18 replies to this topic

[J I N]

Hey guys,
I tried the Trial Orion IIC-A and was surprised by the punch of the LBX20 and 4x Artemis SRM6. But for me it felt a bit too slow at 77 kph and the weaponhardpoints are combined in a way I don't like. At least the LBX20 in the torso can't follow a light mech as good as I wish it would.

This is the first time to use a LBX20 for me and I wanted to make it work. So I took a look at my mechbays and found my long forgotten TBR-S:
TBR-S: LBX20 + 4x Artemis SRM6

It moves 10 kph faster, has jumpjets to get near the enemy as fast as possible and only the not used arm lacks armor. All SRMs are set in the torso and easy to target, while you can track an enemy with the LBX20 in your arm. But it lacks ammo with only 3t for each weapontype... sometimes I really wish for another SRM volley...


Do I miss anything the Orion does better than the TBR? Or might I miss a mech, which can combine LBX and SRMs even better?
Feel free to comment and improve my build.

[SlightlyMobileTurret]

The ON1-IIC once elited only goes 3.5 kph slower, packs more punch or more ammo, and definitely more cooling.

Also, humanoid and has some quirks, so tankier.

There are lots of mechs that can combine AC20/SRMs, on clan side
TBR, ON1-IIC, HGN-IIC, WHK-B, KDK-SB

[Wintersdark]

Keshav Murali, on 12 October 2016 - 01:10 AM, said:

The ON1-IIC once elited only goes 3.5 kph slower, packs more punch or more ammo, and definitely more cooling.

Also, humanoid and has some quirks, so tankier.

There are lots of mechs that can combine AC20/SRMs, on clan side
TBR, ON1-IIC, HGN-IIC, WHK-B, KDK-SB

Also, the ON1 can change its engine and go faster than the TBR if it wishes.

Both have exactly the same amount of tonnage available, though the ON1 can tune it more finely via engine changes, and deciding whether or not to run FF. No jump jets, however, but I'd argue JJ's at 75t are pretty bad.

[SlightlyMobileTurret]

Actually, no.

Orion is capped at XL360, TBR comes stock with 375. This is why I said it carries more weapons/ammo, whatever.

The fastest an Orion can go is 83.6, compared to 87.1

Edited by Keshav Murali, 12 October 2016 - 01:24 AM.

[Wintersdark]

Whoops my bad, I stand corrected.

Close enough though that speed is not a factor.

[J I N]

Keshav Murali, on 12 October 2016 - 01:10 AM, said:

The ON1-IIC once elited only goes 3.5 kph slower, packs more punch or more ammo, and definitely more cooling.

Also, humanoid and has some quirks, so tankier.

There are lots of mechs that can combine AC20/SRMs, on clan side
TBR, ON1-IIC, HGN-IIC, WHK-B, KDK-SB

Yeah the assaults can use that combination of weapons, but they are slower and for example the Kodiak does not have enought rocketslots, if you don't own the Spirit Bear.


Free tonnage for ammo and the quirks seem to be the only things the Orion IIC can do better... so maybe like that: ON1-IIC-A

But I don't feel like I am missing more than maybe 1t of SRM ammo right now and the JJ is very useful on most maps. I can't see a great advantage in the free tonnage you get for the smaller engine.

[Wintersdark]

Personal preference I suppose. I love my ON1's, (and TBR's for that matter) but I run my ON1's with 325 or rarely 350 engines. I've got the TBR for faster builds, the ON1 for firepower.

[SlightlyMobileTurret]

J I N, on 12 October 2016 - 01:41 AM, said:

But I don't feel like I am missing more than maybe 1t of SRM ammo right now and the JJ is very useful on most maps. I can't see a great advantage in the free tonnage you get for the smaller engine.

FWIW, the Onion IIC has greater firepower than most IS assaults and still goes faster. That's the advantage I see, personally.

Just an example -- 75 ton ON1-IIC (LBX20, 4ASRM6) goes 81.3 kph. 100 ton AS7-S (same firepower, more or less), goes 60.9 kph.

Edit: my point is, tremendous firepower.

Edited by Keshav Murali, 12 October 2016 - 01:51 AM.

[Wintersdark]

Though for me, it's not about 1t more ammo, that's silly. You're looking at several tons going from 360 to 350, and dumped into dhsthat means you're firing more often, faster. Endurance wins brawls.

[J I N]

Thanks for all your insight. I'm using clan mechs except for the Jager and some lights, so I can't compare the Orion IIC to IS mechs. You are totally right about the firepower it wields.

Wintersdark, on 12 October 2016 - 01:55 AM, said:

Though for me, it's not about 1t more ammo, that's silly. You're looking at several tons going from 360 to 350, and dumped into dhsthat means you're firing more often, faster. Endurance wins brawls.

You missed my point there and maybe I didn't make it clear enought:
1. In about 1 of 4 matches I'm lacking SRM ammo, so 1t more would be perfect for me to keep going with every weapon.
2. The TBR does not run hot... except for the very hot maps, where every other mech will have the ame problems. As a matter of fact I don't need more than 3 volleys to take out the most dangerous sidetorso of any assault mech. And lighter mechs or XL engines will die in that moment. It's really rare to run into a real brwal, where you get the chance to exchange blows with one or two opponents for some time...
-> I did that today, and won against an Archer and a Warhammer on canyon without heatissues.


So over all I would have no idea, how I should use the free tonnage to make the mech better.
It would be a whole different situation, if we would not talk about SRM + LBX for brawling. But Lasers would be way too boring right now.

[Cold Darkness]

i really like my 3 asrm6 1 lb20x MDD. all on one side, so you can abuse the **** out of that huge sidetorso hitbox on your deadside with ridiculous structure quirks on the dead arm and side torso. depending on which CT you are using, you will also get a good ammount of customization for your playstyle. huge accel/deccel/torsotwist/turn quirks are available.

its really being overlooked currently.

[Nerd Incognito]

J I N, on 12 October 2016 - 03:07 AM, said:

Thanks for all your insight. I'm using clan mechs except for the Jager and some lights, so I can't compare the Orion IIC to IS mechs. You are totally right about the firepower it wields.


You missed my point there and maybe I didn't make it clear enought:
1. In about 1 of 4 matches I'm lacking SRM ammo, so 1t more would be perfect for me to keep going with every weapon.
2. The TBR does not run hot... except for the very hot maps, where every other mech will have the ame problems. As a matter of fact I don't need more than 3 volleys to take out the most dangerous sidetorso of any assault mech. And lighter mechs or XL engines will die in that moment. It's really rare to run into a real brwal, where you get the chance to exchange blows with one or two opponents for some time...
-> I did that today, and won against an Archer and a Warhammer on canyon without heatissues.


So over all I would have no idea, how I should use the free tonnage to make the mech better.
It would be a whole different situation, if we would not talk about SRM + LBX for brawling. But Lasers would be way too boring right now.

I run a similar build on my TBR-C. I dropped Artemis, and shaved weight from my legs to make it work with more ammo (28 for the LB20, 400 for the SRMs) and threw in a medium laser as zombie backup. The lack of Artemis means you have to brawl closer, or it spreads all over the damned place, but I found that I like shoving the barrel of my LB20-X up my opponent's nose anyway, so that's not all bad. It's also worth pointing out that in all my matches with a TBR, I have NEVER been killed due to losing my legs, which is why I'm not shy about taking armour out of there, if necessary.

The other option is to shave that weight in your legs (I go down to 40) and use the tonnage for 1 or 1/2 ton extra ammo, but you'd have to store it in your dead arm--which is clearly problematic, especially if you're using it as a shield. If you go for the 1/2 ton, you can armour that arm up a bit with the extra weight shaved from the legs.

The outside option, which I've often had suggested to me, is to go SRM4, and ditch the Artemis (because you really don't need it for SRM4). That frees up all sorts of weight for you, and you could conceivably add two ERML in the arm. I personally didn't want to go this route and go from a 68 alpha to a 52. Even if two of the four rockets from each SRM wander a bit, it's still a big kick in the teeth for your opponent.

[l3elthaz0r]

Vulcan500rider, on 12 October 2016 - 07:23 AM, said:

I run a similar build on my TBR-C. I dropped Artemis, and shaved weight from my legs to make it work with more ammo (28 for the LB20, 400 for the SRMs) and threw in a medium laser as zombie backup. The lack of Artemis means you have to brawl closer, or it spreads all over the damned place, but I found that I like shoving the barrel of my LB20-X up my opponent's nose anyway, so that's not all bad. It's also worth pointing out that in all my matches with a TBR, I have NEVER been killed due to losing my legs, which is why I'm not shy about taking armour out of there, if necessary. The other option is to shave that weight in your legs (I go down to 40) and use the tonnage for 1 or 1/2 ton extra ammo, but you'd have to store it in your dead arm--which is clearly problematic, especially if you're using it as a shield. If you go for the 1/2 ton, you can armour that arm up a bit with the extra weight shaved from the legs. The outside option, which I've often had suggested to me, is to go SRM4, and ditch the Artemis (because you really don't need it for SRM4). That frees up all sorts of weight for you, and you could conceivably add two ERML in the arm. I personally didn't want to go this route and go from a 68 alpha to a 52. Even if two of the four rockets from each SRM wander a bit, it's still a big kick in the teeth for your opponent.

I run a TBR-C with a little less ammo, LBX20, 4SRM4 without Artemis and 4 ER Small lasers. Definitely the best brawler I've had. It's just so friggin maneuverable.

[Huron Fal]

J I N, on 12 October 2016 - 12:47 AM, said:

Hey guys,
I tried the Trial Orion IIC-A and was surprised by the punch of the LBX20 and 4x Artemis SRM6. But for me it felt a bit too slow at 77 kph and the weaponhardpoints are combined in a way I don't like. At least the LBX20 in the torso can't follow a light mech as good as I wish it would.

This is the first time to use a LBX20 for me and I wanted to make it work. So I took a look at my mechbays and found my long forgotten TBR-S:
TBR-S: LBX20 + 4x Artemis SRM6

It moves 10 kph faster, has jumpjets to get near the enemy as fast as possible and only the not used arm lacks armor. All SRMs are set in the torso and easy to target, while you can track an enemy with the LBX20 in your arm. But it lacks ammo with only 3t for each weapontype... sometimes I really wish for another SRM volley...


Do I miss anything the Orion does better than the TBR? Or might I miss a mech, which can combine LBX and SRMs even better?
Feel free to comment and improve my build.

I run 48 armor in my legs and have only been legged like 2 out of 75 matches (one was a deliberate legging attempt by a LBX 40 kodiak and the other was mostly due to friendly fire), maybe shave a bit off and put a half ton of ammo in the dead arm (likely use the ammo before losing the arm)

l3elthaz0r, on 26 October 2016 - 08:56 PM, said:

I run a TBR-C with a little less ammo, LBX20, 4SRM4 without Artemis and 4 ER Small lasers. Definitely the best brawler I've had. It's just so friggin maneuverable.

have you tried this?

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...d3a0da2cc3b5e3b

Edited by Huron Fal, 27 October 2016 - 12:38 PM.

[Huron Fal]

Cold Darkness, on 12 October 2016 - 03:39 AM, said:

i really like my 3 asrm6 1 lb20x MDD. all on one side, so you can abuse the **** out of that huge sidetorso hitbox on your deadside with ridiculous structure quirks on the dead arm and side torso. depending on which CT you are using, you will also get a good ammount of customization for your playstyle. huge accel/deccel/torsotwist/turn quirks are available.

its really being overlooked currently.

Awesome!

[Mad Ox]

Tried something similar with a Summoner but ended up outfitting the Summoner B with stock omnipods loaded with 5 Streak SRM-4's With range mod sitting at 396 range. Jumping around throws off enemy aim alot but once I locked on my missiles all head in. SRM-6 are all nice and all but like the slightly faster reload of 4's not to mention little slower use of ammo extends it abit, which with 5 going still eats ammo fast.

LBX20 i think is a very underestimated gun. I always take immense satisfaction when I use one to swat a zippy light running all over. Not to mention shooting one out of the sky that jumping "PULL!!!!"

[Kuaron]

Anyone tried the Stormcrow with LB20X+4SRM6?
Yes, it fits! No, artemis does not.
Very little ammo, a little hot, sacrifices armour wherever it is in the slightest justifiable, but man, so much fun!
Just don't snipe. Go point-blank and kill with a mace!

Maybe a more reasonable build is one with SRM4, more ammo (which will be, in addition, used more slowly) and one DHS. But the cooldowns are not synchronized this way, you cannot use the SRM4's better CD, and the alpha is less impressive, ofc.

[Corrado]

Keshav Murali, on 12 October 2016 - 01:10 AM, said:

The ON1-IIC once elited only goes 3.5 kph slower, packs more punch or more ammo, and definitely more cooling.

Also, humanoid and has some quirks, so tankier.

There are lots of mechs that can combine AC20/SRMs, on clan side
TBR, ON1-IIC, HGN-IIC, WHK-B, KDK-SB

ONI-IIC-A with LBX20 4ASRM6 or IIC-C with 2UAC10 3SRM6

while i do really like the orion-IIC, even with quirks, humanoid shape and shield arms, the hitboxes are a bit fragile.

Edited by Corrado, 28 October 2016 - 12:14 PM.

[l3elthaz0r]

Huron Fal, on 27 October 2016 - 12:38 PM, said:

have you tried this?

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...d3a0da2cc3b5e3b

Yup, though I run that one with 2 lesser SPL due to using the TBR-S side torsos. After the LBX brawler and the 2UAC10 3ER-med builds, I like this the best. The gauss and 2 ERPPC build doesn't cut it for me. Maybe 4ERLarge and 2ERMed is my 4th choice.