28 replies to this topic

[DerMaulwurf]

DrxAbstract, on 19 August 2016 - 01:08 AM, said:

A few more heat sinks that you're going to put... where? And with what tonnage? Most builds capable of the mid-40's to low-60's Laser-based Alphas are already maxed out on space and tonnage and can only manage 2-3 back-to-back Alphas with another after a few seconds of cooling down. This is entirely absent of Ghost Heat penalty, mind you.

Those same builds will, when firing Alphas, incur an additional 5(40dmg) to 17(64dmg) Heat per shot. For IS Laser vomits that have a dissipation of 3.59H/Sec(18 DHS) to 4.23H/Sec(22 DHS), that's an average extra 1-4 seconds of recovery time per Alpha--That is absolutely huge in a brawl and heavy fighting scenarios. The only time it would really go unnoticed is during those slow-paced exchanges. But the moment you get into the sh** you're definitely going to notice the difference, as in you can still drop a couple (2-3) bombs on the first guy that comes at you, but unlike now, you wont be winding up another, popping coolshot and dropping one more before having to back off. You'll either have to stagger your shots or take less of them... That's a mighty impressive leash for Laser vomits in general, the KDK and a smattering of others.

In the end, bads will be bads and good players will still wreck faces... /shrug.

So we move to a different meta and builds will have to adapt to it. It's definitely likely that having to exchange some firepower for more heat dissipation will send lasers down the food chain. But I think that the issue here is rather that the first draft treats beamtime weapons the same as frontloaded weapons.

If we just increase the energy cap, the main beneficaries will be PPFLD builds. Especially since the design appears to drive a shift back to these metas anyway.

[Yellonet]

I've tried several builds in the PTS, and I've yet to account any problem. Have you whiners even tested?

[Rayden Wolf]

Yellonet, on 19 August 2016 - 03:50 AM, said:

I've tried several builds in the PTS, and I've yet to account any problem. Have you whiners even tested?

Maybe because 4on4? Open a lobby and tey it in a real battle. This restriction is pretty stupid and the event tops even that.

[FupDup]

PPCs, Gauss, Dakka.

Assaults are using those loadouts above very effectively in the PTS.

Many matches pretty much come down to which team has the most assaults with those loadouts.

[Foxwalker]

His Holiness Pope Buster, on 18 August 2016 - 08:30 PM, said:

What about tying the alpha cap to the mech class/tonnage? For example, lights - 30 damage, mediums 35 damage, heavies - 40 damage, assaults - 45 damage. Thoughts?

Capping alpha damage by Class is an issue simply because the game does not distinguish between weight classes for rewards.
The game rewards seem to be weighted in favor of:
Number 1 - Damage
Number 2 - Winning
Number 3 - Kill "Most Damage Dealt"
Number 4 - Savior Kill

Since rewards for Scouting, Spotting and other non-most-damage game rewards is so low, limiting any classes ability to deal damage would be wrong.

[draiocht]

[mod]This thread has been moved to Energy Draw Public Test.[/mod]

[Foxwalker]

draiocht, on 19 August 2016 - 08:13 AM, said:

[mod]This thread has been moved to Energy Draw Public Test.[/mod]

Nice that you moved the thread.

Interesting note though. Since no one is now commenting,

I have to assume, that my general observation is that no one reads any of the forums except the General, considering not a single additional comment was added since you moved it. (This one not counting as it is not a comment on the topic, but your administrative action.)

This is not a bad reflection on what you did or that you did the wrong thing. It just is.
LOL.

Edited by Foxwalker, 19 August 2016 - 01:06 PM.

[Moonlight Grimoire]

there is a simpler fix, tie it to the engine. 30 energy draw pool for 250 engine rating and below, then a +5 to the energy draw pool for every 25 after that.

So something Like this:

• <=250 Engine Rating = 30
  
• 275 Engine Rating = 35
  
• 300 Engine Rating = 40
  
• 325 Engine Rating = 45
  
• 350 Engine Rating =50
  
• 375 Engine Rating = 55
  
• 400 Engine Rating = 60

Now a further thing to add flavor to this is give mechs capacity not based on heat sinks and have heat sinks only about cooling rate vs heat up rate and do that by tonnage AND engine rating.

Heat Capacity = Tonnage/5 + Engine Rating/10

This would allow say the Kodiak with a cXL400 60 energy draw and 60 heat capacity, the Timberwolf would have 55 energy draw and 52.5 heat capacity. The Locust would have with a 190 engine 30 power draw and 23 heat capacity, the Oxide off of meta mechs with it's 280 XL would have a energy draw of 35 and a heat capacity of 35.

This would have minimal impact on majority of mechs, but, give some role to the reactor size as well as the weight of the mech, this makes each weight of mech actually relevent and also gives battlemechs an interesting trade off compared to the engine locked omnis. Engine size would now be about max heat and max damage output, this also would make lighter mechs not constantly alpha which makes them more of a support role. However, that kind of kills a way some lights are meant to play which is why heat sinks would have to be very fast cooling, stream weapons would apply heat as they fire and not all at once at a rate of their heat over time of the laser duration. To me this would allow lower heat capacity (do the same to their power draw as well) and you make light mechs able to rely on lasers and small missiles quite easily and effectively as well as future weapons like light AC's and Heavy Lasers.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

FupDup, on 19 August 2016 - 04:16 AM, said:

Many matches pretty much come down to which team has the most assaults with those loadouts.

This is partially because most people don't know how to harass assaults properly and often just run off an die to assaults one by one, the players currently on the PTS don't really offer a good test when they run off and die or take some of the worst builds imaginable (saw a stock pretty baby get dropped last night several times). So I would take this with a grain of salt.