10 replies to this topic

[The6thMessenger]

What if the IS LRMs, when fired under 180m acts like a machine-gun projectile? Each only deal 0.08 damage and have increased critical hit chance? Yes it's like a shotgun now, but hey maybe it's something.

As for why, i just thought that heavy missiles even if they don't explode still carry kinetic energy. It's just a small tweak, but what if?

[Bombast]

There's three really easy ways to fix LRMs minimum range, without making them 'OP,' or useless.

1. make them the reverse of SRMs, where the start out flying all over the place but then converge. If fired at below 180 meters, most of your missiles are going to eat dirt or fire into the horizon, but a few hit and do their damage.

2. Just make it so every 1 in 3, or 1 in 4, missiles actually explode, and the rest bounce like they do now.

3. Do what some of the Battletech novelist did, and have LRMs do minor ballistic damage if they hit at under 180 meters (Reduce missile damage to 0.3 or something).

Edited by Bombast, 25 November 2016 - 08:15 PM.

[The6thMessenger]

Bombast, on 25 November 2016 - 08:08 PM, said:

There's three really easy ways to fix LRMs minimum range, without making them 'OP,' or useless.

1. make them the reverse of SRMs, where the start out flying all over the place but then converge. If fired at below 180 meters, most of your missiles and going to eat dirt or fire into the horizon, but a few hit and do their damage.

2. Just make it so every 1 in 3, or 1 in 4, missiles actually explode, and the rest bounce like they do now.

3. Do what some of the Battletech novelist did, and have LRMs do minor ballistic damage if they hit at under 180 meters (Reduce missile damage to 0.3 or something).

I like the first one, you can just shoot them on the sky and then later scramble to your currently targetted enemy. The 3rd is precisely what i like.

[Nighthawk513]

Third would be better, since the first would also make it harder to fire them normally, since some might hit the ground.

[ice trey]

I would like the following:

Remove homing and lock on time.
Increase projectile speed by 1000%
Change firing pattern from overhead lob to direct fire.

Now it's acting like it does in the tabletop game, and "Noob tubes" complaints are shut down.

Allow to fire indirectly at targets if LOS is blocked, based on targets' position at the time of firing, making it useful against stationary targets, not mechs scooting around at 64 KPH.
Allow minor amounts of tracking when NARC/TAG is involved.

At this point, everything in the game seems to be punitive of LRMs. Everyone's got Radar Derp, Everyone's got ECM. Once in a blue moon, someone's got AMS. The only way to effectively use LRMs is hoping someone is generous enough to run into the thick of things and put up a UAV that the other team is too dumb to notice, granted that they're not completely surrounded by cover or in a tunnel.

Edited by ice trey, 25 November 2016 - 08:44 PM.

[Ibrandul Mike]

Or just get the ability to load them hot...
Give the option in the mechlab to have the warheads active even while stored. Firing below minimum range wouldn't be a problem, but if the ammo gets hit... it does much more damage due to the warheads exploding (and not just the fuel).

The minimal damage idea sounds good too. Especially when you think about two mechs colliding at 10 kph... they seem to get damage... but getting hit by a rocket does nothing? Even without an explosion it should at least give minor damage

[Bombast]

ice trey, on 25 November 2016 - 08:44 PM, said:

I would like the following:

Remove homing and lock on time.
Increase projectile speed by 1000%
Change firing pattern from overhead lob to direct fire.

Now it's acting like it does in the tabletop game, and "Noob tubes" complaints are shut down.

Uh...

Battletech LRMs are self-guide missiles that are fired on a ballistic launch angle.

The lock on thing is a bit contrived, but LRMs do home in, and they are 'lobbed.'

[ice trey]

Bombast, on 25 November 2016 - 09:04 PM, said:

Uh...

Battletech LRMs are self-guide missiles that are fired on a ballistic launch angle.

The lock on thing is a bit contrived, but LRMs do home in, and they are 'lobbed.'

How they lock and operate in the books? Yes

In the tabletop game, I'm not obliged to hold LOS with LRMs for two turns before firing, resetting the count every time LOS is lost.

Edited by ice trey, 25 November 2016 - 09:34 PM.

[Bombast]

ice trey, on 25 November 2016 - 09:34 PM, said:

How they lock and operate in the books? Yes

In the tabletop game, I'm not obliged to hold LOS with LRMs for two turns before firing, resetting the count every time LOS is lost.

Like I said, LRM lock on is contrived.

But they do home in, as per Battletech descriptions of how they function.

And they do get 'lobbed' upwards when fired, even when not being fire without line of sight. As per Battletech.

[Ibrandul Mike]

ice trey, on 25 November 2016 - 09:34 PM, said:

How they lock and operate in the books? Yes

In the tabletop game, I'm not obliged to hold LOS with LRMs for two turns before firing, resetting the count every time LOS is lost.

I am taking the TT rules from before Total Warfare...
The round lasts 10 seconds, all in all.
All weapon firing and the resolve of it happen simultaneously. There is no indicator if a lock is needed or when it is done.
Just because it isn't mentiont that doesn't mean it isn't needed or preferable.
There is a LOS or there isn't. There is nothing in between, no break in the LOS possible.
You could take the Solaris rules with 2.5 seconds per turn, which would make locking on more unrealistic due to the ability to shoot LRM in the first round.

[ice trey]

Ibrandul Mike, on 25 November 2016 - 10:03 PM, said:

I am taking the TT rules from before Total Warfare...
The round lasts 10 seconds, all in all.
All weapon firing and the resolve of it happen simultaneously. There is no indicator if a lock is needed or when it is done.
Just because it isn't mention that doesn't mean it isn't needed or preferable.
There is a LOS or there isn't. There is nothing in between, no break in the LOS possible.
You could take the Solaris rules with 2.5 seconds per turn, which would make locking on more unrealistic due to the ability to shoot LRM in the first round.

Most of this is stuff I'd agree with, barring the bolded text.
LOS does exist as a Yes/No possibility, but there are a few things in between. Partial cover, for one, but then comes spotting for indirect fire, Narc/Tag designated targets as well as (Since targeting in MWO acts like it anyway) C3 spotting. Also for when Double-blind rules are being used.

As for being preferable? We're talking about a weapons system that's gone from being a crit-seeker with some range and extra flexibility, and brought it into specialist weapons system that is either OP or completely useless, more often the latter, based on who is pitted against it. Ditching sluggish lock-ons that require confirmation server-side in favour of something that would not be completely stigmatised and penalised would be really rather nice.