34 replies to this topic

[Nerdboard]

Why exactly does it need quirks?

It has decent to good hitboxes, tons of hardpoints and an amazing engine cap and insane mobility quirks (seriously PGI, why dont you just buff accel/deccel on all mechs already?). I dont have one myself but playing against it I felt like it was in a good place. Only problem I could see is that the arms are going to be used for shielding while containing much of the weaponry. So maybe some more structure on the arms. Offensive quirks will just make it likely to become a steroid-mech.

[Tapdancing Kerensky]

If you have trouble against a phoenix hawk or think they're in a good place then I don't know what to tell you.

To me they're basically freebies.

[Dogstar]

I think that there won't be any buffs to the PXH quirks, I think that what were seeing is the new level of quirks for all mechs and I expect that they will reduce many others.

[FLG 01]

Nerdboard, on 01 July 2016 - 11:14 PM, said:

Why exactly does it need quirks?

It has decent to good hitboxes, tons of hardpoints and an amazing engine cap and insane mobility quirks (seriously PGI, why dont you just buff accel/deccel on all mechs already?). I dont have one myself but playing against it I felt like it was in a good place. Only problem I could see is that the arms are going to be used for shielding while containing much of the weaponry. So maybe some more structure on the arms. Offensive quirks will just make it likely to become a steroid-mech.

"tons of hardpoints"... really? The majority of the variants are hardpoint starved as using the ballistics is rarely a good idea (not enough of them for MG madness, which is niche itself; and ACs are too heavy to be used effectively). Only the -1K and the -2 are good when it comes to HP, and they pay for it with the de facto absence of offensive quirks.

I am the last to say the Phoenix Hawk would be a bad Mech because I can use it very well, playing it to its strengths (which is speed combined with ECM or more speed, aka MASC). And a good deal of the problems players have is caused by refusing to use this strength, slowing down the Mech too much, and using copy&paste builds which naturally work much better on other Mechs.

However quirks are part of the problem, too, and the Mech does need better quirks. All variants need structure quirks for the arms and many overheat quickly thus heat gen quirks are needed too. I personally would love to see even more mobility quirks for my favourite, the PXH-3S, to emphasize its speed-over-firepower doctrine even more.

[Darky101]

Bump!

Guess we who bought Phoenix can screw ourselfs!
New sale and new preorder options out but no help for the armles Phoenix...

[Bud Crue]

Dogstar, on 02 July 2016 - 12:17 AM, said:

I think that there won't be any buffs to the PXH quirks, I think that what were seeing is the new level of quirks for all mechs and I expect that they will reduce many others.

I agree.
In re the PHX, I cannot imagine that they will give it quirks to the level of a BJ nor to a Vindi. Without such quirks it will be essentially a slightly less powerful version of either one but a bit faster, and with ECM. That's the balance. Only thing I expect is a bit more structure in the arms. Doubt they will change much else.

[Darky101]

Bud Crue, on 08 July 2016 - 05:52 AM, said:

I agree.
In re the PHX, I cannot imagine that they will give it quirks to the level of a BJ nor to a Vindi. Without such quirks it will be essentially a slightly less powerful version of either one but a bit faster, and with ECM. That's the balance. Only thing I expect is a bit more structure in the arms. Doubt they will change much else.

Arm structure would probably be enough but the fact that you buy something then have to wait for it to actualy be viable or fixed is obscene... say i sell you a monitor that turns out to be faulty and I make you wait a Year before fixing it....would you buy my other merchandise while you wait?

[MeiSooHaityu]

Darky101, on 08 July 2016 - 05:42 AM, said:

Bump!

Guess we who bought Phoenix can screw ourselfs!
New sale and new preorder options out but no help for the armles Phoenix...

Soon.

[MeiSooHaityu]

OK, to be serious...

All Phoenix Hawks could use structure buffs to arms and possibly legs.

Weapon quirks on the PXH-1K should be similar to a Hunchback 4P (maybe a bit less). I could see 10% bonus (give or take 5%) to heat gen, duration, cool down, and possibly range. Basically something on par with the 4P and Cicada.

The PXH-1B seems solid for weapon quirks, but possibly a small additional heat gen quirk for the PPCs. Not much (again about 10%), but something extra. Maybe just a general 10% heat gen quirk for all energy.

The PXH-1 could use some ballistic buffs. It needs something along the lines of the Vindicator 1X but even more IMO (since ballistics aren't grouped together). I'm thinking Ballistic Velocity of 25%, Ballistic Cool down of 30%, and possibly add an ultra jam chance reduction of 30% or 40%. I'd leave the energy quirks off, but with the additional heat from more rapid ballistics, maybe a rate of heat loss buff of 6% (same as VND-1X).

Something along those lines may be adequate.

[Bud Crue]

Darky101, on 08 July 2016 - 05:59 AM, said:

Arm structure would probably be enough but the fact that you buy something then have to wait for it to actualy be viable or fixed is obscene... say i sell you a monitor that turns out to be faulty and I make you wait a Year before fixing it....would you buy my other merchandise while you wait?

atm: NO, hell no.

Historically I have a bad track record though. I've been known to sell mechs that I just bought, for any of a variety of reasons; only to re-buy them again just out of boredom to build something new...and then sell them again. Since April I have vowed to spend no more money on this game so I can't answer your question. But honestly if Russ hadn't pissed me off, sure I'd buy more merchandise while I wait for this particular merch to be "fixed". I knew what I was buying when I bought the PHX: a nostalgia mech that is redundant and likely to be mediocre or substandard compared to others of similar weight and/or load out. Well whad-iya-know...

[Voq]

The only problem with this thread is no one can answer this question: and PGI almost never does on the forums for whatever reason.
So the conversation keeps going back to *should* it get quirks? What kind? Etc.

If that's what you want, then by all means. But no one can answer when. You can guess and speculate, but that's all just vapour if we're honest.

[Gas Guzzler]

Darky101, on 30 June 2016 - 04:12 AM, said:

So what do you guys predict?
With the leaderboard event over when can we expect any kind of buff to the PXH?
How long before they proccess all the data?


What kind of buffs do you think would be most optimal to actualy make it viable?

YES we all agree it needs arm structure, how much do you think would be balanced?

The PXH-1 maybe AC10 quirks while keeping the medlas cooldown maybe?
Thats the build I-ve had most succes with in this variant of the PXH.

They wont change hardpoints so it will probably be just quirks.

A couple people tweeted to Russ how they enjoy it, so never.

[Darky101]

Voq, on 08 July 2016 - 07:04 AM, said:

The only problem with this thread is no one can answer this question: and PGI almost never does on the forums for whatever reason.
So the conversation keeps going back to *should* it get quirks? What kind? Etc.

If that's what you want, then by all means. But no one can answer when. You can guess and speculate, but that's all just vapour if we're honest.

You are probably right!
I just hope they read theyre own forums.

[Boulangerie]

I think one of the problems with the Phoenix Hawk getting fixed quicker was the Archer situation. A lot more people purchased the Archer (I believe) and complained when it was released.

There were numerous threads about how the PHX would be underpowered minus quirks, and therefore I think the sales on it were a lot lower. I think the KDK outsold it by quite a bit as well.

It definitely does need help, although I'd go out on a limb to say it isn't completely borked. I'm really hoping it gets some help in the July 19th patch, but I'd love to see a little more love in a thread like this.

Look, this is just one of many Archer complaint threads, and this one has 15 pages of discussion
http://mwomercs.com/...right-puzzling/

[Darky101]

So most of the Phoenix hawks get 7 arm structure..... thtats not a life saver change..... its a dead mech walking....