22 replies to this topic

[dario03]

Just wondering because I don't see the reason for having events focus on just one class or in this events case a weapon system and its support weapons.
I can understand wanting to reward different styles of play but why only certain styles at times? Also wouldn't this skew any data, if data was being collected for balance?

For instance any time there is a class event that class greatly increases in use compared to normal. But when we have a event that has separate scoring and goals for all the weight classes then you get a lot of people playing, and they play all of the classes which seems like that would be better data.

And now in this event we have multiple goals that involve narc and tag which means the event encourages LRM use. And I'm fine with rewarding players that use those support weapons but why change the games normal type of play for that? Couldn't the event just be something like you get x amount of points for damage and points for kills, and this many points for narcing/tagging and points for other things, and you need y amount of total points to get rewards? Reward players for helping their teams but don't encourage every player to play one or two styles.

Edited by dario03, 03 September 2016 - 11:59 AM.

[vandalhooch]

dario03, on 03 September 2016 - 11:58 AM, said:

Just wondering because I don't see the reason for having events focus on just one class or in this events case a weapon system and its support weapons.
I can understand wanting to reward different styles of play but why only certain styles at times? Also wouldn't this skew any data, if data was being collected for balance?

For instance any time there is a class event that class greatly increases in use compared to normal. But when we have a event that has separate scoring and goals for all the weight classes then you get a lot of people playing, and they play all of the classes which seems like that would be better data.

And now in this event we have multiple goals that involve narc and tag which means the event encourages LRM use. And I'm fine with rewarding players that use those support weapons but why change the games normal type of play for that? Couldn't the event just be something like you get x amount of points for damage and points for kills, and this many points for narcing/tagging and points for other things, and you need y amount of total points to get rewards? Reward players for helping their teams but don't encourage every player to play one or two styles.

So your response to challenges that are purposely designed to be different from the past is to complain that they aren't enough like the past?

[dario03]

vandalhooch, on 03 September 2016 - 12:12 PM, said:

So your response to challenges that are purposely designed to be different from the past is to complain that they aren't enough like the past?

Read again.

[vandalhooch]

dario03, on 03 September 2016 - 12:13 PM, said:

Read again.

I read it. You basically described a challenge using minimum match scores. We've done that already, many, many times.

[dario03]

vandalhooch, on 03 September 2016 - 12:17 PM, said:

I read it. You basically described a challenge using minimum match scores. We've done that already, many, many times.

Actually I described a system that uses a different scoring system than match score. I also asked why do we need class based events when we can just have different scoring per weight class like the previous event? Or to go even more basic, why do we have events that promote single styles of play and discourage variety.

[vandalhooch]

dario03, on 03 September 2016 - 01:32 PM, said:

Actually I described a system that uses a different scoring system than match score.

We've done those too. Your alternate scoring system would still reward players for doing what they have always done. Nothing new would result.

Edit: In fact, the current match score system was developed from previous challenges just like you describe.

Quote

I also asked why do we need class based events when we can just have different scoring per weight class like the previous event? Or to go even more basic, why do we have events that promote single styles of play and discourage variety.

Since when is this "class based?" Except for the protected light and protected mediums, none of the challenges require you to pilot any particular class of mech.

As to variety, what is happening now is very different from what usually happens. How is that not variety?

Edited by vandalhooch, 03 September 2016 - 02:13 PM.

[Alistair Winter]

In my opinion? It's because PGI keeps coming up with ideas by having a few beers and brainstorming in their new lounge area, instead of... actually asking the players what they want. A community manager could start a thread asking players for ideas and write down some of the most popular ideas, and then bring those ideas to the devs to check if they were possible to carry out in some fashion.

But instead we get new stuff completely out of left field, that nobody asked for.

"I wish we had more crazy MWO events based on popular current TV shows with totally random criteria, like using consumables and 3PV" - said no MWO fan ever.

[dario03]

vandalhooch, on 03 September 2016 - 02:03 PM, said:

We've done those too. Your alternate scoring system would still reward players for doing what they have always done. Nothing new would result.

Edit: In fact, the current match score system was developed from previous challenges just like you describe.



Since when is this "class based?" Except for the protected light and protected mediums, none of the challenges require you to pilot any particular class of mech.

As to variety, what is happening now is very different from what usually happens. How is that not variety?

I never said this event was class based? I said why are events class based since they often times are. For instance the light, medium, and assault events we just had.

[vandalhooch]

dario03, on 03 September 2016 - 02:15 PM, said:

I never said this event was class based? I said why are events class based since they often times are. For instance the light, medium, and assault events we just had.

So you complain about class based events and complain about this event even though you admit this event isn't class based?

Not sure I'm following what your complaint really is.

Edit: How exactly would you promote balanced play and shake things up if players could achieve your goals by doing the same energy and ballistic vomit they already use?

I think you are obsessing over what amounts to only 3 of the 22 challenges by the way. Just because the LRM/Streak + Tag/NARC is obvious does not mean that other players aren't also working on the other challenges.

Edited by vandalhooch, 03 September 2016 - 02:32 PM.

[JC Daxion]

vandalhooch, on 03 September 2016 - 02:21 PM, said:

Not sure I'm following what your complaint really is.

The OP doesn't like LRM's...

Don't do the ones you don't wan't i don't get it.. events are suppose to be fun for people, and give um something else to do, or perhaps try something they wouldn't normally, as they might find they enjoy it.

Yada, yada, yada... so i didn't do the event...
(i might find some time, 10 points for those that get the reference)



I really wonder if the event called for killing 10 mechs with a Autocannon if we would be seeing this post..

Edited by JC Daxion, 03 September 2016 - 02:32 PM.

[Telemachus -Salt Wife Salt Life-]

I've said screw it to the challenge and am thoroughly enjoying myself stomping people who have wasted tonnage on lurms/narcs/tags and who use 3rd person view. It's more fun than doing the event, and I will get some free stuff anyway

Edited by Telemachus Rheade, 03 September 2016 - 02:44 PM.

[dario03]

JC Daxion, on 03 September 2016 - 02:31 PM, said:

The OP doesn't like LRM's...

Don't do the ones you don't wan't i don't get it.. events are suppose to be fun for people, and give um something else to do, or perhaps try something they wouldn't normally, as they might find they enjoy it.

Yada, yada, yada... so i didn't do the event...
(i might find some time, 10 points for those that get the reference)



I really wonder if the event called for killing 10 mechs with a Autocannon if we would be seeing this post..

If it was only Autocannons then yeah you would.

The point of the thread is to say that we shouldn't have events push one class or one weapon type so much. Or asking why events are set up like that. Not sure why you guys are having trouble with that...

[El Bandito]

dario03, on 03 September 2016 - 03:35 PM, said:

If it was only Autocannons then yeah you would.

The point of the thread is to say that we shouldn't have events push one class or one weapon type so much. Or asking why events are set up like that. Not sure why you guys are having trouble with that...

Tis but a single event. If you didn't like how it was done, then post it in the feedback section, or Russ' Twitter. I personally do not mind lurms flying around. I simply laugh at those Heavies and Assaults carrying lurms instead of energy or ballistics that could have killed me much easier. I laugh at the Mediums and Lights, who instead of getting into brawl range and **** up my LRM 5W, they opted to use TAG + ERLLs from distance instead.

Basically, this event is a boon to my enjoyment.

[Nightshade24]

dario03, on 03 September 2016 - 11:58 AM, said:

-snip-
And now in this event we have multiple goals that involve narc and tag which means the event encourages LRM use. And I'm fine with rewarding players that use those support weapons but why change the games normal type of play for that? Couldn't the event just be something like you get x amount of points for damage and points for kills, and this many points for narcing/tagging and points for other things, and you need y amount of total points to get rewards? Reward players for helping their teams but don't encourage every player to play one or two styles.

So what's the problem with LRM use encouraged?
For some reason over and over no one complains that you can have a match that's 90% ER med lasers + Large pulse lasers or Large pulse + Gauss but as soon as it's at least 3 LRM 'mechs on the team it's a bad thing...
and I've seen some more AMS mechs who just mow down most of the missiles and such... and I've seen games where the entire enemy team hugs the walls and mountains and won despite having a sheer NARC/ LRM/ TAG disadvantage... and it isn't quite every match either.

Why did they want to promote LRM and TAG use? well if you haven't seen the recent PTS stuff. They are doing weapon testing and reballancing there...

Developers of MMO's often test parts of the game by making events that promote it to get data. This one particularly shines on TAG and Narcs which most people often complain are useless, pointless, and a waste of space- meanwhile many people in this event are enjoying it and learning the benefits of it even on LRM-lesss matches so in 2 separate incidences. People want to play with TAG's and Narcs now, and PGI gets to know if these systems are really worth it or need more help.

Alistair Winter, on 03 September 2016 - 02:05 PM, said:

In my opinion? It's because PGI keeps coming up with ideas by having a few beers and brainstorming in their new lounge area, instead of... actually asking the players what they want. A community manager could start a thread asking players for ideas and write down some of the most popular ideas, and then bring those ideas to the devs to check if they were possible to carry out in some fashion.

But instead we get new stuff completely out of left field, that nobody asked for.

"I wish we had more crazy MWO events based on popular current TV shows with totally random criteria, like using consumables and 3PV" - said no MWO fan ever.

The event is structured so that you can easily do what you want to do and ignore the other things. It isn't quite a completionist event. I am not going for the consumable ones personally nor will I miss it-
However I do hear some people saying they are learning new things of 3rd Person view and are enjoying the event with these weird criteria. I honestly want to see more events like this instead of events that just want you to load as much damage as possible regardless of win or loss/ caps or not, etc.... like the past half hundred events....

[Alistair Winter]

Nightshade24, on 03 September 2016 - 04:36 PM, said:

The event is structured so that you can easily do what you want to do and ignore the other things. It isn't quite a completionist event. I am not going for the consumable ones personally nor will I miss it-
However I do hear some people saying they are learning new things of 3rd Person view and are enjoying the event with these weird criteria. I honestly want to see more events like this instead of events that just want you to load as much damage as possible regardless of win or loss/ caps or not, etc.... like the past half hundred events....

My major complaint is that it's just a weird, random pop culture reference instead of having anything to do with Battletech.

If they had framed it within a Battletech lore narrative, it would have been so much more compelling.

Weapon testing weekend. IS vs Clans. Both sides are testing new technology. The outcome of this event creates a story for next week's event. Maybe throw the Wolf's Dragoons in the story, as they have come to the Inner Sphere to gather information about IS vs Clan technology. People who complete X number of challenges get a Wolf's Dragoon decal.

It's so easy to make this stuff more compelling than "Simpsons Weekend! Kill mechs with flamers to win donut and beer mug cockpit items!"

[Kael Posavatz]

Alistair Winter, on 03 September 2016 - 02:05 PM, said:

"I wish we had more crazy MWO events based on popular current TV shows with totally random criteria, like using consumables and 3PV" - said no MWO fan ever.

It might not be relevant, but I have never heard of this show until now, and PGI has not inspired me to watch it.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

vandalhooch, on 03 September 2016 - 12:12 PM, said:

So your response to challenges that are purposely designed to be different from the past is to complain that they aren't enough like the past?

Id rather events that arent broken as **** or highlight extremely buggy "features" that noone but the Twitter crowd wanted and told you so in at least two polls numbering 9000 (real number, no dbz joke) and 4000 against

[dario03]

El Bandito, on 03 September 2016 - 04:10 PM, said:

Tis but a single event. If you didn't like how it was done, then post it in the feedback section, or Russ' Twitter. I personally do not mind lurms flying around. I simply laugh at those Heavies and Assaults carrying lurms instead of energy or ballistics that could have killed me much easier. I laugh at the Mediums and Lights, who instead of getting into brawl range and **** up my LRM 5W, they opted to use TAG + ERLLs from distance instead.

Basically, this event is a boon to my enjoyment.

Tis not just a single event. This isn't just about this event or about lrms, it is any event that does this kind of thing. Notice how often people point out the massive change to the queue numbers during events? And during the damage and kill events players said that support weapons weren't being rewarded. I don't see why the answer to that is to make a event that encourages only doing that. Seems like just rewarding everything would work better.

[El Bandito]

dario03, on 03 September 2016 - 05:25 PM, said:

Tis not just a single event. This isn't just about this event or about lrms, it is any event that does this kind of thing. Notice how often people point out the massive change to the queue numbers during events? And during the damage and kill events players said that support weapons weren't being rewarded. I don't see why the answer to that is to make a event that encourages only doing that. Seems like just rewarding everything would work better.

Except this event does not encourage only doing supporting. Challenges that specifically has something to do with supporting with TAG/NARC are but a fraction of the total amount.

[dario03]

El Bandito, on 03 September 2016 - 05:28 PM, said:

Except this event does not encourage only doing supporting. Challenges that specifically has something to do with supporting with TAG/NARC are but a fraction of the total amount.

Except it does encourage doing support and lrms. There are no "do X with AC, lasers, srms", tag and narc are the only specific weapons mentioned and you need or team mates need streaks or lrms to get the points. Everything else isn't weapon specific. You can use other weapons but they are not encouraged like lrms are.