14 replies to this topic

[Jikil]

As the title says I think its time for the game to shift in the direction that IS mechs have been doing for the last few patches.
It's time to bring structure up to twice its current value. Make it the same as the doubled armor change in the beta.

Not only does this improve time to kill, but it also increases the importance of critical hits.

Crit seeking weapons like the LBX will find more use outside of specific quirks and actually have a place on a mech in place of an auto cannon.

I propose all current structure quirks be removed and all mechs receive double the structure as their base chassis.



If this game wants to be the "thinking man's shooter" it claims to be it needs to give people time to think. I think this change will go a long way to making the more interesting and help players feel like they aren't forced into a super quirked structure meta mech to be competitive.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

How about we just go with 50% in the torsos and legs first, double structure BJs, even without weapon quirks, is not something I want to return to.

[FupDup]

Structure already is double its TT values, not counting quirks (which make it more than double on the corresponding mechs).

In some cases there's even 4x structure, like the Mist Lynx's arms...

[Gas Guzzler]

If "...on the Kingfisher" was the first thing you said in your post, I would have agreed 100%.

Oh well.

[Khobai]

How bout we just go back to 8v8 for the quickplay gamemodes

Even PGIs tournament is 8v8? Why? Because 12v12 sucks for one-life gamemodes and they know it.

Going back to 8v8 would solve most of the problems with deathballing and low TTK. It solves ammo problems. It solves every problem 12v12 caused but PGI wont admit.

Edited by Khobai, 26 April 2016 - 02:02 PM.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Gas Guzzler, on 26 April 2016 - 02:01 PM, said:

If "...on the Kingfisher" was the first thing you said in your post, I would have agreed 100%.

Oh well.

Well, to be fair any Clan Omni relegated to a standard engine probably deserves it.

[Jikil]

Gas Guzzler, on 26 April 2016 - 02:01 PM, said:

If "...on the Kingfisher" was the first thing you said in your post, I would have agreed 100%.

Oh well.

I can't imagine ever seeing the kind fisher since its a standard engine omni. Aside from enthusiasts who actually is going to want a mech that doesn't feature the almighty clan XL engine?

Khobai, on 26 April 2016 - 02:01 PM, said:

How bout we just go back to 8v8 for the quickplay gamemodes

Even PGIs tournament is 8v8? Why? Because 12v12 sucks for one-life gamemodes and they know it.

Going back to 8v8 would solve most of the problems with deathballing and low TTK. It solves ammo problems. It solves every problem 12v12 caused but PGI wont admit.

I think 12v12 feels better on the larger maps but worse on smaller maps like mining collective. I can't imagine them going back to a dual lance drops though. With less players, you find that its harder to get away with playing sub-par mechs like you can when there are more players.

Suddenly that mist lynx or commando feels like a poor replacement for an oxide.

[Levi Porphyrogenitus]

Instead of double structure, which unfairly penalizes ammo-dependent builds and lighter mechs, why not increase weapon cooldowns across the board (some weapons slightly, others significantly), while also implementing a way to spread damage naturally (say, reducing weapon precision dynamically based on heat, throttle, stability, and other real-time states)?

Throw in some aggressive sensor reworking and variant-based armor maximums (stock + x%, or stock + x tons, whichever works best).

[Mcgral18]

Vindi
Myth Lynx
Commando
Cute Fox
Sadder

Dragon
Onion

Mr Gargles
Victor
Awesome
Atlas (mostly there already, could probably leave it)


There's a short list of robots that should get improvements in some form or another. Whether due to geometry, limitations such as hardpoints or hardwired equipment, or whatever.

Cute Fox will always be inferior to the Cheetah, having fewer useful hardpoints, worse weapon mounts, LARGER and considerably slower.
It needs to tank

Sadder is a similar case to the Jenner, but not as severe.

Whether double is the answer of not (Light mechs could, Assaults...double may be too much) depends on the mech. Would anyone really complain if the Spider 5V got doubled Armour? That's the case of decent hitboxes, but absolutely pitiful firepower.


Not every robot should get structure quirks. They simply don't need them.

[Khobai]

Quote

Cute Fox will always be inferior to the Cheetah

Not necessarily.

If ECM stealth was removed, LRMs were actually made viable, the Kitfox would have a strong role as AMS support. Something the Cheetah couldnt do.

Also if machine guns ever got a much needed buff, Kitfoxes could potentially take on Arctic Cheetahs 1v1. One of the big reasons the Kitfox sucks is because its 4 machine guns just dont do any real damage.

The Kitfox has potential to be better at some things than the Arctic Cheetah. But PGI actually has to fix the games problems instead of ignoring them.

Edited by Khobai, 26 April 2016 - 02:19 PM.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Mcgral18, on 26 April 2016 - 02:13 PM, said:

Not every robot should get structure quirks. They simply don't need them.

The only meta IS mechs that don't have them are some of the assaults (BNC-3M/BLR-1G/MAL-MX90).

Khobai, on 26 April 2016 - 02:15 PM, said:

Also if machine guns ever got a decent buff, Kitfoxes could take Arctic Cheetahs 1v1.

MGs would have to get buffed a ****load to be able to take that on.

[cazidin]

Khobai, on 26 April 2016 - 02:01 PM, said:

How bout we just go back to 8v8 for the quickplay gamemodes

Even PGIs tournament is 8v8? Why? Because 12v12 sucks for one-life gamemodes and they know it.

Going back to 8v8 would solve most of the problems with deathballing and low TTK. It solves ammo problems. It solves every problem 12v12 caused but PGI wont admit.

It's better to apply several different solutions to varying degrees of success(?) than to implement a solution that'd effectively solve most if not all of the problems we currently face. However, in PGI's defense, they did explicitly state at one point that 8v8 servers were cost prohibitive. Whether that's true or not is debatable.

[Khobai]

Quote

However, in PGI's defense, they did explicitly state at one point that 8v8 servers were cost prohibitive

That was before they had voting implementing. Voting drastically reduces the number of buckets required.

8v8 would no longer be prohibitive because of voting.

[Mcgral18]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 26 April 2016 - 02:17 PM, said:

The only meta IS mechs that don't have them are some of the assaults (BNC-3M/BLR-1G/MAL-MX90).

Which is not every!

Weapon quirks play a role. Unfortunately, some mechs get both useful weapon quirks AND useful IS+A quirks.
Banshee only gets weapons, but decent ones. 10% to Cooldown, Duration, Heat (and throwaway PPC velocity).

Oxide and BK, both weapon+Structure

[Levi Porphyrogenitus]

Khobai, on 26 April 2016 - 02:21 PM, said:

That was before they had voting implementing. Voting drastically reduces the number of buckets required.

8v8 would no longer be prohibitive because of voting.

I do think a return to 8v8 would bring back a significant number of players who either barely play now or don't play at all anymore.