17 replies to this topic

[Arcady]

I was rewatching the Centurion reveal video with a friend and I saw something I want to ask the general community about. Now I haven't really played many of the mechwarrior games, I played a little bit of a friends copy of MW2 back in the day, the commander and commander 2, megamek, and the varrious MW4s.

In the Centurion video from about 0:10 to 0:14 the Centurion is standing on a ridge and aiming at a target below it. Now as I understand it the circle cursor represents current point arm weapons are focused on and the cross represents where torso weapon are pointing, you aim by moving the arm icon and the torso catches up over time. However here it appears that the torso doesn't catch up indicating to me that the torso cannot aim down beyond what might be 10 or 20 degrees, this seems to be a pretty big limitation to me.

The same phenomena cam be seen again as the Jenner jumps over the Atlas from 1:25-1:27 in the frozen city reveal video

[Ranager]

now that is interesting, my friend was thinking of using the centurion guess he wont

[Alasian]

Im not getting the centurion anymore

[fatcat01]

I think you are correct; there is a fairly severe limit on vertical torso aiming. But it would look pretty ridiculous if, say, an atlas could tilt its torso back 45 degrees or more. This will also make arm weapons that much more desirable.

Edited by fatcat01, 20 July 2012 - 11:59 AM.

[Alasian]

Im going with the cataphract now

[Noth]

Who says it is only a centurion limitation? The other videos don't have the mech's torsos aiming down far at all.

[latdheretic]

It's not surprising that the torso has a lower range of fire than the arms. In the table top game, the arms have 60 more degrees of firing angle than torso mounted weapons. It is probably going to affect all mechs.

[RedHellion]

I would assume this would be because it's not really possible to have that much tilt with a 'mech's torso? Think about the mechanics and structure of it for a moment; any kind of tilt past 20 degrees up or down would only be possible (and even then only maybe) on something like a Raven or Locust.
I doubt this is a Centurion-only limitation as well, since all 'mechs have the same kind of torso connections. They're made for side-to-side rotation, not vertical movement. A 'mech's arms will logically always have faster and more range of movement than a 'mech's torso.

[Cozmos]

Hello All! Just a guess.....I would say all mechs will have some sort of limits. That said, make better use of jump jets, natural surroundings, and get skilled and pulling the trigger! would love to look straight up and shoot a bird out of the sky with an AC/20 but thats just not fair....: D

[WardenWolf]

This is a huge factor in games like WoT as well, and is based on real physics and the models of the mechs. It is also one of the other advantages to arm weapons - they have a wider range of movement, in trade for their weaker position in terms of armor.

[Arcady]

I suppose my feeling some from two things, my familiarity with MW4 where you can aim your torso what 75 or 80 degrees up or down and my assumption that most torso weapons would mount some sort of internal gimbling, like the Ostsol

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Ostsol

Also looked through the other release videos and can't find any other moments where a mech is aiming at a target far off the y-plane.

[cinco]

good. now we can have proper ranged battles. who wants to see a mech stare into the sky anyway? they'll fall back.

[Fezzwig]

To me it makes sense due to the fact that a mech having to lean forward to shoot downwards would be limited by its center of gravity. The only mech I could see having a greater CT mounted targeting range would be the Wolverine due to its CT mounted ball turret.

[Technohic]

This makes me hopeful that I should be able to aim the arms independently of the torso rather than just aiming the arms and the torso always trying to catch up. Doesn't mean that for sure, but would make sense.

[Shad0wsFury]

if you watch the IGN developer videos for the assault class, the pilot in the video is in an atlas, and you can see the exact same type of thing going on with the limited range of the torso. For the atlas in the video, most of the weapons are contained in the torso (2 medium lasers in the arms, I believe), and while trying to fight lighter opponents, often couldn't get the torso into a good firing position. At one point all 4 medium lasers were grouped (2 torso, 2 arms) and you could see the torso lasers firing off into nothing because the target was moving too fast and only the arm lasers could track that fast, and it was outside the torso's firing arc.

As others have stated, tabletop rules give the mech more of a firing arc with arm-mounted weapons, and it's obviously going to play out somehow in MWO.

This would sorta make the Centurian MORE desirable than say a Hunchback (in some areas), because the Centurian has an ARM MOUNTED autocannon, which will give you that extra tracking and firing arc over the Hunchback's torso mounted autocannon.

Of course, arms tend to get blown off, along with whatever weapon(s) were on them...

Edited by Shad0wsFury, 20 July 2012 - 12:52 PM.

[Kilo Papa Victor]

I would assume this limitation would be on all or almost all mechs. That's why weapon placement and loadout is important. It will also affect your tactics; you should try to place yourself in a position where you won't be limited by torso rotation or elevation.

[Hot Rod]

+1 for finding out!

thats very intresting

[Justesp]

I thought this would've been an obvious assumption even without the video to prove it that torso mounted weapons would have limited vertical traverse. Like others said, I doubt this is a Centurion issue.