46 replies to this topic

[Wintersdark]

totgeboren, on 20 June 2016 - 04:07 AM, said:

But this issue of missing data was around long before the Quirkening.
Also, I have 3 registered games using an C-AC20 on mechs with no quirks relating to the c-uac20, with 16 shots fired and 14 hitting. That's both waaaay less games than I have used that gun in (it's at least 50 games), and my hit-rate with the U-AC20 is not even close to 90%, because I suck using it!

Hence why the stats aren't very good for one person, but used in aggregate they're still valuable. 16 uac20 shots is too small a sample size, but Karl isn't I retested in individuals. So, that's just adding onto aggregate data, and is fine.



Do Clan UAC's count as 1 shot per trigger (see: lasers), so it's 1 shot/1 hit if only one shell hits? Or like missiles, where its 1 shot/1hit *per missile*?

[Wintersdark]

Widowmaker1981, on 20 June 2016 - 05:12 AM, said:

Artemis has always been a waste on LRMs, because most of the time you want to be using indirect fire where it doesnt work, so the tonnage and slots arent worth it. If you are mostly using LRMs in a direct fire (LOS) mode, you should be using ACs or lasers in the first place, since they are enormously better...

Not relevant to the discussion.

I know, and agree, but let's not get into "how you should be using (this weapon). That's utterly irrelevant.



With that said, it's highly probable that the stats are the way they are because most LRM's ARE fired indirectly. As such, most aLRM fire isn't benefitting from Artemis anyways. Hard to say, really.

[Karl Streiger]

Wintersdark, on 20 June 2016 - 05:12 AM, said:

Do Clan UAC's count as 1 shot per trigger (see: lasers), so it's 1 shot/1 hit if only one shell hits? Or like missiles, where its 1 shot/1hit *per missile*?

They count as full damage a UAC20 / AC20 burst is 1 shot in the stats but for the accuracy its count as 4 (was) 5 shots.
Same with LBX 1 shot - but it is 2-20 pellets.

Missiles instead count as missile - so firing 1 SRM6 = 6 missiles -of course sometimes your LRM numbers are not divided by 5/10/15/20 - maybe your Mech got destroyed or ammunition was empty or other stuff happened.

[totgeboren]

Well, given margins of error and so on (though 56 players is a pretty big sample size), Art for Clan LRMs seems to... in the best of circumstances not work, though likely it actually reduces accuracy. Perhaps this is why my LRM Warhawk never worked? I should try it without art...
Though more likely it didn't work because it's an LRM Warhawk.

Edited by totgeboren, 20 June 2016 - 12:08 PM.

[Corrado]

Widowmaker1981, on 20 June 2016 - 05:12 AM, said:

Artemis has always been a waste on LRMs, because most of the time you want to be using indirect fire where it doesnt work, so the tonnage and slots arent worth it. If you are mostly using LRMs in a direct fire (LOS) mode, you should be using ACs or lasers in the first place, since they are enormously better...

tonnage and slots are worth if using few big launchers (3 or 4xLRM15-20). there is no reason to put artemis on LRM5 and 10.
BUT last time i ran a LRMcrow with NARC+4xALRM10, i was pretty much hitting ST CT almost all the time.(given the target didnt twist). i wouldnt use art on IS LRM10- for sure.

Edited by Corrado, 20 June 2016 - 06:59 AM.

[Widowmaker1981]

totgeboren, on 20 June 2016 - 05:33 AM, said:

Well, given margins of error and so on (though 56 players is a pretty big sample size), Art for Clan LRMs seems to... in the best of circumstances not work, though likely it actually reduces accuracy. Perhaps this is why my LRM Warhawk never worked? I should try it without art...
Though more likely if didn't work because it's an LRM Warhawk.

Warhawk is one of the better LRM mechs in the game, since it can run 5xC-MPL or 2xLPL 2xERML or something as backup weapons. Artemis is USELESS for LRMs, always has been and always will be unless they make it work when out of LOS.

[Karl Streiger]

So there it is - finally finished a temporary table that includes all relevant data (ok it exclude velocity, spread and effect of duration for the damage and accuracy) rather than to calculate them I use your player data (to calculate them is the next step)
Considering the ability to deal damage based on weight, heat and ammunition as well as DPS and pinpoint ability (a fast firing pinpoint weapon gets really good values)


It isn't a surprise that Clan Weapons (without IS Quirks) are mostly superior, and the UACs are the best. Simple because the ability to deal much damage really fast is not much limited by the chance to get a jam. Actually, this random mechanism is not very smooth. Because you can't calculate them properly ... when you don't have a jam - those guns will obliterate any target much faster than any other weapons.
The worst weapon is the IS LRM20 with Artemis just to understand the margin it's ~20 for the C-UAC20 vs 0.2 for the ISALRM20 - like the UAC I think the issue here is the mechanism.

Best energy weapon is the Clan Small Pulse Laser (good weapon/damage profile) same for the IS Medium Pulse Laser. Both around 12 points.

maybe to get a better picture I need to use "real mechs" and calculate their effectivity for heat and ammunition as well as boating