31 replies to this topic

[Tristan Winter]

I know that the Black Knight has a Clanbuster variant with a sword (hatchet). And the Yen Lo Wang was supposedly equipped with melee claws (hatchet).

Are there any other MWO mechs with 3055-era technology that had canon melee variants in tabletop? Is there a katana wielding Urbanmech in the lore or something?

[El Bandito]

Atlas has FISTS.

Edited by El Bandito, 14 October 2016 - 06:57 PM.

[Mcgral18]

They took the Wang's Hatchet, and added armour+Engine in it's place

[Aleksandr Sergeyevich Kerensky]

Hatchet man, Axman, buccaneer, berserker, and as you stated earlier; the black knight

[Spheroid]

Melee will NEVER be in this game for reasons other than coding difficulty.

The opportunity costs associated with delivering damage via melee are so severe only a very small selection of mechs falling into a specific range of weight and speed would even be considered. In order not to be considered jokes they would further need very specific configurations of hardpoints and actuators.

Quite frankly its not worth the effort. Quads are a closer dream than melee.

Edited by Spheroid, 14 October 2016 - 10:05 PM.

[martian]

Tristan Winter, on 14 October 2016 - 06:48 PM, said:

I know that the Black Knight has a Clanbuster variant with a sword (hatchet). And the Yen Lo Wang was supposedly equipped with melee claws (hatchet).

Are there any other MWO mechs with 3055-era technology that had canon melee variants in tabletop?

In addition to those two aforementioned 'Mechs, Reinesblatt's Banshee comes with Hatchet.

There would be two or three more (in theory), but they are equipped with Triple-strength myomer, so they are unavailable (no TSM in MWO).

Oh, and there is Dragonfly with Hatchet and ECM if you wish.

[Nik Reaper]

Spheroid, on 14 October 2016 - 08:06 PM, said:

Melee will NEVER be in this game for reasons other than coding difficulty.

The opportunity costs associated with delivering damage via melee are so severe only a very small selection of mechs falling into a specific range of weight and speed would even be considered. In order not to be considered jokes they would further very specific configurations of hardpoints and actuators.

Quite frankly its not worth the effort. Quads are a closer dream than melee.

While I tottaly agree that with PGI melee is never going to happen, I could envision it in an FPS game like this.

It would need a JJ change much like in Alien vs Predator 2, where the predator had a ground targeted jump system, (also it's no wounder why most melee mechs have JJ's, as closing in fast is a must). Most JJ mechs with such a jump system could use melee but all could use it under the right conditions, like being very hot and surprise encounter after turning a corner so there is no extra opportunity cost there.
The bigger issue I see is how to make it look good, so we don't end up with a bunch of mechs kicking and swinging arms in the air or even worse through mechs if there was no good reaction to successful impact animation.

[Aggravated Assault Mech]

Spheroid, on 14 October 2016 - 08:06 PM, said:

The opportunity costs associated with delivering damage via melee are so severe only a very small selection of mechs falling into a specific range of weight and speed would even be considered.

By this you mean anything that's heavier than the thing it's attacking?

Not only is melee worth considering purely by virtue of the fact that this game is a reference to tabletop, where melee exists, but it also provides another balance point on IS vs. Clan, and clears up immersion-breaking issues like light facehugging.

Seriously, you've never wanted to get up behind a Kodiak and cut it in half? Curb stomp a medium that thinks it can get in behind you?

Additionally it allows PGI to add IS mechs that might otherwise be excluded for a lack of functionality. The Berserker is literally the pinnacle of IS mech development even ignoring the melee weapon. 100t wubmaster with MASC and ECM?

[Zergling]

Sarna.net has a page with all mechs with canon melee weapon variants.

Look like there isn't anything that hasn't already been mentioned above.

[Tristan Winter]

Spheroid, on 14 October 2016 - 08:06 PM, said:

Melee will NEVER be in this game for reasons other than coding difficulty.
The opportunity costs associated with delivering damage via melee are so severe only a very small selection of mechs falling into a specific range of weight and speed would even be considered. In order not to be considered jokes they would further need very specific configurations of hardpoints and actuators.

I disagree, I think it's all about coding. But I do agree they would need specific configurations of actuators, for the sake of animation. Battletech never seemed to consider how mechs were actually able to carry out melee attacks, regardless of their design.

martian, on 14 October 2016 - 09:12 PM, said:

In addition to those two aforementioned 'Mechs, Reinesblatt's Banshee comes with Hatchet.
There would be two or three more (in theory), but they are equipped with Triple-strength myomer, so they are unavailable (no TSM in MWO).
Oh, and there is Dragonfly with Hatchet and ECM if you wish.

Nice, thanks. Is the Dragonfly the only Clan mech with melee weapons? There was no list of Omnimechs with melee weapons.

Nik Reaper, on 14 October 2016 - 09:37 PM, said:

The bigger issue I see is how to make it look good, so we don't end up with a bunch of mechs kicking and swinging arms in the air or even worse through mechs if there was no good reaction to successful impact animation.

Yeah, that's the big concern I would have as well. That it would end up looking like combat in the original Jedi Knight game. A lot of side strafing and swinging weapons in the air.

[martian]

Tristan Winter, on 15 October 2016 - 02:47 AM, said:

Nice, thanks. Is the Dragonfly the only Clan mech with melee weapons? There was no list of Omnimechs with melee weapons.

No, there are others, but they are either not in MWO or have tech not in MWO, etc.

Edited by martian, 15 October 2016 - 02:52 AM.

[Juodas Varnas]

Tristan Winter, on 15 October 2016 - 02:47 AM, said:

Nice, thanks. Is the Dragonfly the only Clan mech with melee weapons? There was no list of Omnimechs with melee weapons.

I'm pretty sure there's also a Nova that carries a sword. Nova-U (I THINK)

[martian]

Juodas Varnas, on 15 October 2016 - 03:29 AM, said:

I'm pretty sure there's also a Nova that carries a sword. Nova-U (I THINK)

It has a half dozen of non-MWO items.

[Juodas Varnas]

martian, on 15 October 2016 - 03:31 AM, said:

It has a half dozen of non-MWO items.

Yeah.
Like the Sword.

[martian]

Juodas Varnas, on 15 October 2016 - 03:33 AM, said:

Yeah.
Like the Sword.

... and Micro Lasers, Heavy Lasers, etc.

[Juodas Varnas]

martian, on 15 October 2016 - 05:39 AM, said:

... and Micro Lasers, Heavy Lasers, etc.

And a spot welder, if i recall correctly, hahahaha

I'm just giggling thinking off a Nova with a sword and a welding torch running around.

[Tristan Winter]

Juodas Varnas, on 15 October 2016 - 05:43 AM, said:

And a spot welder, if i recall correctly, hahahaha

I'm just giggling thinking off a Nova with a sword and a welding torch running around.

Well, we already have a welding torch effect, for our "flamer".

[Juodas Varnas]

Tristan Winter, on 15 October 2016 - 05:45 AM, said:

Well, we already have a welding torch effect, for our "flamer".

Oh.

Right...
I've forgotten that our flamers lost the 'flame' part of their names and are Rrrrs
They look so bloody awful now...

Edited by Juodas Varnas, 15 October 2016 - 05:49 AM.

[martian]

One of my favorite Melee 'Mechs is the Nightsky. It's from this era (it debuted in 3053 - the year we are in), so PGI could add it right now ...

... if they could manage to code physical attacks.

[Mcgral18]

Juodas Varnas, on 15 October 2016 - 03:29 AM, said:

I'm pretty sure there's also a Nova that carries a sword. Nova-U (I THINK)

And EIGHT MGs


#PGIPLZ

I'd use that robot with stock pods. 6 ERMLs, 8 MGs