198 replies to this topic

[Snazzy Dragon]

Personally I think it is too low. Feels like counterstrike with mechs with all the PPC + gauss boats running around. And increasing cooldown time won't really do anything-- there will still be high alpha strikes, and with longer cooldowns it is likely you will see less overheating anyway.

isXL compounds it

Assaults feel like paper still, despite massive structure buffs. Atlases always end up as sticks, assuming they aren't just cored out-- and any mech like the stalker which has no such quirks will quickly be stripped

I really can't blame people for "hiding" and trying not to ever expose for more than a couple seconds-- you are absolutely trashed if you do.

But what are YOUR thoughts about it?

[Ultimax]

TTK is fine.

If you feel like this is counter strike then you have either never actually played counter strike or you are just really bad at this game.

[Juodas Varnas]

I blame the clans and the absolutely insane level of power-creep they introduced.


I'd nerf every single variable - from twist-speed, to turn-speed, to weapon cooldowns and durations.
EVERYTHING.

Edited by Juodas Varnas, 06 January 2017 - 07:40 AM.

[mogs01gt]

ttk is too low. The further this game gets away from CoD the better.

[DGTLDaemon]

Actually, the game feels reasonalby slow-paced to me, and I don't see any issues with TTK. Most mechs last long enough, unless you get focused by the entire enemy team, but that would be a tactical error on your part, and not a problem with TTK per se. There are some mechs that do feel like they are made of tissue paper, like Jenner IIC or Hunchback IIC, but I believe they were made that way by design. Overall, it takes long enough to kill 12 enemy mechs in a regular QP match, and I don't believe there's any need to increase that time.

[Bud Crue]

As a bit of a loretard with too much imagination I think it is still a bit to low. I think the last pass where they converted some of the mechs structure quirks to armor was the right idea.

Using the Atlas example in the OP, I too think they ought to tank damage while remaining functional a bit longer. I mean as it is 2 alphas from a good mech can core out the its RT and take out the AC20. In a 12 v 12 match this is near instantaneous if you are out in the open and exposed to all those gauss/erppcs. Sure the Atlas will last a bit longer with all that structure, but once its guns are gone who cares? Switch some (all) of that extra structure to armor, and maybe, just maybe that atlas will survive a trip across the valley on Frozen, the river crossing on River, etc. and still at least have a gun or some SRMs to bring to bear before dying.

[mogs01gt]

DGTLDaemon, on 06 January 2017 - 07:44 AM, said:

Actually, the game feels reasonalby slow-paced to me, and I don't see any issues with TTK. Most mechs last long enough, unless you get focused by the entire enemy team, but that would be a tactical error on your part, and not a problem with TTK per se. There are some mechs that do feel like they are made of tissue paper, like Jenner IIC or Hunchback IIC, but I believe they were made that way by design. Overall, it takes long enough to kill 12 enemy mechs in a regular QP match, and I don't believe there's any need to increase that time.

Matches take like 7 minutes to complete, how is that slow paced? I'd rather see matches last double that.

[Snazzy Dragon]

Ultimax, on 06 January 2017 - 07:36 AM, said:

TTK is fine.

If you feel like this is counter strike then you have either never actually played counter strike or you are just really bad at this game.

I pull my own weight and then some. I won't say I'm a great player, but I'm certainly not bad, either-- I twist, shield, aim well, place my shots where I want them. I'm just not satisfied when I kill a heavy mech in two or three shots, nor am I satisfied when an assault charges in only to get mowed down instantly. So much for pushing.

[Bombast]

Eh...

On personal preference, ignoring what kind of game MWO is as a whole, I think TTK is way, way, WAY too low. Feels too twitchy, and it's hard to enjoy 'actual' combat most of the time - Most of your thinking is done behind cover.

Taking into account what kind of game MWO is... I think it's just a tad too low. Just a smidge.

I also have to agree that comparing it to Counter-Strike is a bit disingenuous. While one will occassionally get the Counter-Strike-ish experience of 'Walked around corner, fell over dead before I even saw what hit me,' it's not typical.

[Snazzy Dragon]

Bombast, on 06 January 2017 - 07:49 AM, said:

Eh...

On personal preference, ignoring what kind of game MWO is as a whole, I think TTK is way, way, WAY too low. Feels too twitchy, and it's hard to enjoy 'actual' combat most of the time - Most of your thinking is done behind cover.

Taking into account what kind of game MWO is... I think it's just a tad too low. Just a smidge.

I also have to agree that comparing it to Counter-Strike is a bit disingenuous. While one will occassionally get the Counter-Strike-ish experience of 'Walked around corner, fell over dead before I even saw what hit me,' it's not typical.

It's a little bit of a stretch, yeah. But it gets the point across.

[Mechteric]

When you have 12 mechs per team on the field, and more than 50% of them are heavy and assault mechs, welll that's just what it's going to feel like when you have a lot of firepower pointed right at ya.

[NextGame]

Quote

How do you feel about the current ttk?

I die to quickly.
My team die to quickly.
The other team die too slowly.

[Tristan Winter]

It's a bit too low right now because of power creep / hardpoint inflation. But even if you look away from all that, the speed with which a 12xSPL Nova can destroy any mech in MWO is quite terrifying.

Even if you look away from Kodiaks and Night Gyrs and everything else, if you just look at a 4v4 Scouting match with SRM Griffins and SPL Novas, it's all over very quickly indeed. Pick a target. Focus fire. 200 damage is vomited out every 3-4 seconds. One kill, two kills, three kills, aaand it's gone. ggclose. New match. Coolshots for everyone.

It would be nice if we had that heatscale from TT that reduces mobility and other characteristics when you're constantly operating at 80-90% heat capacity.

Another aspect which a lot of people loathe to admit, is that there are zero negative consequences for dying in this game. You can die after 2 minutes, disconnect, start a new match, die after 2 minutes, disconnect. "Oh, I died. Now my team will get roflstomped. Too bad. I'm already looking for a new match".

It's not just that TTK is too low, it's also that many players are throwing their mechs at the enemy, basically flipping a coin to see if they will win or lose. I know a lot of people hated the MWO challenges where you had to win the match and stay alive until it was over, but those challenges actually increased TTK because people were playing the game like their lives and their mechs were actually precious. Yes, you got a lot of morons hiding and waiting for their teammates to carry them to victory. But after R&R was removed, those few weekends have been the only periods where people played MWO as if staying alive was actually a goal in itself, instead of just charging the enemy at full throttle, vomiting 300-500 damage if possible, dying and then disconnecting.

Edited by Tristan Winter, 06 January 2017 - 08:00 AM.

[Mole]

Having played Call of Duty tactical realism back in the day where one shot almost always killed I can tell you that TTK is pretty good. I mean let's be honest, real-life tank battles between two equally advanced modern battletanks has come down to whoever manages to get the first shot off because the ordnance they are carrying is so powerful that even the most advanced armor systems can't resist it. The fact that I'm able to take multiple AC/20s and other such cannons designed to kill 'mechs to the face before actually going down makes me feel quite tanky. Only time I start feeling fragile is when I'm piloting certain mediums and lights. Oh, my Mauler feels extraordinarily fragile too. I'm not sure why. But that's a problem with that particular 'mech.

[DGTLDaemon]

Mole, on 06 January 2017 - 07:56 AM, said:

I mean let's be honest, real-life tank battles between two equally advanced modern battletanks has come down to whoever manages to get the first shot off because the ordnance they are carrying is so powerful that even the most advanced armor systems can't resist it.

Good point. In real-life armored combat, it's usually all about seeing the enemy first and firing first. Compared to that, MWO offers a lot of leniency as to how many mistakes you can make and how much enemy fire you can take before you go down. Keep that in mind when complaining about TTK being too low By real-life standards, it takes an eternity of pounding on the enemy mech's armor before it finally dies, especially if it's a tanky assault like the Atlas.

Edited by DGTLDaemon, 06 January 2017 - 08:02 AM.

[Bombast]

Mole, on 06 January 2017 - 07:56 AM, said:

Oh, my Mauler feels extraordinarily fragile too. I'm not sure why. But that's a problem with that particular 'mech.

That's easy. It's because it is huge, and thus both easy to see, and easy to hit. Most assaults suffer the same fate - Atlases, Awesomes, Zeuses, all of them are are just big, delicious targets everyone can hit, and so they do.

Also, structure HP per ton decreases as tonnage increases, though it shouldn't drop enough for you to notice that much.

[mogs01gt]

Mole, on 06 January 2017 - 07:56 AM, said:

Having played Call of Duty tactical realism back in the day where one shot almost always killed I can tell you that TTK is pretty good. I mean let's be honest, real-life tank battles between two equally advanced modern battletanks has come down to whoever manages to get the first shot off because the ordnance they are carrying is so powerful that even the most advanced armor systems can't resist it. The fact that I'm able to take multiple AC/20s and other such cannons designed to kill 'mechs to the face before actually going down makes me feel quite tanky. Only time I start feeling fragile is when I'm piloting certain mediums and lights. Oh, my Mauler feels extraordinarily fragile too. I'm not sure why. But that's a problem with that particular 'mech.

Why are you comparing a video game to real life?

You need to compare MWO to lore and in lore, it took shots to the same spot to penetrate armor(depending on the mech). We do not have real armor in MWO.

[Kaspirikay]

this game is a thinking mans shooter

[Snazzy Dragon]

Kaspirikay, on 06 January 2017 - 08:05 AM, said:

this game is a thinking mans shooter

peek
alpha
pull back
cool off and reposition
peek
alpha
pull back
cool off and reposition.....

Obviously there's more to it than that but poking effectively isn't that hard.

Edited by Snazzy Dragon, 08 January 2017 - 03:04 PM.

[Vanguard836]

Snazzy Dragon, on 06 January 2017 - 08:07 AM, said:

peek
alpha
pull back
cool off and reposition
peek
alpha
pull back
cool off and reposition.....

So tell us how would you do it, how would you improve ttk.