15 replies to this topic

[Anunknownlurker]

I can't see the point in conquest at the moment. Most of the games recently have just been played as skirmish, kill the other team then cap. So why not just have skirmish?

There is very little point in a light capping because you rarely gather enough points to win by the time your team has been wiped by the furball and there are very few maps big enough for you to hide if you are ahead on points.

The line that conquest promotes mobility is, clearly, not accurate. I've watched a few of the tournament games and they pretty much follow the same pattern. A bit of maneuvering around to get into position, then a fire fight, then whoever's left caps if they need to. The only reason to cap is to make sure you are ahead on points (how many times do you see more than 1 or 2 points being capped?)

I don't see any more flowing battles in conquest than I do in skirmish and, frankly, it seems to me the only point in conquest seems to be to stop that occasional game where a Cheetah or Pirate's Bane is the last mech standing on the losing team and runs and hides.

TL:DR - do we really need conquest AND skirmish since the both play out the same way most of the time?

[El Bandito]

Conquest offers extra 52,000 C-Bills per win. Hence I prefer Conquest. The mode that is not needed is Domination, as it encourages everything that is bad about the gameplay (deathballing at a single spot). Seriously, people are dumb to vote Domination.

Edited by El Bandito, 05 June 2016 - 08:21 AM.

[Anunknownlurker]

@El Bandito - I didn't include the increased rewards for conquest in my OP as that is pretty irrelevant; PGI could just as easily increase the reward for skirmish and reduce the difference.

If I remember rightly, they only increased the conquest reward after voting came in and very few conquest games were voted for; the increase was put in to encourage people to choose the game mode, that told me something about how sub-optimal conquest game play was!

[Antares102]

All game modes except skirmish are pointless as long as there is no respawn.
Without respawn its always deathballing because everything else weakens your team.
Even a locust in the deathball is better than running around alone to cap in conquest.

Edited by Antares102, 04 June 2016 - 04:03 AM.

[D V Devnull]

<*reads thread*>

I would say the unnecessary mode is Skirmish, and therefore Skirmish should be removed. The only way that mode ends is with someone ALWAYS feeling the hurt, because that mode generally ends up with people just getting too close to each other, and then one team just getting dead. On top of that, all the previous MechWarrior games I have been able to play before MWO always involved objectives within the maps, so Skirmish just doesn't feel in the spirit of MechWarrior at all to me.

~D. V. "Skirmish should be the one to die." Devnull

[Xetelian]

Jimmy DiGriz, on 04 June 2016 - 03:49 AM, said:

@El Bandito - I didn't include the increased rewards for conquest in my OP as that is pretty irrelevant; PGI could just as easily increase the reward for skirmish and reduce the difference.

If I remember rightly, they only increased the conquest reward after voting came in and very few conquest games were voted for; the increase was put in to encourage people to choose the game mode, that told me something about how sub-optimal conquest game play was!

As far as I remember, and I'm not a mental wizard, but I think conquest has always had a bonus to win since like back as far as rewards 2.0 began.



I prefer any mode that can be won without killing everyone. Soooo many skirmish matches end up going 5-10 minutes too long while people search for the shutdown mech without having BAP.


When I leveled up Light mechs and some mediums I checked ONLY the conquest box because I felt more useful when I could run and cap a point. I've won quite a few matches by capping one point and hiding and any match I win with less mechs than the opponent is a fun match to me.

[Mcgral18]

El Bandito, on 04 June 2016 - 03:44 AM, said:

Conquest offers extra 52,000 C-Bills per win. Hence I prefer Conquest. The mode that is not needed is Domination, as it encourages everything that is bad about the gameplay. Seriously, people are dumb to vote Domination.

It's nice on Therma and Polar, as it forces people to go to a specific location, and not use the grand majority of the map.



Seriously, I'm thankful for that on Polar. I don't normally have range builds and its so much more convenient than to chase Reds.

[Yellonet]

El Bandito, on 04 June 2016 - 03:44 AM, said:

Conquest offers extra 52,000 C-Bills per win. Hence I prefer Conquest. The mode that is not needed is Domination, as it encourages everything that is bad about the gameplay. Seriously, people are dumb to vote Domination.

Domination is still better than skirmish as that often ends with someone running away and powering down.

[Alistair Winter]

I agree. It's not completely without merit, but it's still one of the worst game modes in modern FPS games. And due to the way maps are designed and the way conquest bases are placed, the matches often end up as Skirmish where everyone yells at the damn lights (even when it's a single Adder) for not capping.

I also think a lot fewer people would vote for Conquest if Skirmish and Assault had random spawns / drop zones. A lot of people are probably voting just for the sake of fighting in different areas of the map (e.g. Alpine)

[Ace Selin]

This whole game is designed for rabbits to kill rabbits anything else is superfluous.

[ice trey]

Once upon a time, Conquest actually had a point. Capping a point didn't take very long at all, and it was very much possible for a mech to run off and cap a point on it's own within 30 or so seconds. Or travel as a pack of two to watch each others' backs. It had a point because the more players you took off the roles in order to cap, the fewer you had to meet the mass of other 'mechs. A force with tunnel vision who didn't consider going off to headhunt the opposing cappers would often find themselves killing off 11/12 opponents, and then losing to point cap. It made sense, and though it was still just glorified deathmatch, it required much more tactical thinking.

Of course, the player base HATED it and unchecked it from the map modes section. The player count went way down, and everyone griped about why "killing the other team isn't the main goal". PGI caved, Jacked the dials for capture time up to 11, and essentially rendered the point of the game mode moot, turning Conquest into "Deathmatch but at least now you can do something other than chase that one surviving ECM raven around the whole map."

Honestly, for all the foot dragging that PGI does, I put all blame on the community for the lack of new and varied game modes. All they want is deathmatch, so PGI is happy to oblige by doing ****-all in the new-game-modes department. Last thing they want to do is spend ages making another game mode, god forbid something where "Kill everybody" isn't the primary objective, only to have the community piss all over them for all their hard work.

[YourSaviorLegion]

El Bandito, on 04 June 2016 - 03:44 AM, said:

Conquest offers extra 52,000 C-Bills per win. Hence I prefer Conquest. The mode that is not needed is Domination, as it encourages everything that is bad about the gameplay. Seriously, people are dumb to vote Domination.

What I hate about domination is that circle isn't well placed on certain maps, one team has a total advantage over the other like on Bog, Plexus and Crimson.

[Davers]

ice trey, on 05 June 2016 - 04:34 AM, said:

Once upon a time, Conquest actually had a point. Capping a point didn't take very long at all, and it was very much possible for a mech to run off and cap a point on it's own within 30 or so seconds. Or travel as a pack of two to watch each others' backs. It had a point because the more players you took off the roles in order to cap, the fewer you had to meet the mass of other 'mechs. A force with tunnel vision who didn't consider going off to headhunt the opposing cappers would often find themselves killing off 11/12 opponents, and then losing to point cap. It made sense, and though it was still just glorified deathmatch, it required much more tactical thinking.

Of course, the player base HATED it and unchecked it from the map modes section. The player count went way down, and everyone griped about why &quot;killing the other team isn't the main goal&quot;. PGI caved, Jacked the dials for capture time up to 11, and essentially rendered the point of the game mode moot, turning Conquest into &quot;Deathmatch but at least now you can do something other than chase that one surviving ECM raven around the whole map.&quot;

Honestly, for all the foot dragging that PGI does, I put all blame on the community for the lack of new and varied game modes. All they want is deathmatch, so PGI is happy to oblige by doing ****-all in the new-game-modes department. Last thing they want to do is spend ages making another game mode, god forbid something where &quot;Kill everybody&quot; isn't the primary objective, only to have the community piss all over them for all their hard work.

While there is some truth to what you say, the other side of the coin is that PGI doesn't understand their own game, gamers in general, or how to make fun game modes.

Edited by Davers, 05 June 2016 - 05:26 AM.

[Nyte Kitsune]

Conquest is NOT pointless.. Actually conquest is one of my prefered match types. I prefer more objective based gameplay, which is what Conquest is. It adds a more RP like aspect to the match, ever read the novels? Its rarely just about mech vs mech combat, and thats what I like. Something to do while hunting other mechs, not just hunting mechs which gets boring fast.

Of course modes like Conquest and Assault (Once bases/turrets are added back in) are better suited for larger maps where you have to cover more ground and plan your attack route. For some, this isn't fun, they just want to shoot stuff, hence skirmish, but others like myself prefer objectives, or both. Just a matter of preference, just because you don't like objectives, doesn't mean others think as you do. If you don't like objectives, don't vote for it, but don't complain when you do get those matches, its part of the game.

If you want a game thats only mech vs mech skirmishes.. go make your own game.

[Mystere]

YourSaviorLegion, on 05 June 2016 - 04:39 AM, said:

What I hate about domination is that circle isn't well placed on certain maps, one team has a total advantage over the other like on Bog, Plexus and Crimson.

My gripe with domination is that it again encourages mostly mindless fighting at the center. Why can't PGI put that darned beacon off-center? Take Alpine Peaks for example. Why not put it at the top of the easternmost hill and adjust the spawn points accordingly?

[Jackal Noble]

http://mwomercs.com/...3-just-imagine/
Not self padding, just totally relevant, check my last post on that thread. That would spice up conquest. Would only need tank assets and some primitive AI, everything else could be used from what's in game. I think it would work great, that is, until all the tanks get stuck on a rock...

Edited by JackalBeast, 05 June 2016 - 06:43 AM.