55 replies to this topic

[Jiro Yamada]

Soooo, I'm kinda new and I kind of suck at the game, but trying to get better.
The CRB-27B is the first, and only, mech I've bought so far, and I did so before understanding much of the game simply because I thought it looked cool.

I've messed around with the build a bit, but I'm not sure it's doing me any favours. My current build is this abomination. I've only just noticed I could upgrade the structure to endo-steel to make it a little tougher with the loss of nothing else, and gain enough tonnage to max out the armour while I'm at it.

However before I spend 500k of my limited c-bills on doing so I thought I might come to you lot for some advice just in case I need to rip the whole thing apart.

On a related note, if I were to change the structure to endo-steel, then need to change it back to normal, then want to change it back yet again, would I need to pay that 500k a second time or is it a once paid it's an option forever kind of deal?

[Exard3k]

As a rule of thumb, always get endo-steel and double heat sinks on any mech. There are exceptions of course.

And switching upgrades always costs cbills. So choose wisely But you want to keep endo-steel forever on this mech. The weight savings (~3tons for the Crab) are too valuable to not use it.

And reduce your rear armor....5-10 points is plenty, the enemy usually is in front of you and not in your back. The more experienced you are, the less rear armor you will want/need. Veteran players often don't even have 5 points there.

Oh and low rear armor gets you better situational awareness in the long run.

edit: drop some armor (like head armor and a bit of legs or arms) to upgrade the small laser to a medium. You only have 2 weapon types then, easier to use and more effective.

edit: Endo-Steel reduces the weight of the chassis / frame of the mech from 10% of maximum tonnage to 5% of maximum tonnage (55t in your case). So it acts like carbon fiber for sports cars...it's lightweight material.

Edited by Exard3k, 26 November 2017 - 11:19 AM.

[Koniving]

Endo doesn't actually make something tougher, just lighter.

So. Minor modifications.

Ferro dropped (in lore its good and readily available, but MWO pretty much ignores lore otherwise nobody would be able to use endo on just anything... so always go with endo) and endo added.

Small laser dropped in favor of a medium laser. Armor reallocated. I prefer 2 on my rears but given you're new, 8 might be more suitable. ER Large lasers on firing group one. ER MLs on group two. (Or vice versa).

With the new changes, use ER Large to hit enemies at longer ranges but no greater than 1 1/2 (1.5x) the stated range of the weapon in your weapon display. As they get close enough for your ER MLs at the range they state, drop the ER Large laser fire and just use them. If the mech gets hot, drop the ER MLs and go back to the ER LLs even at that closer range.

In case of emergency (really big mean guy WAAAY too close), if you're below 70% heat, fire all at once and RUN. If you're above 70% heat, fire all at once and PRAY (and mash O). (Or mash O first, fire at all once and then run).

Somewhere in there I added another heatsink.

Weapons are simplified. Another heatsink added. Structure/armor optimized.

(To answer the other question, yes. But given this is a Crab, there is no need to change it multiple times. If you were using an assault mech you will run into that issue, and on some heavies.)

Edited by Koniving, 26 November 2017 - 11:21 AM.

[jss78]

The CRB-27b is one of my favourite 'mechs, and I'd say it's a great choice for a new player. It's a nice sturdy medium, with an easy-to-play all-energy loadout.

My favourite build for this one tends to be 3xERLL (arms and CT) and 1xERML (head). This is my current build, using an LFE-250, an AMS, and making optimal use of crit space. If you want to use your current engine, This one uses your current engine and is very similar.

Some general principles. You always want to add Endo-steel before Ferro/Light-ferro. They do the exact same thing: save tonnage but use crit-space, however Endo saves more tonnage than Ferro, and is thus more optimal. So on all my 'mechs I always add Endo. I then add Ferro IF it fits in terms of crit space. If not, I try to add light-ferro (uses half as many crit spaces but also saves half as much tonnage) if possible. Otherwise I'll use regular armour.

With armour, I always use full CT armour, generally also full arm armour. To free up an even half.ton for equipment, I'm comfortable taking head down to about 10, and removing a few points from legs (my builds above do this).

[Koniving]

Am running Crabs in the field right now, so later today I might have some videos of gameplay up if anyone's interested.

[Jiro Yamada]

I'd be very interested, Koniving.

And thank you everyone for the advice so far, it's been really good and positive and helps me get a better understanding of what options are open to me.

[Sonny Black]

One build you might look at

[WrathOfDeadguy]

The 27B also does very well with MPLs. It makes a fantastic light chaser or flanker/striker. I don't drive it much, but when I do it always performs, and it's something that the other Crabs can't do as well. STD engine version.

Here's another idea, for something with a bit more range that can sustain a high rate of fire. I don't really like the 27B for triple large laser configs because, with that one extra hardpoint vs. the other Crabs, it can squeeze in an extra ML to bring firepower comparable to the triple large builds but with a larger engine. More ERLLs would mean a longer effective range, but I have a bunch of other 'Mechs with more high mounts that fill the ERLL vomit role better. Either that, or I'm just that bad at long-range Crabbing (entirely possible; I'm not much of a sniper).

[Koniving]

Well after a few runs with my own build... on maps less than advantageous to me I'm actually adopting my modification of the OP's build for a while.

[Jiro Yamada]

Maybe a stupid question, but on Koniving's build there, is there any reason to go for standard armour rather than light ferro, which seems to fit and give me about half a ton more to top up a little armour here and there?

[WrathOfDeadguy]

If you have the extra slots for it, yes, light ferro is a great idea with no real downside. It's actually been the sleeper hit of Civil War tech for that little bit of extra tonnage it can add to builds that were almost but not quite there before. There are a few different things you could do with the tonnage, though. You could max out your armor, or you could drop one engine rating for an additional half-ton and squeeze one more DHS on, like so.

Sort of a related note... 280LFE is an engine you'll find a lot of uses for- it's in a bit of a goldilocks zone in that it's fast enough for a wide variety of 'Mechs, but light enough to not limit their loadout options too much. Below 40 tons 280LFE eats too much tonnage, and over 65 tons it's a little on the slow side, but for anything within that range? It's a really, really useful engine rating, unless the 'Mech has too low of a cap for it... and Crabs don't have that problem. If you're looking for a way to save money until you amass some more wealth, buying a single engine that can be shared by a lot of different 'Mechs and builds is not a bad way to do it.

[Tesunie]

Jiro Yamada, on 26 November 2017 - 10:47 AM, said:

Soooo, I'm kinda new and I kind of suck at the game, but trying to get better.
The CRB-27B is the first, and only, mech I've bought so far, and I did so before understanding much of the game simply because I thought it looked cool.

I've messed around with the build a bit, but I'm not sure it's doing me any favours. My current build is this abomination. I've only just noticed I could upgrade the structure to endo-steel to make it a little tougher with the loss of nothing else, and gain enough tonnage to max out the armour while I'm at it.

However before I spend 500k of my limited c-bills on doing so I thought I might come to you lot for some advice just in case I need to rip the whole thing apart.

On a related note, if I were to change the structure to endo-steel, then need to change it back to normal, then want to change it back yet again, would I need to pay that 500k a second time or is it a once paid it's an option forever kind of deal?

It seems like you've already got a lot of good answers already, but I'm adding in my little extra.

I'll remark, you are already very close to my heavy hitting Crab build as it is. With only a few minor changes you'll have basically a really good loadout.

What I have is 2 LLs and 4 ERMLs. I can be a bit toasty, but with good fire control it can be very deadly, even on hot maps such as Tormaline, Tarra Therma or even the new map Rubbilite Oasis. I have it set up with 3 weapon groups, each arm laser set on their own respective weapon groups (left and right arms are separate groups) and the torso ERMLs are a third weapon group. Really lets me control my heat according to what I need at the time. Treat it as a mid ranged skirmisher and try to keep targets within 500-300m away...

Biggest change is removing FF to LFF and adding in Endo. It's worth it, and you've actually chosen a really nice mech to start off with. For additional advice, concentrate on understanding how Cool Shot consumables work (and learning when it is worth using them) and Cool Run skills on the Skill Tree (then survival and then whatever).

Of course, it is your game/mech, so do as you see fit and as you feel you need to do. What may work for me may not work so well for you. So experiment a bit.

PS: Your engine is bigger than mine, so the link I provide is a list of recommended changes. Not my actual build I use myself... Just... if it was relevant.

Edited by Tesunie, 26 November 2017 - 11:42 PM.

[Koniving]

I had some setbacks. They'll be featured in a separate video... which coincidentally can showcase how much the Crab can tank even with an LFE.

Will be uploading tomorrow instead and spending my free time today to capture more footage.

[Cato Phoenix]

CRB-27B- ERMEDs

Because symmetry is awesome. You can work in a LAMS in there too by subtracting a DHS and skimming leg armor, which might work nicely given your goodly amount of heat sinks.

But personally, I would roll with this BAMF:

Endo+Light Ferro, and 6 MPLAS. at 95KPH unskilled and with a ton of structure to bump up. Beastly.

CRB-27B- MPLAS


Front/rear distributions per preference. I would likely run 5 rear.

Edited by Cato Phoenix, 27 November 2017 - 08:11 AM.

[Tesunie]

Koniving, on 26 November 2017 - 11:16 AM, said:

With the new changes, use ER Large to hit enemies at longer ranges but no greater than 1 1/2 (1.5x) the stated range of the weapon in your weapon display. As they get close enough for your ER MLs at the range they state, drop the ER Large laser fire and just use them. If the mech gets hot, drop the ER MLs and go back to the ER LLs even at that closer range.

Have you considered replacing the ERLLs for normal LLs? Runs cooler, recycles sooner and shares very similar ranges to the ERMLs meaning you can shoot everything when it's in range. Getting hot? Shoot an ERMLs and a LL group at a time to keep the pressure on, but not overheat yourself.

Just a small suggestion.

[Koniving]

Tesunie, on 27 November 2017 - 09:28 AM, said:

Have you considered replacing the ERLLs for normal LLs? Runs cooler, recycles sooner and shares very similar ranges to the ERMLs meaning you can shoot everything when it's in range. Getting hot? Shoot an ERMLs and a LL group at a time to keep the pressure on, but not overheat yourself.

Just a small suggestion.

Actually dropped them altogether due to not owning and not having the funds for a LFE 285. At first I went from my LFE 250 and 4 LPPCs and 2 backup lasers to a STD 285, 4 ER ML and 2 ML. But as soon as I did that all the closeup battles turned into long range camp fests on big maps with game modes that discouraged close combat. So I changed back. Only for it to be nothing but smaller maps and rush 'em style gameplay. So I dropped the 2 ML and a heatsink and put in a Light PPC on the nose while keeping the STD 285 and 4 ER ML...

and now I have something that lets me do....something... in either case.

[Koniving]

My Crab 27 with its twin AMS, 2 LPPC and 3 ER ML did phenomenally well with plenty of gameplay in both styles to really enjoy and be satisfied with the footage I got.

But as it was supposed to be a Crab marathon, I went right to the Crab 27B after a couple of matches and despite how things had gone my way before, nothing was going my way at all. It was as best as one could put it, a **** show. Even today it's been a mixed bag. The only thing I've truly learned is that LFE or STD engine, a Crab 27B can stand up to sustained fire from 2 to 4 assaults alongside 2-4 heavies with some mediums and lights for a total of up to 8 mechs firing upon it at the same time, and survive for up to 49 seconds of heavily sustained fire with no reprieve.

And my record low health is now 3%, lower than I have ever achieved with any mech in the game before, using the Crab 27B. (With quirks and almost full survival tree against a total of 8 to 9 mechs firing on me at the same time to include all weapon classes and some RAC/5s as well as Clan ultras and SRMs and LRMs of both sides, I managed one kill with a single medium laser that was left to me just prior to my death as I spent the entire time chasing one dude and drawing as much fire as I could so my team could push. My team lost anyway, but we had lost too many guys by the time I gave them this opportunity.)

My lowest until then was 5% and surviving to kill every enemy in a 3 against 1 engagement against a Firestarter, Banshee and a Catapult constantly peppering me with LRMs, coming out with a single weapon left and just 5 shots of that weapon left over after making that final kill, achieved using the Misery hero mech. (Before quirks and the current skill tree.)

Edited by Koniving, 27 November 2017 - 10:05 AM.

[Tesunie]

Koniving, on 27 November 2017 - 09:53 AM, said:

Actually dropped them altogether due to not owning and not having the funds for a LFE 285. At first I went from my LFE 250 and 4 LPPCs and 2 backup lasers to a STD 285, 4 ER ML and 2 ML. But as soon as I did that all the closeup battles turned into long range camp fests on big maps with game modes that discouraged close combat. So I changed back. Only for it to be nothing but smaller maps and rush 'em style gameplay. So I dropped the 2 ML and a heatsink and put in a Light PPC on the nose while keeping the STD 285 and 4 ER ML...

and now I have something that lets me do....something... in either case.

Mine has a LFE 275 with 5 external heat sinks (plus an extra in the engine) (16 total), LFF and Endo with two LLs and four ERMLs. I don't know if that's helpful to you at all, but you can also run it with a Std 250 engine and remove a single heat sink. 81 KPH isn't bad to work with...

[Koniving]

For some reason 81 doesn't feel the same in a Crab as it does in a Dragon. In a Dragon it is plenty sufficient. In a Crab it feels like you're crawling at a snail's pace. It was hard to deal with close combat. I suppose another issue is my dragons have at least 6 kinetic acceleration unlocks, but my crabs have none.

The main reason for my trouble is with the 27B, I focused on Crab lore. Fantastic sensors, great heat management, so I nearly maxed out Sensors and Mech Operations. The weapons are too slow to keep up with those whom jacked up their firepower. Yes my weapons are cold but I can't fire as frequently, my beams last longer, I'm also not as agile as many of my opponents. Troubles that my Crab 27's focus on firepower completely avoids.

[Robaxacet]

lol, don't forget to upload the one with you stuck on the wall Kon. Ah glitchy Rubellite.