287 replies to this topic

[Thorn Hallis]

WoT is simpler and much easier to get into.

It runs pretty fine on older hardware.

It gives new players a goal by not giving them access to every verhicle right from the start.


I actually do think that MWO would have a larger playerbase if it would have been "WoT with 'Mechs". And the forums would be even more toxic.

[LordKnightFandragon]

KHETTI, on 31 May 2016 - 05:02 AM, said:

Balance wise, in comparison to WoWs, MWO is way way better balanced, imagine assaults as they are now, but give them a repair consumable that recovers 20% of their armor when used.
That's the sort of nonsense that is considered balance over at WoWs, and BB captains still complain about cruisers, wanting HE nerfed, which is ridiculous considering cruisers don't have guns with high enough a caliber to penetrate BB armor with AP.
Same thing goes with DDs.

WOWS is stupid as ****. Your Battleship that has 72,000 health can be 1 shot just cuz a single shot finds a single spot on the ship, and othertimes you just fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire, as I once did at T2 and do absolutely nothing. WOWS is probably one of the most ******** games I have played........Ofc, in general, i just hate WG and their games, but WOWS, wow, it really takes the cake. Then the RNG on the guns, I once fired like 8 salvoes at a single stationary ship and my guns hit 0 times cuz RNG said LolNO! Then the AI finally drew a bead on me and I was dead inside of 15 seconds.

[Corrado]

I'm a WoT player since the game closed beta. played almost 3 years, almost 30k battles on my account, 32 tanks of which 14 tier10. Been part of a international clan started by german pro gamers (MUMMY) and did a lot of ESL back in 2014. MUMMY was a part of the european notorious clan PTS.

I spent a lot of real cash to be able to purchase some of the latest tier10 (tier1 is the bottom, tier10 the top) tanks and MANTAIN tier10 tanks in casual games with premium time. in the first months of clanwars and ESL, i had really low gold currency (=MC here) also spent a good amount of cash on PREMIUM AMMO to start competing with elite players (premium AMMO usually gives you more penetration to pass thru thick frontal armor and is mandatory in competivive matches)
Even in random Tier10 games a lot of people started to use premium ammo and consumables, till the point i did hate the game and left competitive gaming as soon as i found MWO back in early open beta.

In WoT there is the repair and rearm cost. While you "can" play without premium up to tier6 without losing a lot of money, without premium time at tier10, is really hard to net without losing credits (=cbills). since losing badly costs you credits, the playerbase on random games is mostly toxic due to this game "feature".

I still have my account, with unicum stats, i havent touched WoT since 2015. i'll never EVER go back to play a wargaming title.

MWO is so better on any side. there is just cbills grind and a 15-25 games grind per variant to have double basics in it. (is not even a unbearable grind unlike WoT where to unlock the top tank in that tree takes you something like 600-750 matches thru all the tiers, buying each tank you need to unlock the next. in MWO, RNG is very limited, while in WoT aiming and penetration of the enemy armor is ruled by RNG up to 30%. RNG is there to help closing the gap with random numbers between high skill players and potatoes. you can perfectly aim that shot and "ding" on your enemy armor while with some luck, the enemy can shoot while moving, penetrate your armor and hit the ammorack (blowing you up) if 3 dice rolls say so.

finally, wot is built in a rock paper scissors game. mwo much much less.

MWO is skillbased, WoT is luck/wallet based. enough with that. im not going back to WoT even if MWO would shutdown today. ffs.

[Wintersdark]

TWIAFU, on 31 May 2016 - 03:59 AM, said:

You mean more people understand and know what a tank is over a Battlemech?!

More than that.

There are truly vast numbers of people who are really geeky about military stuff - real military stuff, that is, not fantasy military stuff.

Some with tanks, some with planes, some with ships; many with everything.

While we've got our fans here who are really excited about particular battlemechs from lore, there's really very little comparison between the two. Ours is a geeky love for an admittedly silly scifi thing, whereas the tank deal is a lot more hardcore, and has been a thing for as long as tanks have been - a very, very long time.

What's more, it's more "socially acceptable" - even today, if you're sitting around having an avid discussion about the pros and cons of a couple battlemechs, you sound pretty dorky. This doesn't matter to everyone, but it certainly impacts many. On the other hand, discussing Sherman vs. Tiger tanks is quite a bit different, as they are actual things, and there are hard facts to bring to the table vs. what some random author said while invoking the rule of cool.


Yeah, MWO has it's issues, but even if it didn't; even if MWO was a perfectly amazing game, it'd struggle to compete with World of Tanks.

Corrado, on 31 May 2016 - 05:13 AM, said:

I'm a WoT player since the game closed beta. played almost 3 years, almost 30k battles on my account, 32 tanks of which 14 tier10. Been part of a international clan started by german pro gamers (MUMMY) and did a lot of ESL back in 2014. MUMMY was a part of the european notorious clan PTS.

I spent a lot of real cash to be able to purchase some of the latest tier10 (tier1 is the bottom, tier10 the top) tanks and MANTAIN tier10 tanks in casual games with premium time. in the first months of clanwars and ESL, i had really low gold currency (=MC here) also spent a good amount of cash on PREMIUM AMMO to start competing with elite players (premium AMMO usually gives you more penetration to pass thru thick frontal armor and is mandatory in competivive matches)
Even in random Tier10 games a lot of people started to use premium ammo and consumables, till the point i did hate the game and left competitive gaming as soon as i found MWO back in early open beta.

In WoT there is the repair and rearm cost. While you "can" play without premium up to tier6 without losing a lot of money, without premium time at tier10, is really hard to net without losing credits (=cbills). since losing badly costs you credits, the playerbase on random games is mostly toxic due to this game "feature".

I still have my account, with unicum stats, i havent touched WoT since 2015. i'll never EVER go back to play a wargaming title.

MWO is so better on any side. there is just cbills grind and a 15-25 games grind per variant to have double basics in it. (is not even a unbearable grind unlike WoT where to unlock the top tank in that tree takes you something like 600-750 matches thru all the tiers, buying each tank you need to unlock the next. in MWO, RNG is very limited, while in WoT aiming and penetration of the enemy armor is ruled by RNG up to 30%. RNG is there to help closing the gap with random numbers between high skill players and potatoes. you can perfectly aim that shot and "ding" on your enemy armor while with some luck, the enemy can shoot while moving, penetrate your armor and hit the ammorack (blowing you up) if 3 dice rolls say so.

finally, wot is built in a rock paper scissors game. mwo much much less.

MWO is skillbased, WoT is luck/wallet based. enough with that. im not going back to WoT even if MWO would shutdown today. ffs.

Premium ammo. That right there was what stopped me from playing WoT.

[Felbombling]

World of Tanks probably has had two million people create accounts and try the game, but they certainly do not have two million regular players. Last time I played the North American West server, there were 9800 players playing.

MechWarrior: Online will have the same situation, but with far lower numbers. It is as if they don't want to advertise right now because they know the game is unpolished. Having said that, creating a 100k tournament is sure to create some buzz at some point. Would be nice if we saw some banner ads in the future as other games have done.

[Scratx]

Mystere, on 30 May 2016 - 09:30 PM, said:

Sigh! After thousands upon thousands of posts on the topic, people still cannot tell the difference between a normal and an even distribution. People still think the kind of CoF being asked for will result in 180-degree shot deviations.

Well, it's either that or some are just plainly exaggerating specifically to influence the even bigger fools who don't know any better.

I know what it is. I also know it matters not a goddamn because people will blame the RNG for everything. And they'll be right just often enough to feel justified.

Or did you think my battleship detonation example was made up? That happened just yesterday! And I've done that to a Montana with german torps (which have pretty crappy warheads at tier 8+) and a Yamato with a long range 15" shell. And, yes, I have also had matches where I was straddling my targets every single time with my shells and not getting more than a single hit (that typically did little damage). Of course I do have a TON of matches and the majority doesn't get me these kind of extremes... but the majority of those don't stick out in your mind just as much. FYI, IIRC, 2 torpedo detonations in 300 matches with that battleship. I may've forgotten one or two there, tho.

Of course, I also had those salvos that deleted cruisers or even battleships in one go... like a ranked match where my Fuso fired on a Kongo and scored 5 citadel hits. Ouch! That's 50+k damage in one go to a ship that didn't have that much hitpoints... So, yeah, RNG rounds out in the end. But does that really matter?

The point is, Mystere, that RNG's influence will be blown out of proportion by those who don't know better and generally magnify annoyance when people miss shots that would certainly hit without the RNG being there. Sure, there will also be the moments of awesome where that shot you fired off that missed the intended target by a mile due to RNG hits that red CT commando you never saw and finishes it off... RNG is RNG, it is perfectly neutral by itself. But psychology is a ***** and there's not a hell of a lot that's more annoying than keeping missing the target right in the crosshairs because arbitrary cone of fire RNG says NOPE! A missed shot is a missed shot, it doesn't matter right then and there that it was an extremophile in a Normal distribution.


Me, personally, if the CoF is small enough that it only really affects long range fire? I'm not going to care much. Reasons to get in your face and wreck stuff are appreciated. But it's not really needed, IMO. RNG stuff should not be a major factor in how one performs in a match.

[Mycrus]

Delta 62, on 30 May 2016 - 07:25 PM, said:

I saw a commercial the other day on television for World of Tanks. It was 45 seconds long and mentioned that it had almost 2 million players.

Why don't we see the same results with this game?

Do we need to kick start the advertising department for Mechwarrior?

This is what I interpreted from all the comments.

• Need more Marketing
  
• Target the marketing onto the right audience (fans of.... "robots...")
  
• Cut and run from countries that simply have no interest (in terms of advertising). And concentrate on areas that likey the robots.
  
• And increase server quality to areas of the globe that have people who want to play. I meet lots of interesting people when I have all the region boxes checked. However, they sometimes just.... have a bad connection. And they are stuck with it.
  
• Rethink the third person view argument. Its not worth risking financial stability because people "just have to have third person be ineffective."
  
• And more money to do this stuff!! visit a loan shark, or find some investors! team up with Megabot and that other company that's doing the tabletop game thing.

Tell me if there is more to add.

Because history channel...

[Jon Gotham]

Goose, on 30 May 2016 - 07:38 PM, said:

Hear-tell, they have a functioning match maker.

No they don't, not by a long way. It produces horrifically one sided stomps. VERY frequently. Out of every ten games, I'm bottom tier at least six if them with enemy team being statistically superior around seven out of that ten.
But there is significantly less cowardice in the pug queue.

[Novakaine]

I have long been advocating PGI add armored vehicles and planes game.
People like tanks.
People like planes.
Nuff said.

[Mystere]

Scratx, on 31 May 2016 - 06:18 AM, said:

The point is, Mystere, that RNG's influence will be blown out of proportion by those who don't know better ...

That sounds like the current American political climate.

In a more serious note, does that mean we just keep things simple and stupid-proof to satisfy the low-information folks?

[Alan Davion]

KHETTI, on 31 May 2016 - 05:02 AM, said:

Balance wise, in comparison to WoWs, MWO is way way better balanced, imagine assaults as they are now, but give them a repair consumable that recovers 20% of their armor when used.
That's the sort of nonsense that is considered balance over at WoWs, and BB captains still complain about cruisers, wanting HE nerfed, which is ridiculous considering cruisers don't have guns with high enough a caliber to penetrate BB armor with AP.
Same thing goes with DDs.

The thing is pal, those consumables are actually based in fact.

You don't think those bigass battleships and cruisers didn't have people on them to keep them running, especially to repair stuff during a battle?

Damage Control, Repair Party, the newly added Acoustic Sonar and the Radar, Spotter Planes, even the pontoon-equipped Fighter planes on some of the Cruisers and Battleships are all real abilities of those ships, so, what you're saying is the ships shouldn't have any of those?

The point is they make sense for the game, just like the consumables we have for MWO "make sense for the game", PGI will never add a repair consumable for use during battle because it would not make sense...

Of course as I say this I remember almost nothing PGI actually does actually makes sense, but on the other hand, even I have to say PGI is smart enough to realize that adding a repair consumable to MWO would be flipping idiotic.

LordKnightFandragon, on 31 May 2016 - 05:10 AM, said:

WOWS is stupid as ****. Your Battleship that has 72,000 health can be 1 shot just cuz a single shot finds a single spot on the ship, and othertimes you just fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire, as I once did at T2 and do absolutely nothing. WOWS is probably one of the most ******** games I have played........Ofc, in general, i just hate WG and their games, but WOWS, wow, it really takes the cake. Then the RNG on the guns, I once fired like 8 salvoes at a single stationary ship and my guns hit 0 times cuz RNG said LolNO! Then the AI finally drew a bead on me and I was dead inside of 15 seconds.

I don't know what your experience with WoWs has been, but I have never been one shotted in all the BBs I've piloted, even most of the Cruisers I've never been one shotted.

Only recently when I started down the Japanese, then German, then Russian cruiser lines was I ever one shotted, and even then it was because I'd literally just started out in those ships, so they had no upgrades and I wasn't used to them.

I think it's only happened to me maybe a half-dozen times total right now in the last couple months. Twice in the German Dresden, twice in the Russian Bogatyr, and twice in the Japanese Tenryu, that is literally ALL my one-shot deaths.

As far as your problem with the guns... That really sounds like it's your problem and not the guns.

What ship were you in? It sounds like you were in a Cruiser.

What ship were you aiming at? It sounds like you were aiming at a Battleship.

What ammo did you have loaded? It sounds like you had AP loaded, which is useless against BBs if you're aiming at their broadside. Their armor belt is just too thick. You have to aim higher and either have the shells go through the deck, or hit them in their towers.

Were you properly leading and elevating your shots? Because it sounds to me like you weren't. Some ships I agree have absolute ri-donk-ulous RNG hell applied to them. Mainly in the form of the Japanese Battleships. I just recently was able to get rid of my horrid Japanese Kawachi, whose guns would more often fire into the water in front of or over the enemy ship I was shooting at than actually hit it.

Was your ship also stationary relative to the enemy ship? Because it sounds like you weren't. If your ship is moving and theirs isn't, you can just as easily miss. And also, if you were facing off against the AI, there's no way in hell they would have been stationary, the sole exception being if they managed to beach themselves on some island somewhere on the map.

The only time a ship is really stationary for any length of time is when you're facing other players and either one of theirs or one of your teammates ends up disconnected from the match for a minute or two before coming back.

[Corrado]

Jon Gotham, on 31 May 2016 - 06:26 AM, said:

No they don't, not by a long way. It produces horrifically one sided stomps. VERY frequently. Out of every ten games, I'm bottom tier at least six if them with enemy team being statistically superior around seven out of that ten.
But there is significantly less cowardice in the pug queue.

that. there was that mod to view profile stats in the running battle (forgot the name). that gave you a quick summary of who to support and who to avoid.

http://www.noobmeter...rade/500221890/

also found my last game stats.. just hilarious.

[LordKnightFandragon]

StaggerCheck, on 31 May 2016 - 06:13 AM, said:

World of Tanks probably has had two million people create accounts and try the game, but they certainly do not have two million regular players. Last time I played the North American West server, there were 9800 players playing.

MechWarrior: Online will have the same situation, but with far lower numbers. It is as if they don't want to advertise right now because they know the game is unpolished. Having said that, creating a 100k tournament is sure to create some buzz at some point. Would be nice if we saw some banner ads in the future as other games have done.

MWO, holding the record for the longest time still in beta?

[Fut]

Delta 62, on 30 May 2016 - 07:25 PM, said:

[color=#CCCCCC]Need more Marketing[/color]

Maybe we should Grassroots things for PGI.
Everybody in this thread should print out 100 ads for MWO and hang them around the city where they live.
Poles around Hobby Shops/Game Stores/Internet Cafes (those still exist?) would be a good place to start.

[CMDR Sunset Shimmer]

Delta 62, on 30 May 2016 - 07:25 PM, said:

I saw a commercial the other day on television for World of Tanks. It was 45 seconds long and mentioned that it had almost 2 million players.

Why don't we see the same results with this game?

Do we need to kick start the advertising department for Mechwarrior?

This is what I interpreted from all the comments.

• Need more Marketing
  
• Target the marketing onto the right audience (fans of.... "robots...")
  
• Cut and run from countries that simply have no interest (in terms of advertising). And concentrate on areas that likey the robots.
  
• And increase server quality to areas of the globe that have people who want to play. I meet lots of interesting people when I have all the region boxes checked. However, they sometimes just.... have a bad connection. And they are stuck with it.
  
• Rethink the third person view argument. Its not worth risking financial stability because people "just have to have third person be ineffective."
  
• And more money to do this stuff!! visit a loan shark, or find some investors! team up with Megabot and that other company that's doing the tabletop game thing.

Tell me if there is more to add.

Because Tanks. And Russia.

enough said.

[Fate 6]

Initial population is because of tanks being more relatable than mechs, but the huge difference in population over time is because PGI can't manage a game (buggy, horribly optimized, stale gameplay, bad matchmaker).

[Khobai]

armor actually means something in WoT too

unlike MWO where armor is pretty much useless because even an assault dies in less than 5 seconds

[Mavairo]

LordKnightFandragon, on 31 May 2016 - 05:10 AM, said:

WOWS is stupid as ****. Your Battleship that has 72,000 health can be 1 shot just cuz a single shot finds a single spot on the ship, and othertimes you just fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire and fire, as I once did at T2 and do absolutely nothing. WOWS is probably one of the most ******** games I have played........Ofc, in general, i just hate WG and their games, but WOWS, wow, it really takes the cake. Then the RNG on the guns, I once fired like 8 salvoes at a single stationary ship and my guns hit 0 times cuz RNG said LolNO! Then the AI finally drew a bead on me and I was dead inside of 15 seconds.

You gotta be real bad at WOWs then.

I have yet to be one shot, Ever in a BB and I've been playing WOWs since CBT.
Angling your ship, is critical to your survival in WOWs, as is varying your speed and not sailing in mindless straight lines.

You actually have to lead your targets in WOWs, unlike this game which is a mindless point and click fest by comparison. You have to adjust for your movement, their ships movements, where they are likely to dodge your own shots.

You have to pay attention to the map, and your surroundings at all times (and not drive in solely binocular vision).

While managing to dodge, Bombers, Torpedo bombers, and destroyer and cruiser torpedoes.

If you do all of this well, especially in a Battleship, you are near unto an invincible god of war, that the entire team can push behind with near impunity. Or if you do die, it takes several minutes of constant focus fire in order for them to pull it off.

This isn't even a particularly good game of mine. I consider it a middle of the road at best match for me in the New Mexico.

WOWs has it's flaws, but it's not a bad game by any stretch.

Sure there's some RNG....but honestly most of your hits, and the quality of match you have is squarely on you as a captain. Especially in a BB as you have the second largest direct impact on the battlefield.

There's alot MWO can take from WOWs/WOT honestly and it would end up a better game for it.

Edited by Mavairo, 31 May 2016 - 08:22 AM.

[Trauglodyte]

Delta 62, on 30 May 2016 - 07:25 PM, said:

I saw a commercial the other day on television for World of Tanks. It was 45 seconds long and mentioned that it had almost 2 million players.

Why don't we see the same results with this game?

Do we need to kick start the advertising department for Mechwarrior?

This is what I interpreted from all the comments.

• Need more Marketing
  
• Target the marketing onto the right audience (fans of.... "robots...")
  
• Cut and run from countries that simply have no interest (in terms of advertising). And concentrate on areas that likey the robots.
  
• And increase server quality to areas of the globe that have people who want to play. I meet lots of interesting people when I have all the region boxes checked. However, they sometimes just.... have a bad connection. And they are stuck with it.
  
• Rethink the third person view argument. Its not worth risking financial stability because people "just have to have third person be ineffective."
  
• And more money to do this stuff!! visit a loan shark, or find some investors! team up with Megabot and that other company that's doing the tabletop game thing.

Tell me if there is more to add.

2 million players could mean a lot of things:

• 2 million players have played the game since release
  
• 2 million different player accounts have been created
  
• 2 million players play WoT during peak hours

The funny thing about numbers is that they can mean damned near anything. MW:O could say that it had something like X million players and it wouldn't be wrong. That doesn't mean that there are X million people playing every day.

[LordKnightFandragon]

Novakaine, on 31 May 2016 - 06:28 AM, said:

I have long been advocating PGI add armored vehicles and planes game.
People like tanks.
People like planes.
Nuff said.

Yeah, in a Coop PVE setting. 4 players per team, or you can go with the 12 man raids, complete with AI tanks, mechs, planes, dropships, artillery vehicles...the whole gambit.

Mavairo, on 31 May 2016 - 08:20 AM, said:

You gotta be real bad at WOWs then.

I have yet to be one shot, Ever in a BB and I've been playing WOWs since CBT.
Angling your ship, is critical to your survival in WOWs, as is varying your speed and not sailing in mindless straight lines.

You actually have to lead your targets in WOWs, unlike this game which is a mindless point and click fest by comparison. You have to adjust for your movement, their ships movements, where they are likely to dodge your own shots.

You have to pay attention to the map, and your surroundings at all times (and not drive in solely binocular vision).

While managing to dodge, Bombers, Torpedo bombers, and destroyer and cruiser torpedoes.

If you do all of this well, especially in a Battleship, you are near unto an invincible god of war, that the entire team can push behind with near impunity. Or if you do die, it takes several minutes of constant focus fire in order for them to pull it off.

This isn't even a particularly good game of mine. I consider it a middle of the road at best match for me in the New Mexico.

WOWs has it's flaws, but it's not a bad game by any stretch.

Sure there's some RNG....but honestly most of your hits, and the quality of match you have is squarely on you as a captain. Especially in a BB as you have the second largest direct impact on the battlefield.

There's alot MWO can take from WOWs/WOT honestly and it would end up a better game for it.

I am not even past T2 in that game, I got bored to tears real quick for starters, then the RNG ****, yeah, it drove me batty. As for leading my targets, I know, my very first game I scored top of my team by a mile, though it was a loss lol....I was like the only one doing anything.

I was one shot by a torpedo, but that was cuz I wasnt paying attention, but yeah, overall, I find that game just ******** as hell.

It looks like it might be aight if we can get past the low tier ****, but its a Wargaming game and after WOT, I really loathe WG...