82 replies to this topic

[Hades Trooper]

So i thought to get in before mechcon hits and start on this topic.

Excuse me if it's been done already but been off forums for a bit.

So this set of 8 crap came out with the Night Gyr's and it's sucks balls.It needs to change now as it limits onmi pods badly. I won't even go into how stupid the night gyrs quirks are when you get things like ballistic quirk for a mech with 1 ballistic hardpoint and 5 energy.... enough said.

Now you got these ****** quirks with a rule of set of 8. The road map for November shows quirk adjustments for 12 clan mechs. I'm predicting PGI is gonna be so stupid as to requirk all the clan onmi mechs back to set of 8 rule.

I have almost every clan mech and i've paid for them all, i got linebacker and maurder iic to come also.

If you make them, PGI, set of 8 rule that will be the final deal breaker for me. that will be the straw that closes my wallet finally for good.

You screwed me over with my team tier 9 decal and i'm sore over that but this would be the deal breaker, everything else i can accept and move on with but this set of 8 rule is plain crazy ****.

Start doing that and those IS mech better lose quirks when they change stock loadouts also.

[FupDup]

The "No quirks unless you use 8/8 pods" system only makes sense for very powerful mechs like the Night Gyr, which are strong enough to not need any quirks to begin with.

For mechs that are average or bad, this system seriously hurts them since swapping around pods was one of their few saving graces. Mechs like the Viper sure as heck need base quirks that apply to all builds, both pure 8/8 and mixed pod ones.

Look at stock hardpoint setups on every Mist Lynx, for example, and we'll see that you'd be forced to run the classic 1x ERPPC build on every one of them except the Prime, and the Prime would just be flat out eradicated from existence. See also the Gargoyle Prime...

Edited by FupDup, 01 November 2016 - 09:32 AM.

[Jetfire]

I am on the fence. I would prefer tiered perks/penalties. 2/4/6/8 pod type quirks.

[Mole]

Jetfire, on 01 November 2016 - 10:29 AM, said:

I am on the fence. I would prefer tiered perks/penalties. 2/4/6/8 pod type quirks.

This. I like this. Listen to this man.

[Orville Righteous]

I think the rule of 8 isn't that big of deal. I've changed the pods of my Night Gyr and Huntsmen and they still perform. The quirks aren't that big of a deal. Use them if you can/want to, ignore them if you don't. They can add uber quirks to the Hellbringer and I'd still use the LT omnipod of the Prime on every variant like I do now.

[FupDup]

Orville Righteous, on 01 November 2016 - 10:42 AM, said:

I think the rule of 8 isn't that big of deal. I've changed the pods of my Night Gyr and Huntsmen and they still perform. The quirks aren't that big of a deal.

That's because those two specific mechs have actual design strengths that allow them to accomplish things even without quirks.

Now look at mechs like the Summoner or Kit Fox and try to imagine them quirkless.

[Y E O N N E]

Orville Righteous, on 01 November 2016 - 10:42 AM, said:

I think the rule of 8 isn't that big of deal. I've changed the pods of my Night Gyr and Huntsmen and they still perform. The quirks aren't that big of a deal. Use them if you can/want to, ignore them if you don't. They can add uber quirks to the Hellbringer and I'd still use the LT omnipod of the Prime on every variant like I do now.

Those are good 'Mechs, though. What about the Viper? What if they changed Mist Lynx and Ice Ferrets to the Set of 8 rule? They get shafted twice, there. Once because the stock hardpoints border on unusable, and second because the good hybrid pod sets are still mediocre to bad.

[FupDup]

I think that an irony here is that a long time ago, I did propose the idea of the 8/8 set actually giving meaningful bonuses...but I did NOT mean that mixed pod builds get no quirks. I just meant that all builds get enough baseline quirks to be viable, and then the 8/8 builds would get special treatment to try to make them usable (e.g. Thor Prime).

PGI took it to the extreme.

[N a p e s]

The argument to increase the use of stock omnipods on Omnimechs has come up a few times in the past few months and I just don't understand it. The reasoning I'd seen was considering the ''soul'' of the mech but isn't that contrary to Omnimech lore? Aren't they meant to be modular legomechs which practically strips them of any ''soul''?

From a balance point of view, I'd drop the set-based quirks rule anyway.

[Orville Righteous]

FupDup, on 01 November 2016 - 10:43 AM, said:

That's because those two specific mechs have actual design strengths that allow them to accomplish things even without quirks.

Now look at mechs like the Summoner or Kit Fox and try to imagine them quirkless.

Understood, so which mechs would the rule of 8 affect, would it be all of the underperforming Clan mechs? Arctic Cheetah, Stormcrow, Hellbringer, Ebon Jaguar, and Timber Wolf would be fine I'd suspect. I don't have a Summoner, Kit Fox or Viper, so I don't know much about them.

[C E Dwyer]

Well if you look at November Road map.

Looks like your wish of 8/8 is about to come true for 12 clan Mechs

Edit

I did wonder about clan hero's and how they would add them if they added them at all, and why people would buy just a paint job.

I guess this is how

Edited by Cathy, 01 November 2016 - 12:13 PM.

[RestosIII]

FupDup, on 01 November 2016 - 10:50 AM, said:

PGI took it to the extreme.

That's all they do.

[Cy Mitchell]

I was upset when "set of 8" was introduced with the Viper and all subsequent omni-Mech releases. But I now understand the reason for it as more Clan Hero Omni-Mechs are being introduced. Set of 8 is needed and I accept the loss of quirks if I am building a custom Clan Omni-Mech.

As long as structure, armor and agility quirks that are needed are left outside the "Set of 8" then I am fine with the weapon quirks being in it. Moving around omni-pods to maximize weapon hardpoints more than offsets the loss of a few minor weapon quirks in most cases. Having the ability to maximize hardpoints, optimize geometry and then keeping weapon quirks on top of that just allows us to create very powerful Frankenstein Mechs that unbalance the game and contribute to power creep.

Power creep is bad for the game. Nerfs that control power creep are good IMO.

Edited by Rampage, 01 November 2016 - 12:27 PM.

[Y E O N N E]

Rampage, on 01 November 2016 - 12:27 PM, said:

I was upset when "set of 8" was introduced with the Viper and all subsequent omni-Mech releases. But I now understand the reason for it as more Clan Hero Omni-Mechs are being introduced. Set of 8 is needed and I accept the loss of quirks if I am building a custom Clan Omni-Mech.

As long as structure, armor and agility quirks that are needed are left outside the "Set of 8" then I am fine with the weapon quirks being in it. Moving around omni-pods to maximize weapon hardpoints more than offsets the loss of a few minor weapon quirks in most cases. Having the ability to maximize hardpoints, optimize geometry and then keeping weapon quirks on top of that just allows us to create very powerful Frankenstein Mechs that unbalance the game and contribute to power creep.

Power creep is bad for the game. Nerfs that control power creep are good IMO.

But some Omni's still need weapon quirks with hybrid pods. Mist Lynx, for example, unless you plan on giving it the total hitpoints of a Blackjack so it can have a chance at nibbling a target to death. The Lynx ain't power-creeping sheeyit!

[Mystere]

If this is a prelude to all IS mechs also being re-quirked for "flavor" along the lines of lore instead of balance then I am all for it.

[Davegt27]

I thought the OP was talking about 8V8 player system for the world championships

so its not that

so what is the rule of "8" ? quirks?

sounds to me like the whole quirk system is a nightmare or soon will be

[RestosIII]

Davegt27, on 01 November 2016 - 12:55 PM, said:

I thought the OP was talking about 8V8 player system for the world championships

so its not that

so what is the rule of "8" ? quirks?

sounds to me like the whole quirk system is a nightmare or soon will be

8/8 quirks are quirks that only go into effect if every single omni-pod on an omnimech are of the same type. So, for instance, if you own a Mad Dog Prime, the head, RT/LT, RA/LA, RL/LL all have to be the Prime version to get ANY quirks. It's terrible, and would destroy basically all of the mediocre omnimechs. We can only hope that we're wrong and they don't do it.

[DAYLEET]

I dont even know why Clan mech get quirks. Even negative one.

[FupDup]

DAYLEET, on 01 November 2016 - 02:04 PM, said:

I dont even know why Clan mech get quirks. Even negative one.

Because some Clan gundams are poopy even in spite of being able to mount Clan guns.

[Cy Mitchell]

Yeonne Greene, on 01 November 2016 - 12:31 PM, said:

But some Omni's still need weapon quirks with hybrid pods. Mist Lynx, for example, unless you plan on giving it the total hitpoints of a Blackjack so it can have a chance at nibbling a target to death. The Lynx ain't power-creeping sheeyit!

The Mist Lynx is a POS and an outlier. No amount of weapon quirks are going to change that. The only thing that will help it is a Hero Variant that gives it some torso mounted hardpoints or something along those lines.. If that happens then the "set of 8" may even work on it.