179 replies to this topic

[Glaive-]

Bombadil, on 18 February 2017 - 02:46 PM, said:

3 days to release! Supernova animation preview, will be added to main post shortly.

It looks half-decent at that speed, but I'm guessing it bounces as bad as all the other assaults with a maxed engine.

[Brandiment]

Mordent Hex, on 18 February 2017 - 03:59 PM, said:

Is it just me or does it look a little front heavy. The legs need to be angled better. This thing would tip right over on its nose in real life. That said and with everyone seemingly not particularly happy with it, i'm looking forward to it. A 90 ton Ebjag. LOL

Not if the weight was more to the rear of the mech, not only that but the gyro stabilizers and nural connections prevent the mech from "tipping over" cause you know...thats what they are there for. Now please report to your nearest Commissar or Inquisitor of your dose of *Blam* you filthy Heretic.

[cougurt]

Irishtoker, on 18 February 2017 - 05:57 AM, said:

I am just wondering why in the comparison photos no "Chicken Walker" style mechs were used. Shouldn't we see a comparison to similar mechs, not only the Humanoid variants?

There is something they don't want us to know. Queue paranoia.

i assume it's because they're comparing it to other 90 tonners (except for the executioner), none of which have chicken legs.

[Tarogato]

Mordent Hex, on 18 February 2017 - 03:59 PM, said:

Is it just me or does it look a little front heavy. The legs need to be angled better. This thing would tip right over on its nose in real life. That said and with everyone seemingly not particularly happy with it, i'm looking forward to it. A 90 ton Ebjag. LOL

Looks fine to me -- the lack of forward toes throws off perception a bit. I would think they balance about where the ankle joint is.

[Dee Eight]

Should compare it to the Mad2C, Warhawk, and HGN2C. Also to anyone who would say the lack of engine cap limits how many heatsinks you can stuff into the engine space for a high heat energy loadout... its no more limited than a warhawk.

In many ways, a super nova will be a better warhawk other than in terms of speed and pod swapping. Warhawk has FF but not Endo, has 5 tons less mass to play with, while using a 1.5 ton heavier engine that holds no more heatsinks, and also having an 8.5 ton structure to carry around. Just using Endo steel on the S.N's will give another 2 tons more to work with than the FF does for the warhawks.

Edited by Dee Eight, 18 February 2017 - 11:44 PM.

[Akala Tanara]

Is it just me or is the main post running way behind compared to usual, normally, it'd update every day of the count-down, but I was checking yesterday toward noon and 4pm Central US time, and no update, and now after I woke up 2:30am. Not a big deal but I remember most other mechs getting a daily update. The one I decide to preorder, it's lagging behind lol...

All that said, I am moderately excited for it, I loved it in MechWarrior 3, maybe it's not the best mech ever, but I don't care how "good" it is, I love the way it looked then, and the way it looks now. Only reasons I'm less excited is because I'm anticipating the Battletech Beta more so than the Supernova, and because I suck at MWO anyway, so I know I'll die a LOT running these mechs, especially during the event that's coming with it no doubt lol, everybody be gunning for it.

[Dee Eight]

I suspect they're busy with having to change the patch files to not implement the new skill tree this month. Plus coming up with changes for the PTS to test next week. Most of the quirks were leaked in the PTS quirk pdf a week ago.

Edited by Dee Eight, 19 February 2017 - 01:03 AM.

[Akala Tanara]

Yeah that makes sense. Bummer about the skill tree not coming Tuesday, though I'd rather it take longer, and get done right than dropped too early.

[Vxheous]

Dee Eight, on 18 February 2017 - 11:27 PM, said:

Should compare it to the Mad2C, Warhawk, and HGN2C. Also to anyone who would say the lack of engine cap limits how many heatsinks you can stuff into the engine space for a high heat energy loadout... its no more limited than a warhawk.

In many ways, a super nova will be a better warhawk other than in terms of speed and pod swapping. Warhawk has FF but not Endo, has 5 tons less mass to play with, while using a 1.5 ton heavier engine that holds no more heatsinks, and also having an 8.5 ton structure to carry around. Just using Endo steel on the S.N's will give another 2 tons more to work with than the FF does for the warhawks.

Sure, but we already have a Marauder IIc that can do everything the Supernova does...and moves faster

[Dee Eight]

Vxheous Kerensky, on 19 February 2017 - 02:54 AM, said:

Sure, but we already have a Marauder IIc that can do everything the Supernova does...and moves faster

Except it cannot carry as much firepower/armor. Also the moves faster bit assumes every Mad2C owner keeps to a 340 rated engine or greater. Just as some down-rate kodiak engines to fit more stuff, I've seen folks down-rate Mad2C engines also. Another difference is that ALL supernova's can equip jump jets while only a couple of the Mad2C variants can do so.

[Nightshade24]

Dee Eight, on 19 February 2017 - 12:54 AM, said:

I suspect they're busy with having to change the patch files to not implement the new skill tree this month. Plus coming up with changes for the PTS to test next week. Most of the quirks were leaked in the PTS quirk pdf a week ago.

I know PGI doesn't work (or most of the PGI staff doesn't) work in Weekends...so that could be it?

[Zergling]

Dee Eight, on 18 February 2017 - 11:27 PM, said:

Should compare it to the Mad2C, Warhawk, and HGN2C. Also to anyone who would say the lack of engine cap limits how many heatsinks you can stuff into the engine space for a high heat energy loadout... its no more limited than a warhawk.

In many ways, a super nova will be a better warhawk other than in terms of speed and pod swapping. Warhawk has FF but not Endo, has 5 tons less mass to play with, while using a 1.5 ton heavier engine that holds no more heatsinks, and also having an 8.5 ton structure to carry around. Just using Endo steel on the S.N's will give another 2 tons more to work with than the FF does for the warhawks.

I suggest checking your facts before making posts like this.

Here is what the Supernova would look like running a 4x ER PPC build.
Versus a Warhawk running a 4x ER PPC build.

The Supernova is at maximum engine rating; it cannot fit anymore heat sinks in by using endo or ferro.

Sure the Supernova has 2 more heatsinks, but the Warhawk has -8% ER PPC heat generation quirks, which results in it running cooler (36.49% heat efficiency versus 35.71%).
On top of that, the Warhawk is faster and has +25% ER PPC velocity.

Even if the Warhawk's quirks do get nerfed as in the PTS change notes, going from -8% to -4% ER PPC heat generation (and 5% less ER PPC velocity), it will only be very slightly less heat efficient, at 34.97%, while still having the advantages of greater speed and +20% ER PPC velocity.


What about 4x Large Pulse Laser build?

Here's the Highlander IIC subbing as the Supernova again.
Versus Warhawk C.

In this case, the Warhawk has -13% heat generation quirks, which aren't being nerfed at all in the PTS.
This results in the Warhawk being at 59.02% heat efficiency, versus 54.62% for the Supernova.

So Warhawk is more heat efficient again, has a -5% pulse laser duration quirk, and is faster.


The only 'large energy' build the Supernova comes out ahead in heat efficiency is 6x ER Large Lasers.

Highlander subbing as Supernova
Warhawk C

In this case, the Warhawk only has a -5% heat generation quirk, which leaves it at 58.75% heat efficiency versus the Supernova at 61.16%.


As for non-energy builds? The SVN-A and Boiler might be better than a Warhawk, but will be inferior to the MAD-IIC-D and Scorch.
The best hope for energy builds on the Supernova is the torso hardpoints on the SVN-C; if they are high enough, it might be worth the disadvantages of not using a Warhawk, but I suspect the Marauder IIC would still be better.

Edited by Zergling, 19 February 2017 - 04:42 AM.

[Widowmaker1981]

Dee Eight, on 18 February 2017 - 11:27 PM, said:

In many ways, a super nova will be a better warhawk other than in terms of speed and pod swapping. Warhawk has FF but not Endo, has 5 tons less mass to play with, while using a 1.5 ton heavier engine that holds no more heatsinks, and also having an 8.5 ton structure to carry around. Just using Endo steel on the S.N's will give another 2 tons more to work with than the FF does for the warhawks.

The Supernova-C and to a lesser extent the Boiler will be OK to good because the ST energy mounts are decently placed, the cockpit is amazingly placed and the frontal hitbox profile looks decent (ish, bit wide and likely kinda easy to ST). The arm hardpoints however, on a mech that slow and non agile are HUGE problem on an energy boat. Cant peek due to huge and slow and having to expose the whole mech, cant stand there and dps like a Dire does because no ballistics. The arm based variants are all doomed to suck.

Im almost tempted to buy the pack for This (move the 2 arm ERPPCs to the RT, put a TC1 in the head using the extra slot from not having a hand on the left arm) - Slower warhawk with much better mounts and cockpit placement, and comparing them once a ST is lost, the SNV will be 10 kph faster and actually able to fire the two leftover PPCs without shutting down. Im not going to mainly because skill tree means i will be able to ignore the crap other variants, so ill buy just the C with C bills later.

[Akala Tanara]

Zergling, on 19 February 2017 - 04:33 AM, said:

I suggest checking your facts before making posts like this.

Here is what the Supernova would look like running a 4x ER PPC build.
Versus a Warhawk running a 4x ER PPC build.

The Supernova is at maximum engine rating; it cannot fit anymore heat sinks in by using endo or ferro.

Sure the Supernova has 2 more heatsinks, but the Warhawk has -8% ER PPC heat generation quirks, which results in it running cooler (36.49% heat efficiency versus 35.71%).
On top of that, the Warhawk is faster and has +25% ER PPC velocity.

Even if the Warhawk's quirks do get nerfed as in the PTS change notes, going from -8% to -4% ER PPC heat generation (and 5% less ER PPC velocity), it will only be very slightly less heat efficient, at 34.97%, while still having the advantages of greater speed and +20% ER PPC velocity.


What about 4x Large Pulse Laser build?

Here's the Highlander IIC subbing as the Supernova again.
Versus Warhawk C.

In this case, the Warhawk has -13% heat generation quirks, which aren't being nerfed at all in the PTS.
This results in the Warhawk being at 59.02% heat efficiency, versus 54.62% for the Supernova.

So Warhawk is more heat efficient again, has a -5% pulse laser duration quirk, and is faster.


The only 'large energy' build the Supernova comes out ahead in heat efficiency is 6x ER Large Lasers.

Highlander subbing as Supernova
Warhawk C

In this case, the Warhawk only has a -5% heat generation quirk, which leaves it at 58.75% heat efficiency versus the Supernova at 61.16%.


As for non-energy builds? The SVN-A and Boiler might be better than a Warhawk, but will be inferior to the MAD-IIC-D and Scorch.
The best hope for energy builds on the Supernova is the torso hardpoints on the SVN-C; if they are high enough, it might be worth the disadvantages of not using a Warhawk, but I suspect the Marauder IIC would still be better.

Keep in mind that the ER-PPC quirks are moot points likely, after the Skill Tree is introduced. It wont be for the release of Supernova, but afterward, the Supernova will be able to have the same velocity quirks as any other mech, unless PGI decides to buff some of the predominant ER-PPC build mechs to have slightly better velocity quirks by default (as currently), same goes for most of the weapon quirks. It does seem likely that it will be the case, they'll continue to slowly phase out all the weapon quirks on mechs and allow customization into them as we see fit, rather than it coming pre-determined. That said, I did not research anything real deep for this post, beyond what I'd seen on the forums and saw in M4J35T1C's youtube video on the skill tree.

[Akala Tanara]

Dee Eight, on 18 February 2017 - 11:27 PM, said:

Should compare it to the Mad2C, Warhawk, and HGN2C. Also to anyone who would say the lack of engine cap limits how many heatsinks you can stuff into the engine space for a high heat energy loadout... its no more limited than a warhawk.

In many ways, a super nova will be a better warhawk other than in terms of speed and pod swapping. Warhawk has FF but not Endo, has 5 tons less mass to play with, while using a 1.5 ton heavier engine that holds no more heatsinks, and also having an 8.5 ton structure to carry around. Just using Endo steel on the S.N's will give another 2 tons more to work with than the FF does for the warhawks.

I could be wrong on this, but the Supernova is not an Omni-mech, so there shouldn't be any pod swapping right? Initally when I thought of the Supernova in MWO, as I do for all clan mechs, I think "Ooh, Omni-mech, I can swap this, that that this oo 16 energy hardpoints!? Hooot!" but then I remembered, it was not created by the clans, it was back before the clans were formed and the Supernova's left with Kerensky, only later did Omni-mechs come into play. Which made me sad, but I tend to always think Clan = Omni-mechs by default, though it is not true for all of them T_T lol.

((Made a Derp, and read the quoted message of Dee Eight, edited the quote to be focused on their post since that was what I was aiming it at >.<; ))

Edited by Akala Tanara, 19 February 2017 - 05:27 AM.

[Zergling]

Akala Tanara, on 19 February 2017 - 05:18 AM, said:

Keep in mind that the ER-PPC quirks are moot points likely, after the Skill Tree is introduced. It wont be for the release of Supernova, but afterward, the Supernova will be able to have the same velocity quirks as any other mech, unless PGI decides to buff some of the predominant ER-PPC build mechs to have slightly better velocity quirks by default (as currently), same goes for most of the weapon quirks. It does seem likely that it will be the case, they'll continue to slowly phase out all the weapon quirks on mechs and allow customization into them as we see fit, rather than it coming pre-determined. That said, I did not research anything real deep for this post, beyond what I'd seen on the forums and saw in M4J35T1C's youtube video on the skill tree.

Good luck to PGI at phasing out weapon quirks without buffs to other areas, 'cause if they remove them without compensating buffs, balance will be even worse than it already is.

As it is, the only change on the PTS that effect those builds are those I already mentioned: ER PPC Heat Gen on the Prime gets halved from 8% to 4%, and ER PPC velocity dropped from 25% to 20%.

[Akala Tanara]

Zergling, on 19 February 2017 - 05:27 AM, said:

Good luck to PGI at phasing out weapon quirks without buffs to other areas, 'cause if they remove them without compensating buffs, balance will be even worse than it already is.

As it is, the only change on the PTS that effect those builds are those I already mentioned: ER PPC Heat Gen on the Prime gets halved from 8% to 4%, and ER PPC velocity dropped from 25% to 20%.

They're phasing them out of being on the mechs by default, and rolling them into the skill tree. They will still be there, you just need to spec into them yourself, that's what I was getting out of the Skill Tree, anyway. They're not "gone" just "moved" so you don't have to feel forced to play your So-and-So mech as a ER-PPC build, simply because there's a ER-PPC weapon quirk on there for heat and velocity, good for customization, not so much for making mechs stand out in certain builds that should make the most sense for them however.

Mind you this is all what I've heard and read. I've not been on the PTR to see any of it personally.

Edited by Akala Tanara, 19 February 2017 - 05:38 AM.

[Zergling]

Akala Tanara, on 19 February 2017 - 05:37 AM, said:

They're phasing them out of being on the mechs by default, and rolling them into the skill tree. They will still be there, you just need to spec into them yourself, that's what I was getting out of the Skill Tree, anyway. They're not "gone" just "moved" so you don't have to feel forced to play your So-and-So mech as a ER-PPC build, simply because there's a ER-PPC weapon quirk on there for heat and velocity, good for customization, not so much for making mechs stand out in certain builds that should make the most sense for them however.

Mind you this is all what I've heard and read. I've not been on the PTR to see any of it personally.

If players have to spend some of their limited amount of skill points on them, then they are effectively gone, as mechs that don't need quirks to be competitive will have more points to use.

If PGI want to get rid of weapon quirks, then they'll have to give out compensating mobility and armor/structure quirks to those mechs that lose weapon quirks.

Edited by Zergling, 19 February 2017 - 05:45 AM.

[Akala Tanara]

Zergling, on 19 February 2017 - 05:44 AM, said:

If players have to spend some of their limited amount of skill points on them, then they are effectively gone, as mechs that don't need quirks to be competitive will have more points to use.

If PGI want to get rid of weapon quirks, then they'll have to give out compensating mobility and armor/structure quirks to those mechs that lose weapon quirks.

By the looks of it, all mechs get 91 "points" for mastery. The video I watched, unless something changes before it's released and since that video, you can easily spec into full AC and most, if not full laser, nearly full into defense, mobility with a good deal to spread around as needed. So it shouldn't be a problem to spec into certain weapons unless you're carrying 3-4 weapon types at once, like... AC5s, medium lasers, ER-PPCs and LRM5 as a random example. Would be a waste to put points into the LRM5, it's just a single LRM5, assumption would be that the AC5s and ER-PPCs are the main armorment, so spec into those, some of the spec for ER-PPCs will carry over into medium lasers, if not all.

[Xoxim SC]

Can we talk about the one major glaring issue with this mech? The lack of paint on the weapon mounts for the special variant as depicted on the concept art. That part irks the hell out of me to no end. Ya'll need to fix this PGI!

Edited by Todd Lightbringer, 19 February 2017 - 06:18 AM.