23 replies to this topic

[Garfuncle]

Yes, the Bushwacker. A great variety of hardpoints over a selection of variants...surely PGI will give it some generic quirks to reflect that.

Oh, machineguns you say? Of course! They are what is best known of the Bushwacker. Why didn't I see this sooner?

[SuomiWarder]

Um, in what Universe are Bushies known for MGs? I guess it was some type of "ironic" or joke post making a point I don't understand.

[Snazzy Dragon]

SuomiWarder, on 20 January 2017 - 04:39 PM, said:

Um, in what Universe are Bushies known for MGs? I guess it was some type of "ironic" or joke post making a point I don't understand.

A lot of the bushwacker variants have machine gun quirks but most of them lack decent "real" ballistic quirks.

[Deathlike]

This is PGI's way of "Making MGs Great Again".

[El Bandito]

Deathlike, on 20 January 2017 - 04:43 PM, said:

This is PGI's way of "Making MGs Great Again".

Yep. It is PGI's way of thinking. Instead of just buffing the weapon they are simply gonna spam quirks. PGI should do us a favor and just universally increase LRM velocity by 10%.

[Antares102]

Be happy that it didnt get flamer quirks.
Or shutdown quirks.
Or +5sec out-of-bounds quirk
Or reduced collision damage quirk

[KuroNyra]

If only MG could have a range of 900meters.

At least they would serve something....


They do in MW:LL, and it work rather nicely.

Edited by KuroNyra, 21 January 2017 - 02:36 AM.

[ChapeL]

This thread brings up a good question though: What IS the Bushwacker known for ?

[Hit the Deck]

ChapeL, on 21 January 2017 - 02:41 AM, said:

This thread brings up a good question though: What IS the Bushwacker known for ?

Your starter 'Mech in MW3.

[KuroNyra]

Hit the Deck, on 21 January 2017 - 02:50 AM, said:

Your starter 'Mech in MW3.

Never played it.
In MW:4, I knew I was always going for an Assault mech.... Dire Wolf...

[Tristan Winter]

Giving the Bushwacker MG quirks is actually the right thing to do. PGI did a good job here.

I will explain.

• Bushwacker is one of several Iconic mechs in MWO that carry MGs stock. Other examples include CPLT-K2, Battlemaster, Thunderbolt, RVN-4X and Phoenix Hawk.
  
• As a rule of thumb, MGs are not useful in MWO unless boated (4+ of them) or unless they have MG quirks.
  
• The only way to let players enjoy those Iconic mechs with something close to stock builds (for nostalgia), is to give quirks to builds that would not otherwise be viable. After all, many of us are trying to recreate Battletech / Mechwarrior partially as we remember it from TT or video games.
  
• As long as these mechs have other quirks too, there's literally no drawback to giving them some MG RoF quirks in order to allow for more than a few meta builds. People are going to use the Bushie to boat UAC5s or SRMs or Large Lasers no matter what. But now we can have some MG builds too, perhaps.

I wish PGI did more of this. There are literally no drawbacks. Giving weapon quirks is not a zero sum game.

[MacClearly]

SuomiWarder, on 20 January 2017 - 04:39 PM, said:

Um, in what Universe are Bushies known for MGs? I guess it was some type of "ironic" or joke post making a point I don't understand.

Really? You are struggling to see the sarcasm here? It's overt...

[Robinhood78]

The mech comes with basically no quirks because that's all being thrown out with the new "skill tree" system coming soon. All of your mechs will have to be reevaluated since you probably built them with quirks in mind. You, in theory, will be able to recreate those quirks under the new system. But we just really don't know anything about it yet except for the 30 sec clip they showed at mechcon.

[Steve Pryde]

Bushwacker quirks only shows that PGI is balancing with dartboards sadly.

[Bishop Steiner]

ChapeL, on 21 January 2017 - 02:41 AM, said:

This thread brings up a good question though: What IS the Bushwacker known for ?

honestly? Absolutely nothing.

It's a funny shaped, non jumping Shadow Hawk for the 3055 and later era. Whoop De Do.

[FLG 01]

ChapeL, on 21 January 2017 - 02:41 AM, said:

This thread brings up a good question though: What IS the Bushwacker known for ?

For a while the Bushwacker was a bit of a posterboy for BattleTech, featured in the TV show, video games, toys, and the cover TRO:3058. It never caught on as much as a Timberwolf or an Atlas, of course, but it definitely has its place in the representation of 90ies Battletech.

Therefore, the lore is quite rich. It was one of the first genuinely new Mechs using the rediscovered SL-tech rather than being a refit, and it went some unusual ways. This also caused some design troubles which only could be overcome after studying Clan Mechs. The Bushwacker was used to replace losses against the Clans and was well received in the whole Commonwealth, which is rather unusual for a Steiner Mech (remember how the Zeus was relegated to second line units in Davion space). Perhaps the fact that it was featured in a popular Holovid helped... I personally like that it was used by both the 11th Lyran Guards and the Kathil Uhlans when they destroyed the Jaguars on their own homeworld.

In TT games it is merely a solid workhorse with most of its weapons supplementing each other quite nicely, and it gets better with every new variant. However, it is a bit slow for the standards of the time, the MGs are actually quite difficult to use effectively, the 11th DHS is nonsense, the choice of an AC/10 in early variants is strange etc. Overall it is a sound design though, just not perfect. In many ways it is the definition of mediocre. (The -L1 however is just great)

[Barantor]

It was the "new mech" for a while after the clan invasion, kinda the iconic uparming of the IS to push back the clans. It's almost the same kinda of way propaganda is around new military tech in the real world "Look our new Tank is going to push back the enemy!" type thing.

It was known for using clan ideas for it's engine, which was copied from captured Vultures.

[Lances107]

I dont know what set ups will work in this game, but in MW4 it was the heavy of the IS medium mechs. Essentially the stormcrow. You could plant I think it was a gauss on one, with a mrms/srms, and a couple of pulse lasers. Essentially turning it to quite the killer. I have no idea how it will play out in this game. I was honestly too furious with all the clan nerfs to even bother looking the bushwackers set up. Lore wise if I am not mistaken, it was designed as a much needed counter to the clans, similar to the black knight in that respect. Though they really got the black knight wrong in this game.

[RestosIII]

Tristan Winter, on 21 January 2017 - 05:46 AM, said:

Giving the Bushwacker MG quirks is actually the right thing to do. PGI did a good job here.

I will explain.

• Bushwacker is one of several Iconic mechs in MWO that carry MGs stock. Other examples include CPLT-K2, Battlemaster, Thunderbolt, RVN-4X and Phoenix Hawk.
  
• As a rule of thumb, MGs are not useful in MWO unless boated (4+ of them) or unless they have MG quirks.
  
• The only way to let players enjoy those Iconic mechs with something close to stock builds (for nostalgia), is to give quirks to builds that would not otherwise be viable. After all, many of us are trying to recreate Battletech / Mechwarrior partially as we remember it from TT or video games.
  
• As long as these mechs have other quirks too, there's literally no drawback to giving them some MG RoF quirks in order to allow for more than a few meta builds. People are going to use the Bushie to boat UAC5s or SRMs or Large Lasers no matter what. But now we can have some MG builds too, perhaps.

I wish PGI did more of this. There are literally no drawbacks. Giving weapon quirks is not a zero sum game.

Absolutely agree with all of this, which is obvious because of the sort of horrible, horrible things I do for lore builds, but I will say, I wish they had made a MG quirks a little bit better. Because unless MGs are getting a line on the skill tree (fingers crossed!) they're not going to be worth it still on the Bushwacker in all likelyhood.

[LordNothing]

they will let the clan have their monster unnerfed kodiak 3 for 14 months, but hell forbid one of the big clan busting mech even approach the threshold of op. doa. also rip whammy.