14 replies to this topic

[invernomuto]

http://www.oregonliv...oregonians.html



World is changing and I do not understand it anymore...

Edit: Seriously, how popular is the "Cascadia" independent movement in Oregon?

Edited by invernomuto, 11 November 2016 - 12:21 AM.

[MarineTech]

I seriously doubt this will go anywhere. After every election, regardless of who won, there are always those among the losing side who propose this.

[Lily from animove]

MarineTech, on 11 November 2016 - 04:54 AM, said:

I seriously doubt this will go anywhere. After every election, regardless of who won, there are always those among the losing side who propose this.

as much as people said there won't be brexit, and as much as people said hillary will win?
We are in times where things turned out different from expection. So you shouldn't bet on it.

Edited by Lily from animove, 11 November 2016 - 07:25 AM.

[SeaLabCaptn]

Don't forget about the Calexit movement, they're thinking the same. "Sixth biggest economy" is what I heard them boasting.

Funny thing, if San Andreas has anything to say about it, Oregon and California might soon get their wish.

[Mystere]

SeaLabCaptn, on 11 November 2016 - 09:35 AM, said:

Don't forget about the Calexit movement, they're thinking the same. "Sixth biggest economy" is what I heard them boasting.

Funny thing, if San Andreas has anything to say about it, Oregon and California might soon get their wish.

Some people would rather die than live in tyranny.


...

...
<runs for the hills>

[SeaLabCaptn]

There's a difference to be made between dying while fighting tyranny and taking an unexpected dip while sucking back avocado smoothies, enjoying a little recreational MJ, and complaining how "democracy" doesn't work.

[MischiefSC]

Fortunately legalization made big gains. Maybe it will help people mellow out.

I'm no fan of Trump and think he's a stupid choice for president and we'll spend years undoing his mistakes and a generation of wincing embarrasment from how he makes us look on the global stage.

Make your voice heard. March in protests. Riots however are stupid and BS. You're hurting strangers, hurting yourself. The people rioting are anarchists using the people marching as cover to do idiotic things to make trouble.

Nature of having a democratic system in our republic. You won't always agree with who wins but you lump it and adjust and maybe show up to vote next time.

[MarineTech]

Lily from animove, on 11 November 2016 - 07:25 AM, said:

as much as people said there won't be brexit, and as much as people said hillary will win?
We are in times where things turned out different from expection. So you shouldn't bet on it.

I will bet on it. But I'll tell you what, I honestly wouldn't mind too much if it did happen. Let 'em go. That's 74 liberal electoral votes out of the running. California, Oregon, and Washington state seceding would almost guarantee you'd never see a liberal candidate elected in the US again.

Hmmmmmm. I wonder if we can make this happen. Let's get all the conservative voters to line up on the east side of the San Andreas fault. He can all hop up and down in unison and break them off into the Pacific. I'm sure the folks living in Nevada, Arizona, and Idaho would love to wind up with ocean front property.

[MischiefSC]

Not sure how well that would work as they are three of the biggest contributers to national revenue. All 3 pay in eay more than they take out, the only "red" state that contributes more than they take on federal dollars is Trxas and that only if you don't include military and oil subsidies.

If California was not paying for the poverty of the southern states, oil and agriculture subsidies for various "red" states it would be the most profitable per capita nation in the world by a huge stretch.

However a lot of that wealth is generated from supporring its neighboring states so it's hard to say. However without question the loss of CA/OR/WA would destroy the US economy.

However reality makes terrible hyperbole. Sort of like how the overwhelming majority of the ultra conservative poor crying for the removal of entitlement programs are actually on federally funded and supported entitlement programs.

"My social security/medicare/medicade/disability is righteous, it's all those other people who shouldn't have it!"

[Master Pain]

I fully support this. If this were to really happen, i would be on the way there. The US has changed and not for the better. I am no longer proud to be an american. Trump is hate and fear. That is all he represents.

[Mister Blastman]

Lily from animove, on 11 November 2016 - 07:25 AM, said:

as much as people said there won't be brexit, and as much as people said hillary will win?
We are in times where things turned out different from expection. So you shouldn't bet on it.

The only thing different is propaganda lost.

[Lily from animove]

MarineTech, on 11 November 2016 - 07:01 PM, said:

I will bet on it. But I'll tell you what, I honestly wouldn't mind too much if it did happen. Let 'em go. That's 74 liberal electoral votes out of the running. California, Oregon, and Washington state seceding would almost guarantee you'd never see a liberal candidate elected in the US again.

given how the last republican president runt he USA depth wise, you may end up with peple having the insight of how bad this goes could then be you lose more and more states.

and careful with the hopping people, maybe they meake the entire north american continent flip and everyone drows on the underside and the mole people rule the continent

[XxXAbsolutZeroXxX]

The media tries to mislead and misinform people into believing the last 8 years were a golden age.

But looking at statistics over the last 8 years, a very different story emerges.

[MischiefSC]

I'm wondering if going into explaining what those mean relative to the actual population and economy is going to make a difference. I like how you carefully picked graphs scaled to show big movements too.

Workers share of economy and health insurance cost slides though are relevant as they're not skewed by per capita or ignoring write-down like most the rest are.

As the economy has grown and profits increased thwy have not been shared. As we have gotten less and less healthy and restriction on health care have lifted the premiums involved have skyrocketed.

Student loans are a problem driven by per proft schools and the growing sense of college-as-business. However the ability to get student loans has also increased, making more people able to get them. We do love credit!

[XxXAbsolutZeroXxX]

^ It doesn't matter what graph or chart was posted. There is nothing that has improved in the last 8 years. Everything from unemployment to average rent costs to food prices and inflation is MUCH worse now than it was 8 years ago. It doesn't matter what category you chose -- everything across the board is terribad.

It is clear that you are educated. But you still don't seem to understand professors in college teaching students "capitalism caused the economic meltdown of 2008" is pro socialist propaganda. Real education makes an effort to cover both sides of things from an objective and unbiased perspective. The media and higher education haven't covered both sides of any story for more than a decade.

Blaming health insurance for the high cost of healthcare is a propaganda talking point. What does health insurance do? It functions the same as other forms of insurance. They take their projected cost, divide by the size of their insurance pool and mark prices up 5% to get their 5% profit. Health insurance does not set high base prices of healthcare, they have no influence to do so. Health insurance simply takes existing healthcare prices and adds a 5% markup. The perspective that you adopt whereby you claim health insurance is to blame for high healthcare prices is anti-intellectualism, it is anti-science. There is no evidence or facts to support it. Its a myth, a fairytale.

Except in the case of using health insurance as a scapegoat there are more sinister agendas at work. Blaming health insurance, capitalism, while praising socialism and creating a false narrative which ignores the massive failings of socialism. All of this is done to mislead and misinform people and to indoctrinate them into believing things which are bad. Its a form of control. And deliberate repression of facts and science to influence people into supporting the wrong policies.

The media and higher education blame health insurance to keep americans uneducated and uninformed. Its deliberately done to take advantage of people and prey upon their lack of knowledge. As long as americans fail to understand why healthcare is expensive they will be powerless to support anything that has the slimmest chance of fixing healthcare. That's where the idea that health insurance is to blame for high cost of healthcare comes from.

The same can be said of a lot of things you're saying. You're reciting many of the agenda based talking points and false narratives which represent americans being indoctrinated moreso than the legitimate points one would expect from someone who has been educated in an unbiased and objective sense.

Edited by I Zeratul I, 13 November 2016 - 04:02 PM.