52 replies to this topic

[adamts01]

I took a 6 month break, grabbed a cold beer and gave MWO another go. And after one evening, it's the same old crap. These are some things this game just flat out needs.

Match Maker: I think this is more important than anything. PSR is a fail, and a MM where everyone ends up in top tier games is a fail. We have enough players for 3 tiers with equal populations, where everyone plays against their own tier. Base it off of wins, as good players win, bad players make excuses, and you have to knock someone out of tier 1 to move out of tier 2. No game mode or balance change will matter if 90% of the matches are left to the potato lottery.

Tonnage Balance: Pick a direction PGI, and I don't care which way you go at this point. Either treat all weight classes as equal, as you do in quickplay, or have tonnage = power, like in group and CW. Pick a direction, it's been 4 years now, enough is enough.

Roles: There needs to be more to this game than death match, and roles will really help that. We need those electronic warfare changes you talked about more than a year ago (variable lock times, mechs with inherently stronger sensors). We need things like variable radar signatures, or less of a seismic signature the lighter a mech is, so there's a tactical reason to run a light. Fix lights, if they're not going to be small, at least give them great agility, they're just sad. And make assaults tanky. Everything in the game feels the same, I don't feel any desire to buy a new mech because it'll bring more of the exact same crappy gameplay.

The list really could go on, like asking for a real CW, COF like absolutely every other successful modern game has, a better social network in game, better and honest communication from PGI, but the things I listed are absolutely critical. Escort was a great addition, it brings a new fight to the table every match, but that doesn't really matter when half you team is LRMing mountains and can't manage even a single alpha worth of damage. We all love this franchise, please fix this game.

[Jaeger Gonzo]

Game just need 3025 Stock Mode.

[Lily from animove]

Jaeger Gonzo, on 20 December 2016 - 06:07 AM, said:

Game just need 3025 Stock Mode.

we should make some 2025 clanemchs, so just usual clanmechs with shs and some wepaons of the is I don't like most IS mechs designs, The emchs I like from MW3 were allc lnemchs, and there except of the ES and FF = 7 slots thingy was no differenc ebetween is and clanemch. In fact bakc then I didn't even knew about IS and clans as the game enver explained the lore much and I just playe stompy robot missions. But the Adder, Nova, Timber, Mad dog and Supernova and annihilator were jst the mechs I liked.visually.

[Besh]

More Players...

[JediPanther]

Real development and a hell of a lot more than a new mech a month and half arsed untested game modes. Let actual players who play constantly play things before adding them to game in both fp and solo modes. It would take 24 good players less than a day to tell you every thing fubar with some thing.

It's not like my mech can break 100 alpha and slowly inch its way closer to the game's limit of 175 in smurfy or 250 in mechlab...

...Except for this ARC-5W 116 alphalord

[Bud Crue]

Stability? Iterative balance? Focused quirks that actually make sense in that they help under performers and nerf over performers as opposed to broad based changes which screw everyone equally? Transparency? That summary of the round table they promised to publish back in October? Actual attempts at engaging their customers?

Am I close?

How about using the PTS more and then including rewards to encourage actual player participation?

Is that it?

Edited by Bud Crue, 20 December 2016 - 09:24 AM.

[Mystere]

Math! I want to see the math governing the entirety of their balance decisions.

But if they have none ...

Edited by Mystere, 20 December 2016 - 09:24 AM.

[Tristan Winter]

Remember this?

http://mwomercs.com/...-3-role-warfare

http://mwomercs.com/...le-warfare-cont

We need more of that. We're getting there, but I doubt we'll actually see any kind of synergy where a team without dedicated "scouts" and "commanders" will be at a disadvantage. If you remove all artificial barriers, I imagine the best possible team in MWO in 2017 is still going to be 12 Kodiaks with as many weapon skills and durability / armor skills as possible. Maybe seismic, if it's not too inaccessible.

[Praxx]

I'm tired of light mechs taking insane damage and still running around at full speed. I mean, how can a little locus even carry 5 med lasers, AMS, and AMS ammo in the first place? When I hit a light mech with ac 10's, ac 20's, Gauss etc, I want to see the mech get knocked down, like in the solo games of Mech 3 and 4. Also, if a little mech runs into my assault, it should get knocked down as well. Tired of those little guys running into my mech and nothing happens. I love how a light mech can actually block my assault mech from moving forward until I or it magically transports through each other.

I like lights, I play them, but seeing over and over little lights doing the most damage and having the most kills is just repulsive. It's only because they can move so fast between the big mechs, shooting everything, running into everything, but not taking much damage. Takes a darn long time to kill some of these little guys and it's not for a lack of hitting them. Other day, I witnessed a Locus (Pirates Bane) run in-between our mechs, shooting at all of us. We lost that game, and I was shocked to see that the Pirates Bane had 7 kills, and over 1400 damage. You've got to be kidding me!!!!! High damage is pretty common place with good light pilots, but it shouldn't be like that. Fast, maneuverability, agility, I'm fine with all that. Able to carry as many weapons as a med or even a heavy, that's wrong and to be able to take insane amounts of damage, run into anything, never getting knocked down, it's too much. I can around a corner one match in my atlas. Before me was a spider. He stopped, I don't believe he was expecting me, I had ECM running. I put an AC 20 round, 2 SRM 6's with Artemis, straight into his center torso. He did not die.. what? He should not have been able to survive that, and he just ran away. If that didn't kill him, he should have been knocked down and even knocked backward a bit from the force of an AC 20 round. That spider went on to kill some mechs and ended with over 800 damage. This has to stop.

Well, enough of my ranting.

Praxx

[Y E O N N E]

Lights consistently having the most damage and most kills? Gotta say, man, those must be some insanely bad players in your games.

[adamts01]

Praxx, on 20 December 2016 - 10:11 AM, said:

Well, enough of my ranting.

Praxx

I honestly didn't think any "Lights are OP" people were left. But anyway, this is a perfect example of the need for balance with regards to tonnage. Why should a light be less powerful in quickplay? Just because it's lighter? Viper gave Maverick a run for his money in a smaller, lighter, faster aircraft. And really, I wouldn't care if lights were weaker if they filled a non-combat crucial role, or were compensated in some way for taking an inferior mech (resources, or 2 lights for every 1 assault). But we have half the game with modes where all tonnage is regarded as equal and half the modes where more tonnage = more power. So I'm not right, and you're not right, PGI created this mess where there is no right answer. If my light was as powerful as a Kodiak in quick play, that would be fair, but completely ruin CW. This is why it's one of the most important things PGI has to fix.

[Flak Kannon]

I haven't invested a penny since spring. And I won't.



I'll play, but they lost my funding.


And power Creep is REAL.

Try playing a Medium Mech. Unless your a really. really, really good player, your apt to get toasted by the 5,6, or 7 95 ton or 100ton mechs on the Op For.

PGI just messed up SO much with breaking 3/3/3/3.

I'm good enough to navigate this crap in the PUG que in my mediums, but I know that this broken MM and broken 3/3/3/3 system is turning people off unless your in a King Crab, Kodiak, Cyclops, Dire or Maurader IIc.


PGI has, again, dropped the ball.


I was a bit more of a fan boy than most posters, but the divorce is emminent I feel. Almost done here because of PGIs miscues.


Trying to..

Enjoi

[Alan Davion]

adamts01, on 20 December 2016 - 06:44 PM, said:

Viper gave Maverick a run for his money in a smaller, lighter, faster aircraft.

Which is a perfect example of the "teamwork is OP" side of things. Viper had Maverick and Goose so focused on him they had no idea Jester came up from behind and figuratively blew them out of the sky, just like a lot of people in this game insist on chasing lights, and then getting their backsides evaporated cause another light or two got in behind them.

[StraferX]

What the game needs?

Community Mods and map making and less interaction from PGI.

[adamts01]

Flak Kannon, on 20 December 2016 - 06:52 PM, said:

I haven't invested a penny since spring. And I won't.

I'll play, but they lost my funding.

And power Creep is REAL.

Power creep is real. And gameplay is getting worse and worse. I started just out of beta, right before ECM was released. Back then you had fast lights (though hit-reg was crap), an Atlas that could tank, mediums that filled their role, and heavies that backed up assaults. It all worked how it should. They managed to dumb down the game since then and gave every mech essentially the same role.

Alan Davion, on 20 December 2016 - 06:53 PM, said:

Which is a perfect example of the "teamwork is OP" side of things. Viper had Maverick and Goose so focused on him they had no idea Jester came up from behind and figuratively blew them out of the sky, just like a lot of people in this game insist on chasing lights, and then getting their backsides evaporated cause another light or two got in behind them.

Historically looking at things, when we switched to missile-based F4s we were outmatched by faster, smaller, better handling Migs. This was less and less important as missile technology developed further, but with all direct fire combat, smaller doesn't always mean less powerful, not in all situations anyway.

StraferX, on 20 December 2016 - 06:55 PM, said:

What the game needs?

Community Mods and map making and less interaction from PGI.

More maps bring more of the same gameplay. The reason I like Escort is because it forces a different fight than you'd otherwise have. Domination was supposed to do this, but they ruined it, they managed to make gameplay more stale than ever with that mode. We need a completely random circle. Even if one team has a clear advantage, it would at least be a different fight every time. And without a proper MM, it all comes down to the potato lottery anyway.

Edited by adamts01, 20 December 2016 - 07:15 PM.

[Vellron2005]

Here's my list of 10 things this game sorely needs in 2017 and beyond:

1) FW where planets matter more than just being named dots.

2) Many more new maps, bigger maps where scouting and infowarfare would be crucial and essential. Where you can set ambushes, flanks and use tactics and role warfare. Ideally, random, procedurally generated maps where the map is different every time you drop on it..

3) Immersion. The BT setting is mega rich with lore and detail. MWO has very little of that. Immersion could be added in many ways. Some could be PVE elements, some could be with daily lore-rich missions, some with customisable mech bays, some with a "mechipedia" tab, some with destructible environment (like the columns in Crimson), and some with R&R.

4) Skill tree - one of the rare things that are actually being worked on - putting a mech's upgrades and progression in the hands of the player. This could be expanded with a player, not mech, oriented character-building.

5) Balancing with numbers, not with mech performance - 10 Clanners vs. 12 Freebirths. Like in the lore.

6) Factions, not units, PGI sponsored - Remove units, sponsor Faction TS servers or an in-game equivalent and automatically give links and membership to players when they sign a contract or become loyalists. Make this public knowledge and easily available to all players. Make pirates and mercenaries a faction. PGI sponsor faction leadership with PGI sponsored lore-based accounts. We already have celebrities like Natasha Kerensky and Katrina Steiner. Let the people playing those accounts lead their factions actively. Don't disclose who those people are. Change them as necessary. Remove the ability that units like Mercstar and other big units have more influence than entire factions.

7) Real war, real galactic conflict - Give us things that show as all of the brutality of war, make us feel like we are fighting a galactic conflict - Show us the victims, the planets lost / gained, give us gossip about political activities and news of heroic deeds (like most kills of the day, most damage dealt on a planet, or epic plays). Let us build out own personal legends, and make them public.

8) Take greater care to play test everything and make everything optimized, pay attention to design details and use what you've learned. Like if when searching for a QP match, the people alt+tab out and want the taskbar icon to warn them a match was found, they might also like that when searching for a FW match too.. It's common sense..

9) Solaris. Create a proper tournament system withing the game, make it realistic and make it give rewards as if it was real. No MC buy-in for private matches bullshait.. Make it a third game mode with R&R costs but big rewards and news feeds of the top performers.

10) Advertise your game! I know it's expensive, but many people who would love MWO still have no clue it exists. The game needs more players and with the above mentioned design changes, could attract new players instead of bleeding them away daily.

All in all.. there is one other thing that this game sorely needs..

And that's for it's community to stop being so salty and jaded! Cut the bitterveting to a minimum and forgive and forget - cut PGI some slack and maaaaaybe, just maaaaaybe they will be motivated to give us all the sweet things I've stated.

And to not fudge up MW5

Edited by Vellron2005, 21 December 2016 - 02:52 AM.

[Alan Davion]

Vellron2005, on 21 December 2016 - 02:52 AM, said:

Here's my list of 10 things this game sorely needs in 2017 and beyond:

1) FW where planets matter more than just being named dots.

2) Many more new maps, bigger maps where scouting and infowarfare would be crucial and essential. Where you can set ambushes, flanks and use tactics and role warfare. Ideally, random, procedurally generated maps where the map is different every time you drop on it..

3) Immersion. The BT setting is mega rich with lore and detail. MWO has very little of that. Immersion could be added in many ways. Some could be PVE elements, some could be with daily lore-rich missions, some with customisable mech bays, some with a "mechipedia" tab, some with destructible environment (like the columns in Crimson), and some with R&R.

4) Skill tree - one of the rare things that are actually being worked on - putting a mech's upgrades and progression in the hands of the player. This could be expanded with a player, not mech, oriented character-building.

5) Balancing with numbers, not with mech performance - 10 Clanners vs. 12 Freebirths. Like in the lore.

6) Factions, not units, PGI sponsored - Remove units, sponsor Faction TS servers or an in-game equivalent and automatically give links and membership to players when they sign a contract or become loyalists. Make this public knowledge and easily available to all players. Make pirates and mercenaries a faction. PGI sponsor faction leadership with PGI sponsored lore-based accounts. We already have celebrities like Natasha Kerensky and Katrina Steiner. Let the people playing those accounts lead their factions actively. Don't disclose who those people are. Change them as necessary. Remove the ability that units like Mercstar and other big units have more influence than entire factions.

7) Real war, real galactic conflict - Give us things that show as all of the brutality of war, make us feel like we are fighting a galactic conflict - Show us the victims, the planets lost / gained, give us gossip about political activities and news of heroic deeds (like most kills of the day, most damage dealt on a planet, or epic plays). Let us build out own personal legends, and make them public.

8) Take greater care to play test everything and make everything optimized, pay attention to design details and use what you've learned. Like if when searching for a QP match, the people alt+tab out and want the taskbar icon to warn them a match was found, they might also like that when searching for a FW match too.. It's common sense..

9) Solaris. Create a proper tournament system withing the game, make it realistic and make it give rewards as if it was real. No MC buy-in for private matches bullshait.. Make it a third game mode with R&R costs but big rewards and news feeds of the top performers.

10) Advertise your game! I know it's expensive, but many people who would love MWO still have no clue it exists. The game needs more players and with the above mentioned design changes, could attract new players instead of bleeding them away daily.

All in all.. there is one other thing that this game sorely needs..

And that's for it's community to stop being so salty and jaded! Cut the bitterveting to a minimum and forgive and forget - cut PGI some slack and maaaaaybe, just maaaaaybe they will be motivated to give us all the sweet things I've stated.

And to not fudge up MW5

1, 3 and 7 sort of tie into each other in my eyes. Big problem with this is it would probably require the re-introduction of the "repair and rearm" system, and apparently a lot of people were not happy with the R&R system back when the game still had it.

2, yeah I agree there, but the maps would need to be, at minimum, probably about 5 or 10 kilometers long on one side or another in order to make the map big enough that it would take more than a minute or so for both sides to start blasting away at each other. This would probably also require the games to take at least 20 minutes, or remove the timer altogether if the maps got to be so big. Don't really see that happening either.

4, I agree it's nice to see the skill sets being reworked into actual skill trees, however, a character driven progression system is likely too much to ask for in what's essentially the CoD multiplayer portion of the game. Such a system is more likely to show up in MW5:M when it comes out in a couple years.

5, absolutely never going to happen. PGI tried the 12 IS vs 10 Clan shortly after the Clans were introduced and it completely and utterly f***ed the Match Maker system, giving you 12v4, 12v6, 12v8 or 12v12, never the 12v10. The best we could ever hope for would be a completely top to bottom mech/weapon/tech stat reset where they introduce an actual BV system where everything from AMS to XL engines determines a mechs point cost like in Table Top. The BV system could then be implemented in CW/FW where each side or drop deck has a set BV pool.

Game goes "Oh, you want to bring in your fully optimized laser vomit Timber Wolf? Okay, you just spent 5000 of your BV points, you now have X number of points left to spend." This would likely force people into bringing some less than optimal builds into the game in order to save for the 1 or 2 fully optimized builds they really want.

That would probably be as close as you'd get to a balanced system.

6, every Inner Sphere Successor House or Invading Clan already has their own TS servers thanks to the players.

8, kind of goes back to what I said in point 5. PGI would need to completely start from scratch as everything is so screwed up at this point due to the constant sweeping changes from one side to the other. I don't think they've ever incrementally buffed or nerfed something in the entire games life.

9, we're heading that way with some of the recent 1v1 and 4v4 arena maps they showcased a while back.

10, absolutely agree. I've only ever once seen a MWO TV commercial, and that was back in 2011/2012 or something. Problem is that's a lot of effort for not a lot of return.

Edited by Alan Davion, 21 December 2016 - 06:30 AM.

[RestosIII]

All of you are fools of the highest caliber. What we really need is a custom radio station for you to listen to while playing the game. I want to be able to pipe this through the speakers in my cockpit while playing for maximum Clan Diamond Shark immersion!

[Rebas Kradd]

Tristan Winter, on 20 December 2016 - 09:25 AM, said:

Remember this?

http://mwomercs.com/...-3-role-warfare

http://mwomercs.com/...le-warfare-cont

We need more of that. We're getting there, but I doubt we'll actually see any kind of synergy where a team without dedicated "scouts" and "commanders" will be at a disadvantage.

That's because a lot of the players don't want the design elements necessary to do it.

In most games, the enemy is revealed within the first thirty seconds of a match and remains both clumped up and well-spotted for the entire match, removing the need for scouts. Maps are nice and wide open, so any old Banshee pilot can scout as well as a Locust. And commanders? Their role is either folded into Teamspeak communication or handed to players (arty/air/UAV) via modules, and with the enemy clumped up due to having a single objective to pursue, there's nothing for a commander to do anyway.

But players don't want to hear this. Give them a map the size of Alpine Peaks that actually requires scouting and they complain about "walking simulator". Give them a map dense enough to make information warfare real and they hate Viridian Bog.

I think we have to face the fact that role warfare just isn't compatible with the quick-drop style of MWO, and the players don't want it to be.

I've suggested a gamemode that might be able to bridge the gap, but PGI's design team keeps listening to the simplistic kiddie ideas like King of the Hill and Escort instead.

[Bud Crue]

Rebas Kradd, on 21 December 2016 - 10:36 AM, said:

I think we have to face the fact that role warfare just isn't compatible with the quick-drop style of MWO, and the players don't want it to be.

I think for a lot of the roles that folks want, particularly scouting, you are correct. But I don't think this is the players fault or the modes, or even the size of the maps. I think this limitation is one created by the stagnant nature of the maps and the lack of any random variables other than (initial day night cycle). I mean once you play a map a few times you know exactly where the enemy is starting from. As such you can also make a good guess of where they are going (Nascar!), and where they are likely to be in a reasonable amount of time. In that environment the only way I can think of to provide any perceived use for scouting is if they made at least the drop zones/starting positions randomized (within reason) or came up with a way to have a random map generator. Without such randomization (or a shi7ton of maps) "scouting" such as it is just about coming up with a conceptual reason to have light mechs in the game as opposed actually giving them a purpose.