7 replies to this topic

[Honiara]

Groups vs Solo - Taking from the round table and my experience of both FP/QP is that stomps are not fun, in the QP solo queue, yes stomps happen, but at least you know it's because they either had better tactics, better players or a little luck, and not because they are a large organised group on external comms.

Now QP does have MM, and we are fully aware that the CW/FW player numbers do not support MM at this time, so what else can we do? Well the other balancing factor that PGI has implemented in the QP group queue is tonnage limits per group, please see http://mwomercs.com/...tonnage-values/ for tonnage details. Why not implement the same function into CW/FW? This can be based on the size of each group prior to joining the queue so that your drop deck can be customized in advance. A suggestion to group size and tonnage limit is listed out below.

Groups Size , Min Tonnage , Max Tonnage
1, 220 , 260
2, 220 , 260
3, 220 , 260
4, 220 , 260
5, 200 , 240
6, 200 , 240
7, 200 , 240
8, 200 , 240
9, 180 , 220
10, 180 , 220
11, 180 , 220
12, 180 , 220

Having the drop deck tonnage change with every group size is unrealistic, as many groups will fluctuate in size over the course of a given evening and having to change your drop deck every other game would be cumbersome and boring, so my suggestion is that groups of 1-4, 5-8 and 9-12 have the same drop deck allowance.

An example of these drop decks would as follows: All calculations are done using the max allowed drop deck tonnage, in my experience it seems that most people seem to want to take the maximum allowed tonnage or as close to it as their drop deck allows.

Example Team 1:
12 x Solo players
12 x 260 tonnes = 3,120 tonnes of total team weight

Example Team 2:
1 x 12man group
12 x 220 tonnes = 2,640 tonnes of total team weight

Example Team 3:
1 x 5man group
1 x 7man group
5 x 240 tonnes = 1,200 tonnes +
7 x 240 tonnes = 1,680 tonnes
Would give this team 2880 tonnes of total team weight.

So this does generate another issue of the 'Wolf-Pack' but this can be alleviated with increase in base defenses and the increase in the damage a drop ship does, currently the drop ship weapon's do not stop spawn camping, which was the entire reason for putting weapons on the drop ships in the first place, I would suggest that the drop ship needs to do 3-4 times it's current damage to be effective and having a good 2 times the number of base defenses.

I know the above suggestion does not change much in regards to the numbers of people playing FW/CW but it would help remove some of the advantages that groups have over solo players especially large groups. The above suggestion function has worked to some extend in QP so I see little reason to not implement this into FW/CW.

Edited by Honiara, 30 July 2016 - 01:43 PM.

[Chuck Jager]

groups always move to the front of the line so you could still do 4 groups of 3 and move out if it did not work and change your sizes to avoid teaming with the pugs.

Also we have seen times where either IS or Clan has a clear advantage in a certain weight but is countered by the other sides 10 tons less mech. This could be a real issue for one side or another with the bigger groups using their OP mechs with less of an impact on their power.

I could see a limit on groups as no more than 6 in a single group or no more than 8-10 with multiple groups of certain sizes.

12 mans could put out a challenge that would need to be met in under a certain time period or X happens (could see no way to not upset everyone at this point)

[Mystere]

An organized faction can easily game your proposed tonnage limits if they so desired.

[Lykaon]

Honiara, on 30 July 2016 - 01:36 PM, said:

Groups vs Solo - Taking from the round table and my experience of both FP/QP is that stomps are not fun, in the QP solo queue, yes stomps happen, but at least you know it's because they either had better tactics, better players or a little luck, and not because they are a large organised group on external comms.

Now QP does have MM, and we are fully aware that the CW/FW player numbers do not support MM at this time, so what else can we do? Well the other balancing factor that PGI has implemented in the QP group queue is tonnage limits per group, please see http://mwomercs.com/...tonnage-values/ for tonnage details. Why not implement the same function into CW/FW? This can be based on the size of each group prior to joining the queue so that your drop deck can be customized in advance. A suggestion to group size and tonnage limit is listed out below.

Groups Size , Min Tonnage , Max Tonnage
1, 220 , 260
2, 220 , 260
3, 220 , 260
4, 220 , 260
5, 200 , 240
6, 200 , 240
7, 200 , 240
8, 200 , 240
9, 180 , 220
10, 180 , 220
11, 180 , 220
12, 180 , 220

Having the drop deck tonnage change with every group size is unrealistic, as many groups will fluctuate in size over the course of a given evening and having to change your drop deck every other game would be cumbersome and boring, so my suggestion is that groups of 1-4, 5-8 and 9-12 have the same drop deck allowance.

An example of these drop decks would as follows: All calculations are done using the max allowed drop deck tonnage, in my experience it seems that most people seem to want to take the maximum allowed tonnage or as close to it as their drop deck allows.

Example Team 1:
12 x Solo players
12 x 260 tonnes = 3,120 tonnes of total team weight

Example Team 2:
1 x 12man group
12 x 220 tonnes = 2,640 tonnes of total team weight

Example Team 3:
1 x 5man group
1 x 7man group
5 x 240 tonnes = 1,200 tonnes +
7 x 240 tonnes = 1,680 tonnes
Would give this team 2880 tonnes of total team weight.

So this does generate another issue of the 'Wolf-Pack' but this can be alleviated with increase in base defenses and the increase in the damage a drop ship does, currently the drop ship weapon's do not stop spawn camping, which was the entire reason for putting weapons on the drop ships in the first place, I would suggest that the drop ship needs to do 3-4 times it's current damage to be effective and having a good 2 times the number of base defenses.

I know the above suggestion does not change much in regards to the numbers of people playing FW/CW but it would help remove some of the advantages that groups have over solo players especially large groups. The above suggestion function has worked to some extend in QP so I see little reason to not implement this into FW/CW.

Or FW solo players can use the in game comms and command wheel and ALSO be a large organized group.

[Ace Selin]

Mystere, on 30 July 2016 - 08:55 PM, said:

An organized faction can easily game your proposed tonnage limits if they so desired.

Sync drop 12 individuals all on the same TS.

[Honiara]

Chuck Jager, on 30 July 2016 - 08:47 PM, said:

Also we have seen times where either IS or Clan has a clear advantage in a certain weight but is countered by the other sides 10 tons less mech. This could be a real issue for one side or another with the bigger groups using their OP mechs with less of an impact on their power.

Yes this is true, but this is not an issue caused by the above suggestion, what you have said is a mech balancing issue, with the current 250 tonnes for both IS and CLAN the same issue exists, this is simple a suggestion to remove some of the power large groups have.

Mystere, on 30 July 2016 - 08:55 PM, said:

An organized faction can easily game your proposed tonnage limits if they so desired.

Yes true, same can be said for the QP queue, not entirly sure how often it happens. Let's not forget that alot of systems can be gammed (looking at yor ghost heat)

gh0s7m3rc, on 30 July 2016 - 10:51 PM, said:

This sort of limit would seriously complicate things for PUG's using the LFG.

Really? does it complicate things for PUGs in the QP queue?

Lykaon, on 30 July 2016 - 11:50 PM, said:

Or FW solo players can use the in game comms and command wheel and ALSO be a large organized group.

This is such a silly resoponse, in game players that use VoIP are never as organised as a 12man premade, a 12 man premade can organise and sync drop 12 KDKs on drop 1 for instance where the PUGs dont have time for that.

Premade groups are almost guaranteed to be able to speak the same language, and all have microphones. In game groups rarely have more than half the team willing / able to speak.

Ace Selin, on 31 July 2016 - 12:09 AM, said:

Sync drop 12 individuals all on the same TS.

Yes possible, but also likely to end up as a 11man or a 10man in this instance, 2 much work perhaps for a single game, lots of systems can be game'd if desired.