11 replies to this topic

[razenWing]

Ok, that's like a totally weird way to phrase the title, but essentially...

Say right now, I buy the Clan Invasion Wave 3 Pack which contains the Shadowcat, Ebon Jaguar, Arctic Cheetah, and Executioner.

So I am reading the rules and the pattern unlock will apply to all of the above, right? Say let's call the 3 EBJ as John, Mary, and George, I can apply Hello Kitty paw make-up (pattern) to John, Mary, and George. That part is clear... no problem.

Now, say I purchased with C-bill on another Ebon (Julie) PRIOR (or AFTER) I bought the Pack. (So Julie didn't come with the real dollar transaction, cause she's classy like that)

Will I still be able to outfit Julie with the fancy make-ups (patterns) that come with the pack? Since Julie is technically a feisty Jaguar as well, or will she be excluded because she's too classy to be bought with real money?

I ask this because... I have 4 Ebons already. And while it seems stupid to spent 30 additional dollars on something I already have:
1) I want the cool Bane mask special geometry
2) I am tired of swapping weapons for weapon test beds, and since they are so versatile, more is better, IMO.
3) 23 more days of premium, which at 60 bucks for 7 days is kinda a rip-off (which btw, PGI, you REALLY should fix. I understand you want to value Clan mechs more... but premium time should be INDEPENDENT of mech value, but directly correlate to the money involved. It's asinine that IS pack for 60 bucks get 30 days, and only 7 days for Clan.

which btw#2 you really should retroactively give premium time back to players that purchase those super packs. cause, it's 30 days for 20 bucks now... whereas it's 60-90 bucks for the same length of time, a complete ripoff by all account. now of course, we get colors and patterns, so even if it's not the full 30 days, at least like additional 15-20 days sounds fair?)
4) 2 additional faction contents (btw #3, half the colors of IS packs???? come on...)

Now, it would make me seem super duper stupid if I dump 90 bucks to realize that the 4 Jaguars I already owned still require me to pay additional dollars to get the same patterns.

Be great if someone can answer my question and PGI can show good faith in rectifying some of the past outrageousness by giving paying customers some bonus back (in premium time and/or additional contents)

[TercieI]

Yes. It's a chassis unlock. Past, present, future of that chassis.

[Rogue Jedi]

Terciel has answered the rest so I will address this:

razenWing, on 17 May 2016 - 07:32 AM, said:

PGI can show good faith in rectifying some of the past outrageousness by giving paying customers some bonus back (in premium time and/or additional contents)

the last 2 years around October/November they have been giving out "loyalty Mechs", criteria to receive them have included purchasing ^{(within a specified time frame)} MC, purchasing any Inner Sphere preorder pack, Purchasing the top tier of any IS Pack and purchasing any Clan pack and top level Clan pack, last year there were a total of 5 Mechs available each with a 30% cbill boost given out to qualifying players, in 2014 there were just 3 Mechs

[Jables McBarty]

Just as a side note, the camo unlocks are only for the chassis 'mechs that you bought as a collection.
Obviously this means that if you bought the Cauldron-Born pack, you don't get camo unlocks for any EXE's that you happened to buy with Cbills.

Less obvious, is that if you buy the EXE a la carte, then later buy the Cauldron-Born collection, you still don't get the EXE camo unlocks--you only get those if you'd have bought the Gladiator package to begin with.

Subtle difference, and possibly straightforward to most, but I was disappointed when five months after being gifted the HGN-IIC(O) a la carte (no camo, just 'mechs), I went and bought the Hunchback pack thinking I'd also get Highlander camo specs. "No dice" said support. Live and learn.

Edited by Jables McBarty, 17 May 2016 - 11:12 AM.

[TercieI]

Jables McBarty, on 17 May 2016 - 11:12 AM, said:

Just as a side note, the camo unlocks are only for the chassis 'mechs that you bought as a collection.
Obviously this means that if you bought the Cauldron-Born pack, you don't get camo unlocks for any EXE's that you happened to buy with Cbills.

Less obvious, is that if you buy the EXE a la carte, then later buy the Cauldron-Born collection, you still don't get the EXE camo unlocks--you only get those if you'd have bought the Gladiator package to begin with.

Subtle difference, and possibly straightforward to most, but I was disappointed when five months after being gifted the HGN-IIC(O) a la carte (no camo, just 'mechs), I went and bought the Hunchback pack thinking I'd also get Highlander camo specs. "No dice" said support. Live and learn.

Good add'l info. As a rule, a la carte gets no bonuses.

[razenWing]

Jables McBarty, on 17 May 2016 - 11:12 AM, said:

Just as a side note, the camo unlocks are only for the chassis 'mechs that you bought as a collection.
Obviously this means that if you bought the Cauldron-Born pack, you don't get camo unlocks for any EXE's that you happened to buy with Cbills.

Less obvious, is that if you buy the EXE a la carte, then later buy the Cauldron-Born collection, you still don't get the EXE camo unlocks--you only get those if you'd have bought the Gladiator package to begin with.

Subtle difference, and possibly straightforward to most, but I was disappointed when five months after being gifted the HGN-IIC(O) a la carte (no camo, just 'mechs), I went and bought the Hunchback pack thinking I'd also get Highlander camo specs. "No dice" said support. Live and learn.

Wait, hold on... this seems like an important detail. I am not quite sure what you mean though, can you elaborate?

Cause it reads to me like exactly what I was afraid of in my senario... you bought the Highlander a la cart (which is the same as me owning 4 jags to begin with), then when you buy the pack with highlander pattern unlock, the highlander you bought previously cannot be applied?

(which confirms my current situation?)

Can you go into more details with more example? I REALLY don't want to give PGI money if I am going to be rip-off like that.

Re-read your post again, so do you mean that you have to have the collection that includes the assault tier mech to get the pattern unlock to include the assault mechs, instead of buying the light, med, and heavy tier and expecting to get assault tier for free?

Edited by razenWing, 18 May 2016 - 04:08 AM.

[Jables McBarty]

razenWing, on 18 May 2016 - 04:02 AM, said:

Re-read your post again, so do you mean that you have to have the collection that includes the assault tier mech to get the pattern unlock to include the assault mechs, instead of buying the light, med, and heavy tier and expecting to get assault tier for free?

Short Answer: Yes.

Long Answer: Let's look at the fine print from Origins IIC faction content that confused me:

* Mad Dog 'Mech and Mad Dog Faction Pattern is for display purposes only. The Mad Dog 'Mech and Faction Patterns for the Mad Dog are not included as part of Origins IIC.
* You only receive Faction Pattern Unlocks for the 'Mechs in your collection. Faction Pattern Unlocks received through Origins IIC Collections cannot be applied to any other 'Mechs, including Wave 1, Wave 2, Wave 3, Resistance, or any non-Collection 'Mechs.
* If you choose to get multiple copies of the same Faction Content you will only receive multiple copies of the Cockpit Items. Colors only unlock once, but are applicable to all 'Mechs as often as you like. Patterns will only unlock once, and as per standard ‘Mech Collection Faction Content Pattern Unlock behavior are only applicable to your Origins IIC 'Mechs.

When I read the second underlined sentence I thought "Oh, well my Origins IIC 'Mechs include the Highlanders, therefore by buying even one tier, I would get the camo unlocks for them." But the first underlined portion is the key--it has to be part of your "collection"--which is used in a technical, restrictive way, not in the colloquial way I was thinking of it. So just like you phrased it--if you buy Heavy and down, you don't get Assault camo's.

Second clarification:
Italicized portion "...or any non-Collection 'Mechs" - Again, to clarify this is talking about chassis within the tiers that you purchased. I already had one Jenner-IIC for Cbills before I bought the Hunchback IIC collection. I was able to apply the camo to that 'mech same as any of my other Jenner-IICs.

So additional individual mechs or variants of the chassis included in your tier: Yes
Additional chassis within the release that aren't part of your collection tier: No



TL;DR: Yes.

[Jables McBarty]

It helps to understand how permanent camo unlocks work in general.

Permanent Pattern Unlocks can always be applied to all variants of a chassis. So if you have twelve EBJ-A's and you have the EBJ Smoke Jaguar Permanent Pattern Unlock, you can apply it to all twelve. If you sell all twelve so you then have no EBJ's at all, and then later buy a single EBJ-C, you can still apply the Smoke Jaguar Pattern to that 'mech, because that permanent pattern unlock is still in your inventory.

When you buy a collection, you get permanent pattern unlocks for the chassis in that collection.

[razenWing]

Jables McBarty, on 18 May 2016 - 04:29 AM, said:

Short Answer: Yes.

Long Answer: Let's look at the fine print from Origins IIC faction content that confused me:

* Mad Dog 'Mech and Mad Dog Faction Pattern is for display purposes only. The Mad Dog 'Mech and Faction Patterns for the Mad Dog are not included as part of Origins IIC.
* You only receive Faction Pattern Unlocks for the 'Mechs in your collection. Faction Pattern Unlocks received through Origins IIC Collections cannot be applied to any other 'Mechs, including Wave 1, Wave 2, Wave 3, Resistance, or any non-Collection 'Mechs.
* If you choose to get multiple copies of the same Faction Content you will only receive multiple copies of the Cockpit Items. Colors only unlock once, but are applicable to all 'Mechs as often as you like. Patterns will only unlock once, and as per standard ‘Mech Collection Faction Content Pattern Unlock behavior are only applicable to your Origins IIC 'Mechs.

When I read the second underlined sentence I thought "Oh, well my Origins IIC 'Mechs include the Highlanders, therefore by buying even one tier, I would get the camo unlocks for them." But the first underlined portion is the key--it has to be part of your "collection"--which is used in a technical, restrictive way, not in the colloquial way I was thinking of it. So just like you phrased it--if you buy Heavy and down, you don't get Assault camo's.

Second clarification:
Italicized portion "...or any non-Collection 'Mechs" - Again, to clarify this is talking about chassis within the tiers that you purchased. I already had one Jenner-IIC for Cbills before I bought the Hunchback IIC collection. I was able to apply the camo to that 'mech same as any of my other Jenner-IICs.

So additional individual mechs or variants of the chassis included in your tier: Yes
Additional chassis within the release that aren't part of your collection tier: No



TL;DR: Yes.

Thanks bud, that's actually super informative. Now to have my last internal conflict on whether to give PGI 90 more dollars. (Which would make my last 3 month a total of $180 purchase, the most I've ever given to a game company in that short of a duration. So PGI... make more gosh darn maps)

[Jables McBarty]

razenWing, on 18 May 2016 - 07:12 AM, said:

Thanks bud, that's actually super informative. Now to have my last internal conflict on whether to give PGI 90 more dollars. (Which would make my last 3 month a total of $180 purchase, the most I've ever given to a game company in that short of a duration. So PGI... make more gosh darn maps)

Keep in mind you can always upgrade your collection at a later date.

So if you have $30, pick up the ACH now, then next month, put in another $30 and get the SHC, then in July put in another $30 and get your EBJ kit.

This doesn't really help with #2 below though...

razenWing, on 17 May 2016 - 07:32 AM, said:

I ask this because... I have 4 Ebons already. And while it seems stupid to spent 30 additional dollars on something I already have:
1) I want the cool Bane mask special geometry
2) I am tired of swapping weapons for weapon test beds, and since they are so versatile, more is better, IMO.
3) 23 more days of premium, which at 60 bucks for 7 days is kinda a rip-off (which btw, PGI, you REALLY should fix. I understand you want to value Clan mechs more... but premium time should be INDEPENDENT of mech value, but directly correlate to the money involved. It's asinine that IS pack for 60 bucks get 30 days, and only 7 days for Clan.

which btw#2 you really should retroactively give premium time back to players that purchase those super packs. cause, it's 30 days for 20 bucks now... whereas it's 60-90 bucks for the same length of time, a complete ripoff by all account. now of course, we get colors and patterns, so even if it's not the full 30 days, at least like additional 15-20 days sounds fair?)
4) 2 additional faction contents (btw #3, half the colors of IS packs???? come on...)

Now, it would make me seem super duper stupid if I dump 90 bucks to realize that the 4 Jaguars I already owned still require me to pay additional dollars to get the same patterns.

Be great if someone can answer my question and PGI can show good faith in rectifying some of the past outrageousness by giving paying customers some bonus back (in premium time and/or additional contents)

Over time the packages appear to have gotten progressively more reasonable in price and content (I started just before Origins IIC was released so this is just my perspective). So RE: colors, you'll notice that Resistance I, just like Clan Waves I-III, has only three colors per content pack; it's only Resistance II, like Origins IIC, that has six colors per faction content pack. So they did slowly bump it up (packs are listed on the Store page in reverse chronological order. So the bottom-right is the oldest package still available for purchase).

Also, as I understand it, part of the justification for the clan price was the Cbill cost of Omnimechs, but that doesn't float it for me.

As for justifying the $90 expense for 3 more EBJ's this is how I'd look at it:
-Each Clan Permanent Pattern Unlock rates 1500MC (if memory serves).
-Buying MC at the $15 rate gets you two pattern unlocks (I recognize that the *best* rate of exchange on MC is to go big, but I find if I spend less up front, I spend less later on, so it's always in $15 increments for me)
-Given the above, we can say the three pattern unlocks for your EBJ are worth about $22.50.
-You also get 30 days of Premium Time, which is $12 a pop.
-Note that I'm not counting the MC price of EBJ, as I don't buy 'mechs for MC--only Cbills or cash (unless it's a Hero).

So then it's a matter of factoring in the increased convenience of not having to repeatedly re-fit your 'mechs. You'd also get six new variants of the ACH and SHC, including the Special [I] variants that have the Cbill bonus. If you don't like any of those, you can sell the non-Special variants to free up 4 additional 'mech bays. You also give yourself the ability to upgrade at a later date to the EXE for $30 to get an additional 30 days Premium Time, plus seven more pattern Unlocks (4 EXE + 1 for all the rest).

That's the pro. The con: You are out $90, and you might be getting a lot of content you wouldn't otherwise have wanted or bought.

In the end, all of these prices are somewhat arbitrary, being for content that is entirely optional, mostly free, and subject to pricing schemes that are months to years out-of-date. So far as I can tell, it's not worth it to rationalize what things "should" be priced at, as PGI hasn't changed any prices thus far. Figure out what you want to play, what you'd probably pay anyway, then make the decision.



For me and my Origins IIC mechs, given that I already have the four Highlanders, the four pattern unlocks alone are pretty much worth the $20 upgrade from the Orion Tier--because I'd probably buy those patterns anyway. I'd also get an additional pattern for each previous tier (that is, I have 3 pattern unlocks from Orion Tier for a total of 9; I'd get 1 more for each chassis to bring the total to 16 patterns), so that's another $22.50. And I get another 30 days Premium Time. So next time I want some more Premium Time, I'll shell out $20 for the Highlander Pack, even though it makes the $35 HGN a la carte gift my friend gave me entirely redundant.



Final note on pricing:
The best bang for your buck IMO is to pre-order the $20 Mech Collection packs as they come out, as you are getting 30 days premium time + additional new content ('mechs, plus modules and patterns with the pre-order)...basically a monthly subscription fee in different words. That being said I've shelled out for the Origin IIC's, and I also bought the SHC collection for a friend.

[Koniving]

I personally enjoy the over-time aspect, as fronting so much all at once is very difficult.

Instead, while it is in early release if I really want it, I front the first tier during the bonus period.
Then upgrade about once a month as possible until it comes out.

[razenWing]

O I didn't even know you can upgrade your collection. I just assume that if you buy light tier mech for 30 bucks, you have to shell out 60 bucks to get the medium tier (rebuying the light tier along with the medium)

But what you guys are suggesting is indeed a good strat to go about it.

Also, when I started playing, I missed the Kodiak the early adopter bonus. Everything else since, I don't know... don't really appeal to me that much. (Like, I like to pilot what I think looks cool, even if they have horrible hitbox or whatever)

The night gyr seems like a cool substitute for Nova Cat in MW4. But again... I don't know. I hope they release something that more... animalistic in appearance. Been waiting for the bushwacker. But I tend to like mechs like MW4 hellhound, madcat mk2, MW3 super nova.... anything that doesn't look like sockem robots really.

So yea, still waiting for those.

(PS yea i know viper... but it looks like a demented raven tbh, don't really want it)