans but attack vs. defense. It is way too easy for attackers to win the match by just passing into the square as time expires. The mode does not give enough time to locate the signal, relocate to the target grid, and eliminate the entire enemy team before the ship escapes. As defender I've seen that it's rare that the attackers are wiped out before this happens, and some defending wins occur because the attacking team are not actually in that area. I would propose extending the leave time if defenders are within that area and/or there is fighting taking place directly below the dropship. An auto-extract for the attackers at the close of the timer is poor design IMO.

-k

[pwnface]

Agreed.

It's piss poor design to let attackers run onto the extraction site at the last second and escape when there are defenders sitting on the extraction zone.

Attackers should only be allowed to extract from an extraction point if there are more attackers than defenders standing in the extraction zone.

[Conreg]

Until we can kill the dropship... which would be epic...

The extraction zone could be much larger and function identical to the way Domination mode works.

In range - Check

Clear - Not if an enemy is in the zone OR if damage to escaping mechs in the zone is occuring

Extracting - Count down could be as little as 20 seconds, as much as 40? Maybe 1 min would be too much?

Anyway... that is my idea, so I naturally like it a lot.

[Helsbane]

Yep, yesterday I even attempted to body block an Arctic Cheetah with my Cent, but he warped through me and the enemy team won at the last second. But hey, at least there were zero bugs found in phase three testing, right?




.....




Right?!?

[Murphy7]

I think attackers camping the defense zone being a hard counter is too strong.

I posted this initially in another thread, Conreg, but I would like to see the enemy dropship have a health bar, such that the defending mechs could fire at it and "convince the dropship pilot" that the LZ is too hot and abandon the scout mechs to their fate.

I also think that once the dropship has come on map, it should be on the minimap for all. Attackers have the heads up to know where the dropship will be, but everyone should know from the map when and where the dropship is once it has arrived.

[Kuritaclan]

Conreg, on 25 April 2016 - 08:58 AM, said:

Until we can kill the dropship... which would be epic...

The extraction zone could be much larger and function identical to the way Domination mode works.

In range - Check

Clear - Not if an enemy is in the zone OR if damage to escaping mechs in the zone is occuring

Extracting - Count down could be as little as 20 seconds, as much as 40? Maybe 1 min would be too much?

Anyway... that is my idea, so I naturally like it a lot.

This would actually make the game mode only into another skirmish. Since Defenders would always try denie the dropship zone by default up untill non is left or the intel gatherer.

[Cy Mitchell]

Murphy7, on 25 April 2016 - 09:12 AM, said:

I also think that once the dropship has come on map, it should be on the minimap for all. Attackers have the heads up to know where the dropship will be, but everyone should know from the map when and where the dropship is once it has arrived.

I do not agree with this. Perhaps if a defender is within radar range and has LOS then it should show up on the radar screen for all his team but there is no reason why it should be visible to everyone IMO. I would be OK with increasing the size of the smoke plum like they did the Long Tom to make it slightly more obvious where the extraction zone is.

Kuritaclan, on 25 April 2016 - 09:25 AM, said:

This would actually make the game mode only into another skirmish. Since Defenders would always try denie the dropship zone by default up untill non is left or the intel gatherer.

Agreed. The one thing that 4v4 Scouting has going for it is that it is different from every other game mode. We must resist changes that will erode that uniqeness and turn it into just another variation of skirmish.

Edited by Rampage, 25 April 2016 - 09:30 AM.

[Dawnstealer]

Maybe "stand in the circle for five seconds?" Or actually have an animation of the dropship arm lowering, grabbing the mech, and lifting it - the mech targetable right up until it's inside the dropship?

[Stoneblade]

Have the Dropship Land and the mechs have to get inside it.

[Kdogg788]

At minimum the attackers should have to have a numbers advantage on the defenders in order to extract. Just running into the square and calling it a win is way too easy and a bit non-nonsensical. The drop zone location notifications should remain the same but if there is a battle for the extraction, the attackers should have a harder time getting out.

-k

[Wraith 1]

Stoneblade, on 25 April 2016 - 10:07 AM, said:

Have the Dropship Land and the mechs have to get inside it.

This. Precisely friggin' this.

[pwnface]

Kdogg788, on 25 April 2016 - 10:15 AM, said:

At minimum the attackers should have to have a numbers advantage on the defenders in order to extract. Just running into the square and calling it a win is way too easy and a bit non-nonsensical. The drop zone location notifications should remain the same but if there is a battle for the extraction, the attackers should have a harder time getting out.

-k

What if shooting the dropship extended the amount of time it stayed there...

Two teams could be fighting over the extraction point and the defending team would have to shoot the dropship a few times to prevent the enemy from escaping.

[Murphy7]

Rampage,

The dropship, even Leopard class, is a much, much larger element than the mechs and moves into the area without much cover. If we have eyes in the sky that can tell us the dropship is inbound, then we can know where it is on the map once it has arrived.

Otherwise, if it were truly a stealth operation, why should the defender even know about the dropship timer?

The current implementation strongly favors the attacking side for Scouting due to the last second zone entry mechanic.

I would like to see an option to shoot the Dropship to either scare it off "LZ is too hot", or add time before pick-up as pwnface suggests.

[p4r4g0n]

Apply the K.I.S.S. principle.

Options:

All surviving scouts must be in the extraction point for lift-off to meet the win condition; or
Only those intel points collected by the mechs that make it to the extraction point will be counted; or
whatever else that can be implemented that does not make this mode skirmish

Incidentally, out of all the Scout matches I played, only a small number involved never finding any of the enemies. Having said that, this was all in solo queue so maybe unit queue has a different playstyle?

Edited by p4r4g0n, 26 April 2016 - 05:33 AM.

[iLLcapitan]

Title is misleading, scouting needs minor tweeks and is one of the best features they added with phase 3. But drama is king in these forums atm.

[ImperialKnight]

i support being able to kill the drop ship. this forces attackers to come and defend their drop zone, instead of simply waiting for the timer

[Davegt27]

Quote

In the few scouting matches I've played

Well get some more matches under your belt

You need to try all your light and medium Mechs

Then go through all weapons and all combination of weapons
Then go through Endo and Ferro fibrous
Then go through as many engine and jump jet combination as you can

[nehebkau]

Kdogg788, on 25 April 2016 - 08:43 AM, said:

In the few scouting matches I've played, I've come to believe that the major imbalance in scouting is not IS vs. clans but attack vs. defense. It is way too easy for attackers to win the match by just passing into the square as time expires. The mode does not give enough time to locate the signal, relocate to the target grid, and eliminate the entire enemy team before the ship escapes. As defender I've seen that it's rare that the attackers are wiped out before this happens, and some defending wins occur because the attacking team are not actually in that area. I would propose extending the leave time if defenders are within that area and/or there is fighting taking place directly below the dropship. An auto-extract for the attackers at the close of the timer is poor design IMO.
-k

Agreed,

[vocifer]

iLLcapitan, on 26 April 2016 - 05:50 AM, said:

Title is misleading, scouting needs minor tweeks and is one of the best features they added with phase 3. But drama is king in these forums atm.

You didn't get it - they want 4v4 skirmish..

No really, think of it: Why would a pug care about intel points? A little cbill bonus is ok but the win gives you more, right? Some invasion groups suffer from LongToms, so what? Grab 4 Scrows, kill defenders, extract immediately to have a next match faster.

As a unit member I don't really care if attackers have more chances to "win". Because overall intel balance matters for me.
If I know that odds are against me, and attackers "win" with only 1-3 intels collected, that means I did well.

[JaidenHaze]

Just make it so that the attacker cant get into the square at the last second and still win. When a defender is in the square, you have to either kill or remove him first.

Its as easy as that.

Yes, that enforces a more skirmish heavy gameplay, but with a tonnage limit of something like 45 and 50 tons, its doable.