338 replies to this topic

[Yosharian]

Zergling, on 27 October 2016 - 03:49 AM, said:

It's the 1E in each side torso that makes it top tier, due to them being high mounted. Combined with its ER PPC quirks and high mobility, it is a very effective poke sniper.

My loyalty Summoners are currently some of my best performing mechs I have, up there with my Ebon Jaguar.

My combined stats in the Summoner F and M: 48 battles, 28 wins, 20 losses (1.40 W/L, 58.33% W/R), 49 kills, 22 deaths (2.23 K/D), 497 damage/battle.

My stats in Ebon Jaguar Prime: 27 battles, 17 wins, 10 losses (1.70 W/L, 62.96% W/R), 34 kills, 14 deaths (2.43 K/D), 505 damage/battle.

Most of my heavies are in the 300-400 damage/battle range, so if I'm achieving around 500 damage/battle with good win and kill stats, then IMO the mech is excellent.

So you're running dual ERPPCs and nothing else on it? And you're doing 500 damage per round? That seems a little odd to me. Got a video?

[Dee Eight]

razenWing, on 27 October 2016 - 08:24 AM, said:

(and nobody says one man is not important, especially when you are carrying 100 tons. you see, this game is unevenly balanced toward assault. 12 man is not 1200 tons. 12 man is more about 700 tons. So you, being an assault, is worth about 2 men. Of course, if you are in a locust, then you are statistically more garbage. but 1/6 of the fighting force is fairly significant in my book)

Not to mention MM balances by mech category primarily and then attempts to match overall team tonnages if possible, but you can often see up to a 100 ton imbalance from one team to another and more so during leaderboards/new mech releases when they relax the sorting system to allow more of whatever weight class is being promoted. Someone posted a screen cap end match during the kodiak leaderboard where it was 23 kodiaks and 1 locust. I screen capped six matches lastnight with KDK-3s in them, many turning in below average results for assaults let alone kodiaks and the closest was a 800 to 805 ton match and the widest was 825 to 760 tons. One game in particular which we won, largely thanks to my archer, a blackjack and a founders atlas (as we were the last survivors of our respective lances and also the highest damage outputs of our team) had two loyalty atlases and two KDK-3s on the opposing team. One of the KDK-3s was the first mech killed, and that's something I see often with them. They attract a lot of weapons fire. Even during this event where folks are hunting huntsman... KDK-3s still get targeting priority. Why? Because people believe this fallacy that they're THE best OP mech in the game, and that they're always going to win matches for teams. But when they often die quickly...they don't live up to anything other than being a good target for other players in other mechs. Out atlas actually had zero kills. He had 7 assists though. The actual killing blows to the enemy kodiaks and atlases came from myself, the blackjack, and a huntsman. So on that team...their assaults counted for 47.9% of the tonnage, but only accounted for 37% of their total damage. One our team, our three survivors representing a mere 25.3% of our team tonnage combined for 45.6% of our team's total damage, and 50.4% of the total damage that the opposing team managed. And we didn't have any kodiak 3s at all. We had a DWF-B (339 dmg, 1 kill 6 assists), a DWF-Prime (254 dmg, 0 kills 6 assists), and a KDK-2 (355 dmg, 0 kills 5 assists).

Edited by Dee Eight, 27 October 2016 - 09:24 AM.

[Deathlike]

Dee Eight, on 27 October 2016 - 09:20 AM, said:

Not to mention MM balances by mech category primarily and then attempts to match overall team tonnages if possible, but you can often see up to a 100 ton imbalance from one team to another and more so during leaderboards/new mech releases when they relax the sorting system to allow more of whatever weight class is being promoted. Someone posted a screen cap end match during the kodiak leaderboard where it was 23 kodiaks and 1 locust. I screen capped six matches lastnight with KDK-3s in them, many turning in below average results for assaults let alone kodiaks and the closest was a 800 to 805 ton match and the widest was 825 to 760 tons. One game in particular which we won, largely thanks to my archer, a blackjack and a founders atlas (as we were the last survivors of our respective lances and also the highest damage outputs of our team) had two loyalty atlases and two KDK-3s on the opposing team. One of the KDK-3s was the first mech killed, and that's something I see often with them. They attract a lot of weapons fire. Even during this event where folks are hunting huntsman... KDK-3s still get targeting priority. Why? Because people believe this fallacy that they're THE best OP mech in the game, and that they're always going to win matches for teams. But when they often die quickly...they don't live up to anything other than being a good target for other players in other mechs. Out atlas actually had zero kills. He had 7 assists though. The actual killing blows to the enemy kodiaks and atlases came from myself, the blackjack, and a huntsman. So on that team...their assaults counted for 47.9% of the tonnage, but only accounted for 37% of their total damage. One our team, our three survivors representing a mere 25.3% of our team tonnage combined for 45.6% of our team's total damage, and 50.4% of the total damage that the opposing team managed. And we didn't have any kodiak 3s at all. We had a DWF-B (339 dmg, 1 kill 6 assists), a DWF-Prime (254 dmg, 0 kills 6 assists), and a KDK-2 (355 dmg, 0 kills 5 assists).

It does not actually do what you say it does.. particularly in the group queue.

In the group queue, the restrictions on tonnages are not a factor in MM decision making.... it uses the average PSR tier/rating of all those involved. There is no guarantee on weight class matching AT ALL.

[Vyx]

Four high-mounted ballistic hardpoints. This is key.

Many would agree, two of the main factors identifying a powerful mech are: "how high are the mounts" and "how many ballistics does it have"

Any mech with a both high mounts and/or ballistics is strong. Having four mounts that meet -both- criteria is supremely so.

There were very few mechs prior to the Kodiak that even approach it's capabilities. The Mauler comes to mind, and it is a strong mech as well. But up to that point in time, the number of mechs with high mounts were few, and they were often balanced with a significant downside. For example, the Stalker had high-mounted energy hardpoints, but it was slow and cumbersome. The number of mechs with multiple ballistic mounts were also few. Then the Kodiak appeared. The Kodiak has no downside. Very little balances it. It is quite simply the best mech there is. This is borne out by the recent statistics thread as well as the original poster's observations.

Regardless, I suppose some mech has to be king.

Edited by Vyx, 27 October 2016 - 10:28 AM.

[Mcgral18]

Yosharian, on 27 October 2016 - 09:04 AM, said:

So you're running dual ERPPCs and nothing else on it? And you're doing 500 damage per round? That seems a little odd to me. Got a video?

Perfectly doable

It's a sub 3s recycle 30 damage with (around) 2KM/s velocity
It's a hot Dual Gauss (with 20 effective damage), with better agility than many Meds and HoverJets™ which are largely usable.

[Yosharian]

Mcgral18, on 27 October 2016 - 10:36 AM, said:

Perfectly doable

It's a sub 3s recycle 30 damage with (around) 2KM/s velocity
It's a hot Dual Gauss (with 20 effective damage), with better agility than many Meds and HoverJets™ which are largely usable.

2Km/s? Are the summoner quirks that strong?

[Mcgral18]

Yosharian, on 27 October 2016 - 11:28 AM, said:

2Km/s? Are the summoner quirks that strong?

30%+TC5

Though apparently SOME people don't like fun, and take a TC1
at 35% you get 1755M/s
60% gets you 2080M/s

Edited by Mcgral18, 27 October 2016 - 11:33 AM.

[Yosharian]

Mcgral18, on 27 October 2016 - 11:33 AM, said:

30%+TC5

Though apparently SOME people don't like fun, and take a TC1
at 35% you get 1755M/s
60% gets you 2080M/s

I think I'd rather have an extra 4 DHS, but OK

[Dee Eight]

Deathlike, on 27 October 2016 - 10:02 AM, said:

It does not actually do what you say it does.. particularly in the group queue.

I don't particularly care about group queue. In solo queue it works as I described it as far as weight classes and tonnage.

[Dee Eight]

Mcgral18, on 27 October 2016 - 11:33 AM, said:

30%+TC5

Though apparently SOME people don't like fun, and take a TC1
at 35% you get 1755M/s
60% gets you 2080M/s

There's also a 5% energy cooldown, a 5% ERPPC cooldown, -10% energy heat generation, and 5% energy range quirks. The TC5 also produces an almost 12% better crit chance, and 53% adv zoom boost.

[Deathlike]

Dee Eight, on 27 October 2016 - 11:53 AM, said:

I don't particularly care about group queue. In solo queue it works as I described it as far as weight classes and tonnage.

Yes, but you're trying to balance the game with your experience in the solo queue... a place devoid of much of anything.

[STEF_]

Mcgral18, on 27 October 2016 - 11:33 AM, said:

30%+TC5

Though apparently SOME people don't like fun, and take a TC1
at 35% you get 1755M/s
60% gets you 2080M/s

lel... first thing I thought when loyal summoners were annonced

Bought a full clan package only for that....

[Ano]

Dee Eight, on 27 October 2016 - 08:20 AM, said:

That and for a VIDEO game...which I only play because its fun... I don't give a flying squirrel **** for what others consider bad builds. I'm not interested in chasing some meta only stable for some e-peen bragging on a leaderboard or other such nonsense on a niche game that has such a small demographic of people to play against. At any given time there's a few thousand people playing MWO. DOTA2 gets a million plus players online at once. If competition play interested me at all I wouldn't be wasting my time on a mech simulator with little actual content. Not to mention the fact that having hunted/been hunted by REAL people in the real world, and extracted real projectiles from my real flesh... the size of your e-peen or your W/L ratio in a particular mech, will never impress me.

That being the case, what the hell are you doing in this thread?

Between being a man's man's man's man in the real world, far above the wants and desires of basement-dwelling nerds, and your disinterest in anything not competed for by millions, and your self-admitted complete lack of interest in attempting to optimise your mech's capabilities, what possibly possessed you to join this conversation about a topic that holds NO interest for you?

[Dee Eight]

Ano, on 27 October 2016 - 01:34 PM, said:

, and your self-admitted complete lack of interest in attempting to optimise your mech's capabilities, what possibly possessed you to join this conversation about a topic that holds NO interest for you?

I optimize my mechs for my own needs, and not those of others. I also have no interest in seeing mechs constantly nerfed because some folks think they have to be lest they lose their advantage over others.

[POOTYTANGASAUR]

I am over 150 matches now, still average just over 800 dmg per match.
Best game was 1804 damage.

[JC Daxion]

Dude, it's pure luck man... I have watched you play after i died and you are such a scrub..



/sarcasmOff

Deathlike, on 27 October 2016 - 12:31 PM, said:

Yes, but you're trying to balance the game with your experience in the solo queue... a place devoid of much of anything.

You do realize that QP is the most popular/played form of the game right???

[Mcgral18]

JC Daxion, on 27 October 2016 - 02:35 PM, said:

You do realize that QP is the most popular/played form of the game right???

It's also Potato land

[Deathlike]

JC Daxion, on 27 October 2016 - 02:35 PM, said:

You do realize that QP is the most popular/played form of the game right???

There is group play as part of QP as well.

Edited by Deathlike, 27 October 2016 - 03:14 PM.

[Centrella]

Dee Eight, on 27 October 2016 - 02:26 PM, said:

I optimize my mechs for my own needs, and not those of others.

This puts me in mind of something someone said earlier in the thread. There's absolutely *nothing* wrong with building your mech in a way that puts a smile on your face, whatever that entails. Whether it's loading up with AC2s and plinking, hurling LRMs from the other side of the map or seeing how many small lasers it takes to kill an Atlas, that's up to you. "Playing for fun" is totally ok.

Provided you don't confuse "puts a smile on my face" with "maximally effective at killing other mechs", it's all good.

Dee Eight, on 27 October 2016 - 02:26 PM, said:

I also have no interest in seeing mechs constantly nerfed because some folks think they have to be lest they lose their advantage over others.

You've lost me again. The people who are asking for nerfs to the KDK-3 *includes* the people making the best use of it -- those killing 2/3 of the enemy mechs and posting an entire teamsworth of damage by themselves. Nerfing the KDK-3 isn't an advantage to them -- they're the people who also know how to handle a KDK-3 when they're facing one.

[Dee Eight]

JC Daxion, on 27 October 2016 - 02:35 PM, said:

You do realize that QP is the most popular/played form of the game right???

What 98% of the players use doesn't matter to tiertard competitive players in group queue.