49 replies to this topic

[cazidin]

Widowmaker1981, on 19 February 2017 - 09:32 AM, said:

Refunding one of each module would be a pathetic gesture which would still lose me 95% of my investment...

The only way is a full refund like they are doing, along with decreasing the skill cost somewhat to help those who didnt buy all those modules. It will mean a few more people will end up uber rich, but since there isnt a trade economy in this game thats not the end of the world.

95% of your investment? How many duplicate modules did you buy? Realistically, how many can expect to see a return on their virtual investment of several hundred million to a few billion C-bills? They'll just have barely enough to re-invest in a new skill tree, which is a brand new cost. The average player or new players? They won't have that luxury, that wealth. They'll be stuck either picking a select few mechs, or in the case of new players, wondering why it costs so much and maybe deciding that it simply isn't worth it!

No. I'm sorry but, I'd much rather upset a few people than upset everyone, which is basically what's happened with the new C-bill cost. I don't see anyone in support of it. There are a few who defend it, but even they would probably agree that the cost needs to be significantly reduced if not outright removed.

This WILL hurt the game, both short and long term, if the costs are kept anywhere near as they are! Again. PGI has a choice. Keep the current refund idea AND the C-bill cost for the skill tree, and those who have invested as heavily as perhaps you have will STILL not be able to re-elite your stable of mechs OR remove the cost and reduce or remove the refund.

PGI could keep the refund as it is, and you'd have that many c-bills for... consumables? new mechs? But at this point, players like that probably have everything they'd want, and the money to buy anything new - should they choose to expand their stable even further.

[Rogue Jedi]

Battlemaster56, on 19 February 2017 - 10:36 AM, said:

On pts I did believe I level up my Scorch with MC, as I didn't have enough legacy xp to completely lvl the mech.

are you sure you do not mean GXP?

Edited by Rogue Jedi, 19 February 2017 - 10:46 AM.

[Battlemaster56]

Rogue Jedi, on 19 February 2017 - 10:37 AM, said:

are you sure you do not mean XP?

Ah pretty sure their was two options.

[Rogue Jedi]

Battlemaster56, on 19 February 2017 - 10:46 AM, said:

Ah pretty sure their was two options.

yes, the 2 options I saw were XP or GXP

edit
you could spend MC or Cbills to get your xp for skills refunded if you wanted to respec, is that what you were thinking of?

Edited by Rogue Jedi, 19 February 2017 - 11:12 AM.

[Widowmaker1981]

cazidin, on 19 February 2017 - 10:37 AM, said:

95% of your investment? How many duplicate modules did you buy?

A lot. I have never swapped weapon modules at all ever, and i have about 70 ish mechs with Seismic and Radar deprivation now. I like being able to pick whatever mech i fancy playing for whatever role i might want in FP or QP without having to go to the mechlab. I whaled for a while so a lot of my mech purchases were mechs from packs, and as such i spent most of the money i earned ingame on modules and engines (i also have at least one of every different IS XL engine, and most of the Clan XLs, along with many multiples of common ones like XL325)

[Deathlike]

Prosperity Park, on 19 February 2017 - 09:28 AM, said:

PGI is removing the C-Bill cost of modules and replacing with a C-Bill cost for nodes.

Who ever thought there was no C-Bill cost for Mastery? Did you get a free module when you unlocked the additional Mech slot?

You're totally forgetting that some people actually buy duplicate variants of mechs for legitimate reasons (different builds for comp and/or FP) and that they would have to reskill the mechs AGAIN (in that XP currently is shared among duplicate mechs and that the future system requires duplicate mechs to have skilled up separately).

You know... things aren't as simplified as some would like to make it.

Edited by Deathlike, 19 February 2017 - 12:11 PM.

[Mister Blastman]

Oh, the new skill tree c-bill system is encouraging alright, it's encouraging me to not play!

[PhoenixFire55]

Conspiracy is something that is kept hidden from the public. This goes more along the lines of scam and highway robbery.

[Clanner Scum]

Where did they say they were going to port MWO to the MW5 game engine?

[FireStoat]

Clanner Scum, on 20 February 2017 - 01:11 AM, said:

Where did they say they were going to port MWO to the MW5 game engine?

Nowhere. It's speculation.

[cazidin]

PhoenixFire55, on 20 February 2017 - 01:05 AM, said:

Conspiracy is something that is kept hidden from the public. This goes more along the lines of scam and highway robbery.

Conspiracy just sounds better.

FireStoat, on 20 February 2017 - 01:13 AM, said:

Nowhere. It's speculation.

Actually, Russ said it during one of his drunken rambles at a Town Hall. I'd go and find which one, but honestly, I can't be bothered.

[Almond Brown]

kuma8877, on 19 February 2017 - 09:03 AM, said:

And here is the core of the problem. As much as it sucks for the mod swapper, the only fair solution, is to do what they are doing with the planned refund. Mod swapping seems a system to help mitigate early player expenses, but not intended as the endgame ideal. Why should I, as a swapper, be granted a sweeping bonus across my entire stable of mechs because I only bought 1 of each module, vs the player who bought multiples or even full sets for each of their chassis'? So, on a level, mod swappers kind of have to deal with the fact that PGI, while giving the option to swap, doesn't see the mod swapper as actually having "mastered" their mech chassis completely (while swapping) and thus isn't catering to those players going into the new system. We are getting back exactly what we paid into the current system.

Indeed. PGI has taken the unlocked, swap capable aspect of Modules and locked them to the chassis. The power level of the Module on any chassis is now entirely up the Player. All the player has to do is pay to maximize.

Sadly, PGI did not include SALT as a payment method, otherwise very many around here would get 2.5 million modules for FREE... LOL!

[Llymrel]

As mentioned above, Russ said in a townhall that MWO would port to MW5 after MW5 was complete. They have talked for years about upgrading MWO to a new engine, and obviously it hasn't happened.

As speculation, a PVE game sells a small number of copies and stops generating money unless you can convince people to buy into some DLC. Its a pretty limited model unless your selling a top end major franchise. Sell subscription or pay to play model and you can make a lot more. There is no way a PVE title would have as long a run as MWO. There are people who are well past $10k spend in Clash of Clans and other similar titles. Thats a little more than $50 for a title and another $30 season pass. I'd suspect MWO has made PGI far more cash than MW5 ever will. MW5 though can revitalize MWO with a re-release, full title model like black ops, new engine, and possible new player base. It will cash infuse the company, and likely help them fund their next title. Steam can help bring in the new MWO players with MW5. PGI as a company needs titles other than MWO/MW5 to survive. Russ isn't an old guy ready to retire.

The hard part is PGI continually makes bonehead decisions related to game mechanics. Its impossible to make every player happy, and complaints is just part of an online business. It's the fact PGI basically never sticks to any plan, rebuilds most of their code, doesn't launch most of their work, and has to re-do nearly every thing that actually makes it into game. I give them creds for making a compelling title with a good franchise. There has to be some smart people in the company. There is some incompetent person hiding in their midst that keeps pointing their updates in the last couple years into a bad place. PGI could do much better with MWO having one solid decision making producer being sure the updates improve the game, and are fair to the players.

[cazidin]

Alright, PGI's reduced the C-Bill cost on skills by about 40% and made re-spec free! This is a step in the right direction and all of us in this thread are responsible for getting this change but 40% just isn't enough! We need to make it a ONE HUNDRED PERCENT REDUCTION IN C-BILL COST!

Do NOT be fooled by PGI's effort here! They know that we're on to them, and only we can stop this. Your voice matters, your wallet matters. They're listening to us, ForumWarriors. Only we can get PGI to eliminate the cost entirely or we won't be able to buy mechs anymore.

We simply won't have enough C-bills for it, and that's their plan here, and we can't let them do that. We're part of the movement here. Not just against PGI but also ComStar. You won't hear this through the Hyperpulse Generators, which they completely control, they control the flow of information to us but they're going to completely eliminate C-Bills and introduce a new Serf class among the Inner Sphere if we don't stop them here.

[Battlemaster56]

cazidin, on 20 February 2017 - 08:39 PM, said:

Alright, PGI's reduced the C-Bill cost on skills by about 40% and made re-spec free! This is a step in the right direction and all of us in this thread are responsible for getting this change but 40% just isn't enough! We need to make it a ONE HUNDRED PERCENT REDUCTION IN C-BILL COST!

Do NOT be fooled by PGI's effort here! They know that we're on to them, and only we can stop this. Your voice matters, your wallet matters. They're listening to us, ForumWarriors. Only we ujcan get PGI to eliminate the cost entirely or we won't be able to buy mechs anymore.

We simply won't have enough C-bills for it, and that's their plan here, and we can't let them do that. We're part of the movement here. Not just against PGI but also ComStar. You won't hear this through the Hyperpulse Generators, which they completely control, they control the flow of information to us but they're going to completely eliminate C-Bills and introduce a new Serf class among the Inner Sphere if we don't stop them here.

Yes Yes!!! 100% removal of cbill cost!!! The word has spoken!!!


Edit: Praising gif one I'm out of work.

Edited by Battlemaster56, 21 February 2017 - 12:31 AM.

[mailin]

Sorry, but I think removing the C-bill cost is a bad idea. As mentioned, there is still a C-bill cost under the current system. PGI is simply transferring that to the new system. From a business point of view this move makes sense. It may entice people to spend real money to get premium time who have not previously done so. Remember that this is a free to play game. Honestly if you're complaining that strenuously about having to spend more time to earn the c-bills to level up your mechs . . . I had a couple of very sarcastic comments but decided to not write them for fear of offending the spoiled brats.

[Battlemaster56]

mailin, on 21 February 2017 - 01:11 AM, said:

Sorry, but I think removing the C-bill cost is a bad idea. As mentioned, there is still a C-bill cost under the current system. PGI is simply transferring that to the new system. From a business point of view this move makes sense. It may entice people to spend real money to get premium time who have not previously done so. Remember that this is a free to play game. Honestly if you're complaining that strenuously about having to spend more time to earn the c-bills to level up your mechs . . . I had a couple of very sarcastic comments but decided to not write them for fear of offending the spoiled brats.

Most people on this forum have much thicker skin than you arggountly believe, and this is a valid concern for players and possibly new ones who go out their to fully grind out XP and some worth of chills just to upgrade mechs that take a huge chunk of time to do, then spend another what 4mil or whatever 40% of 9.1m. Theirs other ways to entice players go buy premium, or MC.

[Llymrel]

Like it or not, the original implementation of modules allowed swapping. It was purposeful so that you can configure and change a mech. Locking people into a paid skill tree by mech makes it unaffordable for most players to tinker. Why build for years infrastructure that encourages re-configuration, and then build up a higher pay wall. We already have to buy the xl engines, weapons, HS, upgrades, etc that often add many million to the mech to get it operational.

The other false part of the module argument is that its okay to charge 4M now per mech. It used to be I could swap all I liked to change my load out. I own a several of each module, but not enough to equip every mech the exact way I have it loaded out every day. Module prices are higher than some light and medium mechs. They were never cheap, and it was intentional as they allowed swapping. PGI can come in and decide to take away configurability through the skill tree. It just doesn't seem like a smart idea.

I think all of the complaining would go away if people still had the xp and stats on mechs they have today, and PGI simply added more levels and options on to the stat tree. No one can complain that they can now do more with their mech, its just about getting locked out from what they already have earned in game.

I suspect we're going to see even more insane meta configs from the skill tree as currently designed. There are no real trade-offs for boat mechs. People who play meta with just a few stable mechs will love this update. They get a lot more power with little expense. People who have 200+ mechs playing stock, and enjoying the diversity...they are all complaining. Wonder which group funds more of the game?

[cazidin]

mailin, on 21 February 2017 - 01:11 AM, said:

Sorry, but I think removing the C-bill cost is a bad idea. As mentioned, there is still a C-bill cost under the current system. PGI is simply transferring that to the new system. From a business point of view this move makes sense. It may entice people to spend real money to get premium time who have not previously done so. Remember that this is a free to play game. Honestly if you're complaining that strenuously about having to spend more time to earn the c-bills to level up your mechs . . . I had a couple of very sarcastic comments but decided to not write them for fear of offending the spoiled brats.

This isn't enticement. This is a system designed from the ground-up by PGI and the Comstar Elite to take more C-Bills from hard working mercenaries, making them poorer and more easily controlled. We have to take a stand here and NOT buy any mech packs until this is resolved. It's a tax on new and old players and it hurts everyone equally.

I don't fear sarcastic comments, I often write them.

[Battlemaster56]

cazidin, on 21 February 2017 - 08:14 AM, said:

This isn't enticement. This is a system designed from the ground-up by PGI and the Comstar Elite to take more C-Bills from hard working mercenaries, making them poorer and more easily controlled. We have to take a stand here and NOT buy any mech packs until this is resolved. It's a tax on new and old players and it hurts everyone equally.

I don't fear sarcastic comments, I often write them.

Oh yea your gift for today Cazadin.