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Is a Imperator Series A Autocannon better than an Armstrong Buster Autocannon?
Started by Kraven Kor, Jul 19 2012 12:03 PM
49 replies to this topic
#41
Posted 19 July 2012 - 04:55 PM
#42
Posted 19 July 2012 - 05:07 PM
If that was true we'd have mad cats, ponies and urbies in the game already.
#43
Posted 19 July 2012 - 05:09 PM
Two words.....BALANCING NIGHTMARE
#44
Posted 19 July 2012 - 05:13 PM
There are a number of visual and story line alternatives to clone cannons. Besides a fewbigger but slower shells vs more and faster light shells you also have CE (HEAT) vs KE (APFSDS) vs combo CE/KE (APBC). You also have a variet of loading mechanism from the typical cassette, belt and magazine fed to more exotic combinations for the ultras like multi-barrel multi-cassette set ups similar to a rope making machine where multiple spindles feed to a single source. In general for weapons with low velocity HEAT is the way to go. The bigger the bore the more effective the HEAT round. A good rule of thumb for current generation HEAT rounds is penetration equals 7 times the diameter against conventional RHAE (Rolled Homogenous Armor Equivalent). Thus a 185mm weapon would penetrate the equivalent of 1.295 meters of face hardened armor grade steel.
For apfsds, velocity is king- 1/2 mass times velocity squared is the only commandment in that bible. The US Army's current M829A3 firing a projectivel with an estimated weigh near 5 kilograms at 1555m/s delivers over 13 million joules of energy on impact. Sabots can also be made of tungsten alloys and depleted uranium. DU is nice because is ignites on contact and self sharpens as it penetrates.
HEAT- High Explosive Anti-tank. A chemical explosive directed to a copper cone creates an inverted molten metal projectile called an EFP or explosively formed projectile commonly called a jet.
APFSDS- Armor Piercing Fin Stabalized Discarding Sabot- truth a sub-caliber long rod penetrator that looks like a dart. The sabot is the boot that goes over the round to secure it down the barrel. There are two main types of sabots. Bore riders which have big fins that touch the barrel and secure the round and a small disc shaped sabot that only serves as a trap to the gasses to propel the round. The other style is called the spool style. In this style the fins are small and the sabot is shaped like a wire spool to both secure the round and trap the gasses of the propellant. Spool style sabots retain energy better as the smaller fins are less draggy.
APBC- Armor Piercing Ballistic Capped. A semi-high explosive round fitted with a hard ballistic cap desgned to break the face hardening or armor.
For apfsds, velocity is king- 1/2 mass times velocity squared is the only commandment in that bible. The US Army's current M829A3 firing a projectivel with an estimated weigh near 5 kilograms at 1555m/s delivers over 13 million joules of energy on impact. Sabots can also be made of tungsten alloys and depleted uranium. DU is nice because is ignites on contact and self sharpens as it penetrates.
HEAT- High Explosive Anti-tank. A chemical explosive directed to a copper cone creates an inverted molten metal projectile called an EFP or explosively formed projectile commonly called a jet.
APFSDS- Armor Piercing Fin Stabalized Discarding Sabot- truth a sub-caliber long rod penetrator that looks like a dart. The sabot is the boot that goes over the round to secure it down the barrel. There are two main types of sabots. Bore riders which have big fins that touch the barrel and secure the round and a small disc shaped sabot that only serves as a trap to the gasses to propel the round. The other style is called the spool style. In this style the fins are small and the sabot is shaped like a wire spool to both secure the round and trap the gasses of the propellant. Spool style sabots retain energy better as the smaller fins are less draggy.
APBC- Armor Piercing Ballistic Capped. A semi-high explosive round fitted with a hard ballistic cap desgned to break the face hardening or armor.
#45
Posted 19 July 2012 - 05:28 PM
Hmmmm a rule set that was designed to be used with pen, paper and dice is too complicated for the average computer user....
Are we as a society getting dumber?
Are we as a society getting dumber?
#46
Posted 19 July 2012 - 06:36 PM
Eldan Sontim, on 19 July 2012 - 05:28 PM, said:
Hmmmm a rule set that was designed to be used with pen, paper and dice is too complicated for the average computer user....
Are we as a society getting dumber?
Are we as a society getting dumber?
Exactly!
Too complicated for new players? Bollocks. If they don't understand, maybe they should use their brain and read the help or do a tutorial or whatever. I have almost no experience in playing the TT game, and yet I still think its a good idea.
#47
Posted 20 July 2012 - 08:24 AM
Machalel, on 19 July 2012 - 06:36 PM, said:
Exactly!
Too complicated for new players? Bollocks. If they don't understand, maybe they should use their brain and read the help or do a tutorial or whatever. I have almost no experience in playing the TT game, and yet I still think its a good idea.
Too complicated for new players? Bollocks. If they don't understand, maybe they should use their brain and read the help or do a tutorial or whatever. I have almost no experience in playing the TT game, and yet I still think its a good idea.
If us spergs can figure out the best builds for World of Warcraft and EVE Online - WoW having eleventy billion versions of any given weapon with a myriad number of stat / ability combinations... EVE Online requires a secondary program just to see if your new shiny gun is 0.1% more accurate than your last shiny gun...
I think we can handle 27 variations of Autocannon.
Just sayin'
#48
Posted 20 July 2012 - 08:37 AM
Seriously, it could be as simple as this:
Each weapon in each group has three variants.
Lasers - three versions of each laser, then PPC - 10 or 11 lasers total right now, for 33 total lasers "with variants."
Manufacturer One makes lasers that are slightly longer range. Their damage and rate of fire is standard, but they get +5% range in all range brackets (if that is a thing in MWO) - so "to hit penalties" or "reduced damage by range" effects this manufacturers lasers less, meaning they will be slightly more accurate at range and do just a bit more damage a bit further out than other lasers of the same class.
Manufacturer Two makes lasers that are a bit more powerful. They do +5% damage compared to other lasers of the same class, and have standard range, rate of fire, etc.
Manufacturer Three makes lasers that are just a bit less hot. They generate 5% less heat.
Autocannons - three variants of each. 6 total autocannons right now. 18 total autocannons.
Mfg. One = +5% Rate of Fire
Mfg. Two = +5% Damage
Mfg. Three = +5% range.
LRM's - three variants of each. 4 current LRM's; 12 total LRM variants.
Mfg. One = +5% lock on speed.
Mfg. Two = +5% "number of missiles that hit."
Mfg. Three = +5% range.
SRM's - three variants each. 4 current SRM's; 12 total SRM variants.
Mfg. One = +5% lock on speed.
Mfg. Two = +5% damage per missile
Mfg. Three = +5% reload speed (increased Rate of Fire)
---
Taking us from:
Current total weapons in game: About 25 or 26 (including machine guns.)
To:
Total weapons in game (at launch) "with variants": About 75.
And again, I'm not starting a petition, I'm just offering my ideas under the hopes that the game ends up with at least some similar ideas at some point. You can't have your dreams come true if you don't have dreams.
Each weapon in each group has three variants.
Lasers - three versions of each laser, then PPC - 10 or 11 lasers total right now, for 33 total lasers "with variants."
Manufacturer One makes lasers that are slightly longer range. Their damage and rate of fire is standard, but they get +5% range in all range brackets (if that is a thing in MWO) - so "to hit penalties" or "reduced damage by range" effects this manufacturers lasers less, meaning they will be slightly more accurate at range and do just a bit more damage a bit further out than other lasers of the same class.
Manufacturer Two makes lasers that are a bit more powerful. They do +5% damage compared to other lasers of the same class, and have standard range, rate of fire, etc.
Manufacturer Three makes lasers that are just a bit less hot. They generate 5% less heat.
Autocannons - three variants of each. 6 total autocannons right now. 18 total autocannons.
Mfg. One = +5% Rate of Fire
Mfg. Two = +5% Damage
Mfg. Three = +5% range.
LRM's - three variants of each. 4 current LRM's; 12 total LRM variants.
Mfg. One = +5% lock on speed.
Mfg. Two = +5% "number of missiles that hit."
Mfg. Three = +5% range.
SRM's - three variants each. 4 current SRM's; 12 total SRM variants.
Mfg. One = +5% lock on speed.
Mfg. Two = +5% damage per missile
Mfg. Three = +5% reload speed (increased Rate of Fire)
---
Taking us from:
Current total weapons in game: About 25 or 26 (including machine guns.)
To:
Total weapons in game (at launch) "with variants": About 75.
And again, I'm not starting a petition, I'm just offering my ideas under the hopes that the game ends up with at least some similar ideas at some point. You can't have your dreams come true if you don't have dreams.
Edited by Kraven Kor, 20 July 2012 - 08:47 AM.
#49
Posted 20 July 2012 - 08:47 AM
I wouldn't mind seeing the manufacturers implemented at some point, but it would still have to be fair. So maybe ACME PPC's generate 3 less heat, but also weigh more and take an extra crit spot or something. Balance in all things is required.
#50
Posted 20 July 2012 - 08:52 AM
Forgot to consider the default 'stock' versions - so around 100 total weapons.
Then make it so, yeah, each 'advantage' is offset by a 'disadvantage' and the stock guns just have stock stats. So the +range lasers maybe do a touch less total damage. The reduced heat lasers are less accurate. Something along those lines.
Again, just a thought.
Then make it so, yeah, each 'advantage' is offset by a 'disadvantage' and the stock guns just have stock stats. So the +range lasers maybe do a touch less total damage. The reduced heat lasers are less accurate. Something along those lines.
Again, just a thought.
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