53 replies to this topic

[McHoshi]

So it´s PGI ( PST ) Time: Tuesday, February 07 2017 - 10:08 AM and the Huntsman still isn´t available for CBills! Another Lie by PGI - Well done *******!

[Jaspbo1]

McHoshi, on 07 February 2017 - 10:09 AM, said:

So it´s PGI ( PST ) Time: Tuesday, February 07 2017 - 10:08 AM and the Huntsman still isn´t available for CBills! Another Lie by PGI - Well done *******!

Indeed, another lie! Breaking down the support and fracturing the very core itself. This little 'update' is pivotal to keeping the game running and they bunked it!
Whatever shall we do?

[Appogee]

45 minutes after the release date, and it's still not available for CBills in the store...

EDIT: relogged and available now.

Edited by Appogee, 07 February 2017 - 11:26 AM.

[Pariah Devalis]

Friendly FYI to all the streak/splatmen I am seeing: don't. Not in public drops, anyways. Short of mining collective or river city, the mech is a smidge too slow to pull off such a short ranged setup. Now, in Scouting? Bring 'em. Even the streakman brings enough streaks to compensate somewhat for how terrible SSRM are. Scouting Mode is the brawl configured Huntsman's thing. In a map that requires more movement, however, it's gonna be hardmode. Devastating if you get behind the enemy team, but otherwise a lot of waiting for the brawl phase.

Edited by Pariah Devalis, 07 February 2017 - 03:32 PM.

[Pariah Devalis]

NRP, on 07 February 2017 - 07:28 AM, said:

I'm probably in the minority here, but I really don't like the Huntsman. I just can't seem to gel with it. I'm seriously thinking about just GXPING them to basic and selling the lot of them. I'll keep the hero.

Something to note:

I love the Huntsman, but this mech is very different pre-elited vs post. It feels totally different. Once you get the efficiencies out of the way, the mech really comes into its own. Before hand, however, it feels a little too sluggish in everything it does. Once it has the basics doubled, and the elites socketed in, the mech just performs. It's oddly bipolar that way.

For those eyeballing it for scouting, here is a weapons test. I don't actually recommend all 5x SPLas, since it is a little too hot, but 4x is plenty to get the job done. You can also slot in an AP instead of a TC1, depending on if you want slightly higher crits or passive ECM jamming.

Spoiler

And here is the 4x SPLas variation in action.

Spoiler

And because everyone owes it to themselves to run this build at least once, 8x ASRM4. XD

Spoiler

Edited by Pariah Devalis, 08 February 2017 - 07:55 AM.

[Gas Guzzler]

Pariah Devalis, on 08 February 2017 - 07:21 AM, said:

Something to note:

I love the Huntsman, but this mech is very different pre-elited vs post. It feels totally different. Once you get the efficiencies out of the way, the mech really comes into its own. Before hand, however, it feels a little too sluggish in everything it does. Once it has the basics doubled, and the elites socketed in, the mech just performs. It's oddly bipolar that way.

For those eyeballing it for scouting, here is a weapons test. I don't actually recommend all 5x SPLas, since it is a little too hot, but 4x is plenty to get the job done. You can also slot in an AP instead of a TC1, depending on if you want slightly higher crits or passive ECM jamming.

Spoiler

And here is the 4x SPLas variation in action.

Spoiler

And because everyone owes it to themselves to run this build at least once, 8x ASRM4. XD

Spoiler

I wonder if the Skill Tree will allow it to get to its current level of agility and double basics and such...

[Pariah Devalis]

Gas Guzzler, on 08 February 2017 - 08:11 AM, said:

I wonder if the Skill Tree will allow it to get to its current level of agility and double basics and such...

That's a very good question. If we can tailor the "quirks" we want via the tree, it could theoretically end up even more maneuverable, but... we know too little. None of the mechs in the game might move as well as they do now, though. I'd love to see the PTS, already. Looking forward to seeing what sort of movement based quirks, as well as structure/armor type quirks are available in those trees.

[Gas Guzzler]

Pariah Devalis, on 08 February 2017 - 08:23 AM, said:

That's a very good question. If we can tailor the "quirks" we want via the tree, it could theoretically end up even more maneuverable, but... we know too little. None of the mechs in the game might move as well as they do now, though. I'd love to see the PTS, already. Looking forward to seeing what sort of movement based quirks, as well as structure/armor type quirks are available in those trees.

Yeah, I just worry that a lot of these mechs that work in the game now will feel bad when they don't have the +20% heat capacity, +15% heat dissipation, all the agilities, speed tweak, etc. If you think about it, its a lot of stuff, and PGI might see it as a great way to nerf Clan mechs, by making the skill tree so that they can't regain everything that they have currently, which will really hurt the Clan mechs in the middle of the pack, like the Huntsman.

[Pariah Devalis]

Gas Guzzler, on 08 February 2017 - 08:27 AM, said:

Yeah, I just worry that a lot of these mechs that work in the game now will feel bad when they don't have the +20% heat capacity, +15% heat dissipation, all the agilities, speed tweak, etc. If you think about it, its a lot of stuff, and PGI might see it as a great way to nerf Clan mechs, by making the skill tree so that they can't regain everything that they have currently, which will really hurt the Clan mechs in the middle of the pack, like the Huntsman.

On the other hand, if PGI doesn't give preferential treatment to anyone with regards to the skill tree "quirks," it could force a higher TTK if everything gets reduced. In theory, it wouldn't make a middle of the pack mech worse relative to everything else, if the top end platforms got equally hit. It might make the low end mechs feel absolutely awful to play with, though. A case where numerical balancing doesn't pan out with practical use (see: c-ERLLas burn duration vs damage per tick).

Edited by Pariah Devalis, 08 February 2017 - 08:30 AM.

[Gas Guzzler]

Pariah Devalis, on 08 February 2017 - 08:29 AM, said:

On the other hand, if PGI doesn't give preferential treatment to anyone with regards to the skill tree "quirks," it could force a higher TTK if everything gets reduced. In theory, it wouldn't make a middle of the pack mech worse relative to everything else, if the top end platforms got equally hit. It might make the low end mechs feel absolutely awful to play with, though. A case where numerical balancing doesn't pan out with practical use (see: c-ERLLas burn duration vs damage per tick).

Nerfing agility = lower TTK. Nerfing heat cap/dissipation will yield higher TTKs but primarily only when fighting against laser boats.

The IS mechs will probably end up okay, except for the bottom of the barrel which probably won't get enough help. Its the Clan mechs that are average to above average (but not the God tier robots like the Kodiak or Night Gyr) that I am worried about.

[Pariah Devalis]

Gas Guzzler, on 08 February 2017 - 08:34 AM, said:

Nerfing agility = lower TTK. Nerfing heat cap/dissipation will yield higher TTKs but primarily only when fighting against laser boats.

The IS mechs will probably end up okay, except for the bottom of the barrel which probably won't get enough help. Its the Clan mechs that are average to above average (but not the God tier robots like the Kodiak or Night Gyr) that I am worried about.

True about the mobility aspect decreasing TTK. At least at first, until people adapt to the less maneuverable movement profile of all the mechs. The big hit is a change to the heat dissipation and heat capacity, as you said. However, you are correct in that it will disproportionately hit energy platforms harder than ballistics.

Common sense reaction if this creates a huge change in the functionality between the two could simply be to increase ballistic heat. Of course, this hinges on "common sense." It also hurts hybrid builds a bit, that leverage colder heavy ballistics with light but hot energy weapons.

[Gas Guzzler]

Pariah Devalis, on 08 February 2017 - 08:40 AM, said:

True about the mobility aspect decreasing TTK. At least at first, until people adapt to the less maneuverable movement profile of all the mechs. The big hit is a change to the heat dissipation and heat capacity, as you said. However, you are correct in that it will disproportionately hit energy platforms harder than ballistics.

Common sense reaction if this creates a huge change in the functionality between the two could simply be to increase ballistic heat. Of course, this hinges on "common sense." It also hurts hybrid builds a bit, that leverage colder heavy ballistics with light but hot energy weapons.

That helps to keep dakka in line... but the Dual Gauss, ER PPC Night Gyr will definitely still be manageable. Even the Pokebear/MAD-IIC-C/Boiler with dual gauss, dual ER PPC will still be fine.

MAD-IIC is a great example. PPFLD Gauss/ER PPC, followed by the triple UAC5/dual ER PPC and the laser vomit version are all good mechs. Nerfing heat capacity makes the second two much worse, while the first one is only a little hurt in sustained DPS. I speak from experience in that the latter two when I play, I'm constantly at the heat cap, running super hot. While the other one typically runs much much cooler throughout the match.

IMO, when they raised the Clan heat capacity recently, it helped Clan laser boats be a little more relevant and rewarding to play (talking about Quick Play, I know faction play is laser vomit galore but there are other reasons for that), vs the PPFLD versions of the mechs. They are still inferior, but they are more of an option now. I hope that balance is retained by the skill tree.

Edited by Gas Guzzler, 08 February 2017 - 08:48 AM.

[Pariah Devalis]

Gas Guzzler, on 08 February 2017 - 08:48 AM, said:

That helps to keep dakka in line... but the Dual Gauss, ER PPC Night Gyr will definitely still be manageable. Even the Pokebear/MAD-IIC-C/Boiler with dual gauss, dual ER PPC will still be fine.

MAD-IIC is a great example. PPFLD Gauss/ER PPC, followed by the triple UAC5/dual ER PPC and the laser vomit version are all good mechs. Nerfing heat capacity makes the second two much worse, while the first one is only a little hurt in sustained DPS. I speak from experience in that the latter two when I play, I'm constantly at the heat cap, running super hot. While the other one typically runs much much cooler throughout the match.

IMO, when they raised the Clan heat capacity recently, it helped Clan laser boats be a little more relevant and rewarding to play (talking about Quick Play, I know faction play is laser vomit galore but there are other reasons for that), vs the PPFLD versions of the mechs. They are still inferior, but they are more of an option now. I hope that balance is retained by the skill tree.

I wonder how much people would complain if Gauss was no longer only generating 1 heat, but instead produced 5+ heat, with a ghost heat limit of 1 so that firing more than one would start to multiply that low per gun heat generation.

[Gas Guzzler]

Pariah Devalis, on 08 February 2017 - 08:52 AM, said:

I wonder how much people would complain if Gauss was no longer only generating 1 heat, but instead produced 5+ heat, with a ghost heat limit of 1 so that firing more than one would start to multiply that low per gun heat generation.

Not really on board with ghost heat after firing 1 of them, but raising heat might help balance a bit. Without changing anything else, even just 2 or 3 extra heat per gun would definitely be noticeable.