4 replies to this topic

[Rogue Jedi]

I think this is 2 steps foward, 2 back.

having removed the requirement for mastering 3 varients I can understand why a Cbill cost has been added but I think it is too high, lets say someone asks for a good first Mech recomendation and we recomend the long time most recomended new player Mech, the Hunchback, explaining it is good value because they can fully outfit it rather cheep compaired to most other Mechs, but you will then have to spend the same again on outfitting it, the new player will likely balk at the idea of spending more unlocking skills then they did on purchasing the Mech, that also meens on an average game without premium time the new player will not be making any cbills, as they go straight into unlocking Mech skills, meaning they will not feel they are accumplishing anything.

it looks like the CBill cost is about 1 match earnings for an unlock and xp costs is about 1 match earnings for an unlock, so literly you spend a whole (average, without premium time or premium Mech) match earnings on the skill tree, so you will never purchase another Mech while you are unlocking skill tree.

the design of many of the trees requires you to unlock a lot of nodes you do not want to get the ones you do, ok I can understand why you are doing this, but with the high cost, it seems like a bad idea.

I went to upgrade my FS9-E and noticed there is no Machine Gun tree, ok, fair enough a full tree for a single not especialy popular type of weapon probably does not make sense but there are MG modules, so why not put in a condenced MG skill tree ^{(just range and cooldown)}

my sugestions
make it so each skill line can be at least 80% completed without having to unlock skills from another line (e.g. you should not have to unlock torso yaw to unlock arm speed)

reduce the cbill cost per unlock by at least 50%, preferably 75% or even 90% so newer or less skilled players can use consumables or save for new Mechs without completing or giving up on the skill tree.

add something for Machine Guns.

do the above and I would concider this a significant improvement over the old system, as it is now I would not call it much of an improvement, just diferant

[ForceUser]

When taking the 'think of the children/new players' approach, keep in mind that they get a sizable cadet bonus that is (now) enough to fully equip AND master any single mech in the game. Before this change this was not possible AT ALL.

See the reason why the hunchback was suggested is because you could buy and equip 3 of them with the cadet bonus so you could master them. Heck even then you couldn't put modules on them! They're alright mechs make no mistake but something like a timber or a good IS heavy would probably be a better 1st mech. However you couldn't recommend that because you couldn't buy and equip 3 of them with the cadet bonus. Now you can do that AND get the module bonuses that could take hundreds of games or a bunch of MC to unlock.

Honestly the 'think of the poor new players tear in my eye' angle is a little sad whenever people use it since it's so easy to see right through it as simply a way for you to get what you want. People don't give a flying heck about new players.

[Exard3k]

I don't recommend Hunchbacks because they fit within the price range of cadet bonus to master but because of the chassis itself. After one week in each mech, the hunchback pilot will be much more superior in a timber wolf than the timber wolf pilot will be in a hunchback. You learn more about the game with all the hunchbacks. Heck, with cadet bonus +skill system you can go and buy+master a kdk-3 after 25 matches and you can't pilot **** after running it for a week and only knowing kdk-3. But thats off-topic. I agree on Rogue Jedi btw

Edited by Exard3k, 09 February 2017 - 04:59 AM.

[Bud Crue]

ForceUser, on 09 February 2017 - 04:43 AM, said:

When taking the 'think of the children/new players' approach, keep in mind that they get a sizable cadet bonus that is (now) enough to fully equip AND master any single mech in the game. Before this change this was not possible AT ALL.

See the reason why the hunchback was suggested is because you could buy and equip 3 of them with the cadet bonus so you could master them. Heck even then you couldn't put modules on them! They're alright mechs make no mistake but something like a timber or a good IS heavy would probably be a better 1st mech. However you couldn't recommend that because you couldn't buy and equip 3 of them with the cadet bonus. Now you can do that AND get the module bonuses that could take hundreds of games or a bunch of MC to unlock.

Honestly the 'think of the poor new players tear in my eye' angle is a little sad whenever people use it since it's so easy to see right through it as simply a way for you to get what you want. People don't give a flying heck about new players.

<With a bit of snark>
Screw the new player experience.
<snark off>

I'm way more concerned about the fact that my mechs, purchased and mastered under the rule of 3 are now effectively "worth" 1/3 what they were before. I now have dozens -hell, over 100, mastered mechs that will not have sufficient pooled xp or gxp to be mastered under the new system. Moreover if the nerfs presented in the PTS go live I have ZERO incentive to even bother trying to remaster them since they are now either neutered or rendered effectively the same as their chassis mates. Of my 4 Black Knights each with unique builds, between the effective reduction of their XP and the loss of most relevant quirks, I likely won't bother keeping any of them, and will instead look to similar chassis (grasshoppers) that can do their job, and which I have the XP to remaster.

The point being, that the system as currently presented may or may not be bad for NPE, but is is inescapably bad for existing players in terms of lost diversity of mechs, diversity of builds, lost value (in terms of those who have spent real money) and as a consequence of the later most certainly in terms of reduced future sales.

As I said repeatedly over the last month in re the new skills tree: "I hope PGI as thought this through", but if this PTS and the way the skills tree is currently set up is a reflection of their foresight, it would appear that they have unequivocally NOT thought this through.

Edited by Bud Crue, 09 February 2017 - 05:02 AM.

[Rogue Jedi]

ForceUser, on 09 February 2017 - 04:43 AM, said:

When taking the 'think of the children/new players' approach, keep in mind that they get a sizable cadet bonus that is (now) enough to fully equip AND master any single mech in the game. Before this change this was not possible AT ALL.

Honestly the 'think of the poor new players tear in my eye' angle is a little sad whenever people use it since it's so easy to see right through it as simply a way for you to get what you want. People don't give a flying heck about new players.

please check the new player help forum, I am very active in helping the new players and am trying to look out for them.

I am a long term veteran player with over 200 Mechs, with the refunded XP and cbills I will have plenty to master my favorates, and I will probably just forget or sell the ones I do not love.

the cadet bonus is enough to buy any 1 Mech, however if that 1 Mech is a Clan heavy or assualt that cadet bonus and tutorial bonus (17 million total, + match earnings) is gone on the purchase and outfit, they most certainly will not fully master it off cadet bonus cbills, but they could master a light or standard engine medium, maybe even a standard engine heavy.

Edited by Rogue Jedi, 09 February 2017 - 05:06 AM.