41 replies to this topic

[Mad Strike]

They just serve no purpose on this kind of game where competition is the primary factor , people just instant upgrade to doubles. Maybe that and modify the current values of double heatsinks.

Yes i know stock mode is coming but just for Private matches so mehhhh , same as nothing.

Edited by Mad Strike, 05 September 2016 - 02:28 PM.

[FupDup]

No.

The best course of action would be to just...you know...make them not terrible.

A popular idea for that is to make all engine sinks act like TruDubs, which would solve the biggest downfall of SHS (you lose 10 tons of heatsinks thanks to magical engine DHS that don't take up any more space or weight than engine SHS because space magic reasons).

[Akaon]

Indeed, making all engine sinks act like trudubs would turn SHS into an option, rather than being worse (barring perhaps some very extreme builds).

[dervishx5]

Why does everything have to be good?

[FupDup]

dervishx5, on 05 September 2016 - 03:18 PM, said:

Why does everything have to be good?

I guess everything doesn't "have" to be good depending on how we're defining "have to." The game will continue to exist and milk whales with or without parity between equipment/mechs/etc.

However, just because the game might "survive" with imbalances doesn't mean that ignoring those imbalances is somehow positive or good for the game.

[Naduk]

i would like to see them become a faster cooling sink with a lower heat threshold
vs doubles with a slower cooling but higher heat threshold

that way they can both have a place in the game, instead of doubles always being a direct upgrade

imagine an awesome
3x ppc
if you run it on singles and lots of them, you could fire your ppcs on chain fire constantly and never worry about overheat
but if you fire all three you are going to hurt yourself , possibly die

change it to doubles
now you can fire all 3 with ease, but it takes a long time for that massive amount of heat to go away

[dervishx5]

FupDup, on 05 September 2016 - 03:20 PM, said:

I guess everything doesn't "have" to be good depending on how we're defining "have to." The game will continue to exist and milk whales with or without parity between equipment/mechs/etc.

However, just because the game might "survive" with imbalances doesn't mean that ignoring those imbalances is somehow positive or good for the game.

As far as "imbalance" goes, single heat sinks are at the very bottom of the list. They're just there as a throwback to an older technology that isn't necessarily required anymore. But it's not nearly close to being the first thing that should be fixed in the game.

[the hedgehog]

part of the problem I suspect is that it takes an additional 8 single heatsinks to equal the 10 heatsinks in the engine while using double heatsinks.

so with that information when you use double heatsinks you are effectively freeing 8 tons from using double heatsinks over single.

Edited by the hedgehog, 05 September 2016 - 03:45 PM.

[Pjwned]

dervishx5, on 05 September 2016 - 03:18 PM, said:

Why does everything have to be good?

Why have something be an option if it's objectively inferior?

[Moonlight Grimoire]

As others have said, it would be better to make single heat sinks worth their weight by removing heat sinks adding capacity to mechs. By doing this and then making all double heat sinks actual double heat sinks cooling .2 heat per second while single heat sinks cool at .1 heat per second IS would have an option, do I sacrifice slots for tonnage or tonnage for slots. This tied in with a heat cap only affected by skills (so we lock it at 50 heat, skill puts it at 55 heat, eliting puts it at 60 heat) then heat sink boating doesn't really help increase how big of an alpha one can fire, but, instead it makes it so you can regulate how fast you cool.

But, that is my two cents. Also removing single heat sinks would make a lot of stock builds break due to a lack of slots or tonnage, but, that is generally something most people ignore.

[dervishx5]

Pjwned, on 05 September 2016 - 03:53 PM, said:

Why have something be an option if it's objectively inferior?

Lore reason: because it exists. Real reason: Because it requires you to grind more.

The Loretards and especially PGi have no interest in changing the status quo. But keep dreaming I guess, that's what these forums are for.

As has been already established, if you want more balance, you need to adopt the arcadey style of Mechwarrior 4. 4 didn't have different heat sinks.

Edited by dervishx5, 05 September 2016 - 03:59 PM.

[RestosIII]

dervishx5, on 05 September 2016 - 03:58 PM, said:

The Loretards

[dervishx5]

RestosIII, on 05 September 2016 - 04:24 PM, said:

hey guys anime is my thing

I'm a bigger lore expert than most of you. Yet I can admit when it goes too far.

In this case, single heat sinks are just there to be upgraded except when Heatsinks aren't required or in very extreme cases thanks to double heat sinks in this game being a lie.

However **** like this is what happens when you adapt a turn-based boardgame- blah blah blah we've all heard this before.

Edited by dervishx5, 05 September 2016 - 04:32 PM.

[Pjwned]

dervishx5, on 05 September 2016 - 03:58 PM, said:

Lore reason: because it exists. Real reason: Because it requires you to grind more.

The Loretards and especially PGi have no interest in changing the status quo. But keep dreaming I guess, that's what these forums are for.

Those aren't valid reasons to keep the "status quo" though, especially when all that's being asked is a very simple change to make an otherwise somewhat useful piece of equipment not be complete trash.

I realize my arguments are likely futile because both PGI and purist savants don't want to do anything about it but this sort of thing tends to be a gradual process of convincing more and more people.

Quote

As has been already established, if you want more balance, you need to adopt the arcadey style of Mechwarrior 4. 4 didn't have different heat sinks.

Hmmm no, MW4 also had constant respawns and we need to stay far away from that.

[badaa]

no i use them in some of my mechs

[jss78]

Needed for stock matches and some very rare builds which need them (AC20 urbies and such).

[Metus regem]

dervishx5, on 05 September 2016 - 03:18 PM, said:

Why does everything have to be good?

Well to be fair, he did say, "not terrible"... not good, just not terrible.

[JediPanther]

The only mechs in the game that need or do better with standard heat sinks are the urbie and locust. The is ones not clan. Even with endo and max engine the locust still requires three heat sinks. SHS allows you to fit one to two tons ammo depending on build. with only seven tons for every thing the bug needs all the space it can get.

[Alex Morgaine]

Naduk, on 05 September 2016 - 03:21 PM, said:

i would like to see them become a faster cooling sink with a lower heat threshold
vs doubles with a slower cooling but higher heat threshold

that way they can both have a place in the game, instead of doubles always being a direct upgrade

imagine an awesome
3x ppc
if you run it on singles and lots of them, you could fire your ppcs on chain fire constantly and never worry about overheat
but if you fire all three you are going to hurt yourself , possibly die

change it to doubles
now you can fire all 3 with ease, but it takes a long time for that massive amount of heat to go away

This works. Adjust xml as needed to balance. For balance, core rule...

[crashlogic]

There are some builds for which standard heatsinks make more sense-three tons of SHS are better than two tons of DHS. It doesn't often make a difference, but sometimes slots are a premuim and not tons.