78 replies to this topic

[Xhaleon]

People can always record their own games using Fraps, so I take you mean a recording of the whole battle?

I'd like to see that. Server side, they just make a simple copy of all the events going on in the battle, then release that file as public so people can play back the battle from any angle.

But who gets to decide if the recording is allowed to be publicly viewed? The gameroom master? By majority vote? I know that this kind of thing doesn't seem sensitive, but some people wanna keep their matches private, ya know? How many question marks will this paragraph contain?

[Kaemon]

Ok so I don't think anyone is against the idea of recording the battles, now the question is:

Are we going to do it via an in game resource (beagle) or outside?

Are we doing full game or side based? (if you don't launch a probe, you don't get a recording)

I'd like to see this in Conquest mode for sure, pub is probably not as important, however it does do a nice job of advertising the game, the vids people make about gameplay are usually interesting (and we do have some talented peeps in the forum).

A full view of the battle (from both sides) would be awesome, however Merc Corps may not like their tactics broadcasted for everyone to see (especially from a whole battle god view perspective).

So I guess I'm voting in game beagle.

[CyBerkut]

For viewing *AFTER* the game is over, a battle recorder could be nice if it is well implemented. The questions then become, 1. How will they be available for viewing? 2. When will they be available for viewing?

MW4 had a 'watch the dots move around on the map" viewer option that was available immediately after the match. It was obviously much simpler than what is being described by some here... and even that pointed out a potential problem. Do you/we want people sitting around (for the time it takes to replay a game recording) before another match can start on that server? No matter how cool /detailed the replay gets, it will soon be a drag to most people if they have to sit around waiting for the next match to begin.

If storage could be made a bit longer term (say, 24 or 72 hours) with a well designed way to recall available game recordings for viewing later, then folks could get their recordings later without holding matches up.


As for a spectator mode for viewing *during* the game... I'd say no, or make it a server option that is normally off. Why? Because people will use it to gather intel without having to launch a drone, etc. If someone can 'fly around' in the game looking anywhere, there is nothing to stop them from doing that, and then telling their buddies over Teamspeak or Ventrillo where the opponents are. A spectator mode during the game will undermine the Information Warfare being built into the game.

[IceSerpent]

I absolutely love the idea of recording the battle and viewing it afterwards (like in IL-2 and other games that folks already mentioned). Regarding spectator mode during the game, it would be nice to be able to watch from another player's cockpit (first-person view, you see what they see), but please don't allow for 3rd person view during the game.

[Kaemon]

Hmmm...I thinking something different, a bit of a nod toward the tabletop days -

Stay with me here, as it might get a bit weird...that's what she said...

How about converting the recordings to a TT version of the battle? So it would play out like a TT game?

Only the pieces move about the 'board' and tip over when dead, etc...?

[Dlardrageth]

Anything that puts a higher connection/server load up just for the personal "fun" of one person is IMO a bad idea. If people want to record their battles, fine. But make it client-side then, so they have to take the full consequences of it, not all the other random players. For the same reason I object to those recordings being stored on the server(s).

And any client-side solution will have major issues inclusing "full view" options as well. Too easy to modify those to get a nice cheat for circumventing spotting/LoS/scouting mechanics.

Having said that, some sort of "gun camera" to log a battle from your personal Mech's view should be doable, if people cannot be bothered to use FRAPS (gotta wonder why is that, though).

Edited by Dlardrageth, 19 December 2011 - 11:52 AM.

[Xhaleon]

Dlardrageth, on 19 December 2011 - 11:51 AM, said:

Having said that, some sort of "gun camera" to log a battle from your personal Mech's view should be doable, if people cannot be bothered to use FRAPS (gotta wonder why is that, though).

One records the raw visual output being sent to the monitor, while the other only records the input commands of the player and others to be simulated on replay. Obviously not as easy as recording the actions of a 2D game, but still...

The latter is also why it wouldn't really be a large burden on the server.

Or am I getting recording methods totally messed up?

[UncleKulikov]

I absolutely want this. The technology has been around at least since 1994 with Marathon, it should have become industry standard when Halo 3 did a really good job of it.

It would seriously increase the social aspect of the game, because players could share their coolest moments on youtube with their social networks and take really cool screen shots which can also be shared.

[MaddMaxx]

The recording would only need, other than the Map data, Mechs in play, everyone's real time positional data (map coordinates), facings (how you rotated/drove the Mech and any and all weapons fire.

The replay engine would then place the units on the proper Map (local disk), add the required visual assets (local disk) and read the data for all the resultant actions. There would be no rewind or fast forward for ease of data recording.

There might be a way to implement a jump between combatant cockpits perhaps. That would be awesome.

Edited by MaddMaxx, 19 December 2011 - 12:32 PM.

[Kevin Kirov]

Maybe if there was a BAP equppied mech in the battle it could be shared with their merc corp or house unit.

In addition to the ability to detect and classify targets at longer range, the Beagle includes a memory unit that records the events of a battle and allows for later playback. This includes the ability for the user to "re-fight" the battle by making different tactical decisions, which are then analyzed and implemented by the system, allowing for the resulting consequences to be observed

from Sarna.net

[UncleKulikov]

MaddMaxx, on 19 December 2011 - 12:31 PM, said:

The recording would only need, other than the Map data, Mechs in play, everyone's real time positional data (map coordinates), facings (how you rotated/drove the Mech and any and all weapons fire.

The replay engine would then place the units on the proper Map (local disk), add the required visual assets (local disk) and read the data for all the resultant actions. There would be no rewind or fast forward for ease of data recording.

There might be a way to implement a jump between combatant cockpits perhaps. That would be awesome.

Why no rewind feature? Everything that is recorded is simple vector data and coordinates. Halo 3 did it, and that was 5+ years ago.

Edited by UncleKulikov, 19 December 2011 - 12:34 PM.

[MaddMaxx]

UncleKulikov, on 19 December 2011 - 12:34 PM, said:

Why no rewind feature? Everything that is recorded is simple vector data and coordinates. Halo 3 did it, and that was 5+ years ago.

Not saying they can't do it but it does involve more data storage and every time index has to be pointed to in order to go "back to a "previous"
event. This would be a case of using the K.I.S.S. principle to get it in. I am guessing no data record/playback at launch (hope I am wrong)

[Fiachdubh]

This would be so much fun, with no matches or anything else to do sit back with a beer and watch your latest glorious victory/disaster!

[GreyGriffin]

Yes, please allow us to save, share, and exchange BattleROMs!

[Damocles]

This would be great.

[GreyGriffin]

Simple answer about permissions - every player could choose to have their battleroms public or private by default, meaning they can share their glory or hide their strategic routes as much as they like. You would only be able to view the perspective of public battleroms, or BattleROMs that you have been given access to personally by a pilot with private battleroms. You could also use a privately given Battlerom and then correlate it to public BattleROMs of the same battle.

[UncleKulikov]

MaddMaxx, on 19 December 2011 - 05:41 PM, said:

Not saying they can't do it but it does involve more data storage and every time index has to be pointed to in order to go "back to a "previous"
event. This would be a case of using the K.I.S.S. principle to get it in. I am guessing no data record/playback at launch (hope I am wrong)

How would it involve more storage, since all of the events of the match are recorded anyway?

For example, a GIF sequence can be viewed in quicktime forward or backwards, and the file size is the same because it's just scrubbing between two different frames. The system in Halo 3 worked similarly, it would record the placement and vector of everything match related several times a second, and it allowed you to rewind in 10 second increments.

I would like a rewind feature, but recording is the main element that should be in. The rest is bells and whistles.

Edited by UncleKulikov, 22 December 2011 - 06:59 PM.

[Halfinax]

Recording shouldn't be too difficult to include. Just retain the information client side. The server is already tracking the locations of all fielded units anyway, so a recording option shouldn't be too difficult I would think. Many games already include a full battlefield recorder, and I'd love to be able to use it for MWO. Being able to use recordings to work on team tactics, and watch other teams battles for ideas on how to improve your own gameplay is nearly a must for competitive games.

[Silent]

Plus it's a free form of advertising. If a recorder is included in the game, it's only a matter of time before people start making music videos and machinima and posting them on YouTube.

Edited by Silent, 23 December 2011 - 07:18 AM.

[Kaemon]

Kevin Kirov, on 19 December 2011 - 12:34 PM, said:

Maybe if there was a BAP equppied mech in the battle it could be shared with their merc corp or house unit.

In addition to the ability to detect and classify targets at longer range, the Beagle includes a memory unit that records the events of a battle and allows for later playback. This includes the ability for the user to "re-fight" the battle by making different tactical decisions, which are then analyzed and implemented by the system, allowing for the resulting consequences to be observed

from Sarna.net

This.

Plus the DLC to run it on my own server, then review with my Merc Unit to discuss tactics.

Setup SFTP site with our user logins and allow us to access the recordings.