7 replies to this topic

[ToXikyogHurt]

TL;DR: I've been testing the 'Jump Capabilities' skill tree. Some of it is totally non-functional, but I don't mind because the bit I really want (more duration/height) works well enough and there are lots of other places I feel I have to spend points.

There are four different talents in the jump tree. I will address each in turn.



Heat Shielding (Good - on hotter 'mechs)

I pushed my heat past 60%, waited till it hit 50% then fired a full jumpjet burn and noted how cooling was affected.
I found that my test Nova (with 5/5 Vent Calibration, 5/5 Heat Containment, 0/5 Cool Run) would cool down about 11% with 1 point in Heat Shielding (the minimum I could have to unlock Vent Calibration). It cooled down about 15% when all 5 points were spent on Heat Shielding. Spending 5 points for Cool Run instead allowed me to cool by 13%. Taking both Cool Run and Heat Shielding yielded 17% cooldown.

Heat Shielding increases the amount you can cool off during a jump by ~40%, Cool Run only increases the amount you can cool by ~20%. Being able to stack these is nice.

This skill does what it says, it significantly reduces the heat that jumping produces. I'm likely to take this on my PPC poptarts.



Vent Calibration (Good - on jumpy 'mechs)

I jumped straight up and down and used F9 & screenshots to compare maximum height achieved. I also tested how easy it was to jump onto the wall in HPG.
On Mining Collective you start on perfectly flat ground with a height coordinate of 303.8
Jumping with 0/5 Vent Calibration took my Nova to ~364. Jumping with 5/5 took it to ~383.
That's absolute height gained of ~60 and ~80 units.
With a 4JJ Victor I went from ~30 units to ~40 vertical jump height.
A Viper goes from ~130 to ~170 units vertical.
5/5 Allows my Vindicator to get onto the walls of HPG more easily where previously it needed to find a hill to start on.
5/5 Is enough to get a Summoner on the HPG wall from some places.
5/5 does not give a Victor enough additional height to do much. Slightly easier to do some jumps on Mining Collective.
The Viper is a helicopter in disguise regardless.

Jumpjets are not linear - you accelerate vertically all the time you can fire them. 15% increased duration increased the height I could jump by ~30%. Alternatively I could reach the same height as before but retain some jets to slow my fall. (btw Shock Absorbance works as advertised)
'Mechs that have good jump distances are improved noticably. 'Mechs that jump poorly (Assaults) don't see enough improvement to reach new places. Being able to slow a fall for longer may be useful but Shock Absorbance already provides large gains here.

This skill allows you to increase the jump ability of a 'mech which already has the maximum (or capped) number of jets fitted. When I want to use jumpjets I often want as many as possible and this effectively lets me spend skill points instead of (or on top of) tonnage. If you only have 1 jet for slowing your fall or jump-turns you don't need this. I will probably take this on most 'mechs with a jump distance in the 30-90 range to get onto taller things more reliably.



Vectoring (Bad - actively disruptive)

I spawned my Nova on Mining Collective. I targeted the Cataphract ahead & right. I walked directly backwards to >530m distance from target. I ran forwards and jumped @ 500m from target and measured final distance to target on landing. This does not find the true absolute length of the jump, but it gives a good idea how much additional distance you gain from skill points.
0/5 Vent Calibration, 0/5 Vectoring: 363m from target when landed.
5/5 Vent Calibration, 0/5 Vectoring: 341m
0/5 Vent Calibration, 5/5 Vectoring: 363m
5/5 Vent Calibration, 5/5 Vectoring: 341m

Vent Calibration increases horizontal jump distance by ~ 15%. Vectoring does not increase horizontal jump distance.

Vectoring applies a fair amount of forwards drift (~40 units) if you start from standing. If you start from a run it does nothing. When standing still and jumping you (generally) are trying to achieve vertical height only - to pop above a hill briefly and fall back to where you started. Vectoring interferes with this by shifting your landing point forwards. It also doesn't add horizontal distance when you might actually want it, during a running jump.

This skill does exactly the opposite of what I'd like it to. It doesn't add jump distance and it reduces the control you have over where you land during short jumps. I will not use this skill.



Lift Speed (Bad - no effect)

I measured maximum jump distance (horizontally and vertically) with both 0/5 and 5/5 Lift Speed. I found no measurable difference on either. I measured the height gained over the first 1/4 fuel used. No difference (~10 units regardless in my Nova).

Jumpjets provide no appreciable instantaneous launch thrust. They need to be fired for several seconds to give you height. Increasing their initial thrust has no real effect.

I will not use this skill.



Conclusion

On a 'Mech with jumpjets I can spend 6 or 10 points productively in the jumpjet tree, thankfully it feels like a choice that I can actively make and not a mandatory requirement to simply use jumpjets. I can't spend more than 10 points usefully, but there are so many other skills (Survival - Shock Absorbance, Agility - Speed Tweak, Sensors - Radar Deprivation) that I feel are mandatory that I'm glad I don't want to spend 20 points exclusively on jumpjets.

[Bud Crue]

ToXikyogHurt, on 07 March 2017 - 05:06 AM, said:

Lift Speed (Bad - no effect)

I measured maximum jump distance (horizontally and vertically) with both 0/5 and 5/5 Lift Speed. I found no measurable difference on either. I measured the height gained over the first 1/4 fuel used. No difference (~10 units regardless in my Nova).

Jumpjets provide no appreciable instantaneous launch thrust. They need to be fired for several seconds to give you height. Increasing their initial thrust has no real effect.

Tested JJ last night as well. Was using a Quickdraw so heavier. I REALLY noticed the lift speed when maxed vs absent. But the requisite Vectoring to get the maximum effect ruins it. I may use this branch on a maxed out JJ 4G but other than that I don't think it will be worth it. To me the branch felt like an all, half or nothing. When just dabbled in on either side of the branch (heat/calibration OR vectoring/lift speed) I didn't notice much performance benefits. In the Quickies no matter how many jets equipped I failed to notice ANY benefit unless the respective side or the whole tree was maxed out. So the choice came down to 0 nodes spent ~10 nodes (one side), or the full 20 (whole tree). Given the "value" of the nodes for most mechs I think I'll skip it entirely.

[Ruar]

I considered putting some points into JJ, but ended up passing on them. I like having some extra mobility but using JJ isn't crucial to my build so spending points on the JJ tree doesn't make sense for me. I would invest in the JJ tree if the mobility was as useful as other skills then it would be one thing, but the JJ design itself is so limiting that having a bit more lift isn't worth the price.

If we could actually jump to the side instead of just forward things would be different. If I could spend skill points and have one JJ give me the lift power of two it would make sense. However, if all I'm getting is a small boost to an already mediocre performance then why bother.

[Cy Mitchell]

Thanks for doing this test, compiling the data and sharing it. I have thrown a couple points into JJ to help control heat on my Nova and it does help there so I will continue to do so. The rest of the skills do not interest me.

[Sunstruck]

People that don't invest simply don't have the right mechs, mechs like the Phoenix Hawk and Highlander get a big help with the JJ tree.

[Andi Nagasia]

still dont think Lift Speed Helps enough,
personally i think Lift speed should be changed to Lift Height,
giving a +3m Jump height could help mechs so much more,

a Light wont benefit much from 2.5ish JJ of Height,
but for larger mechs it would help immensely, as it should,
an assault investing 20 points in JJ should gain a Noticeable bonus,

[SpiralFace]

I've been mostly using it on clan heavies exclusively for the JJ heat nodes.

Mechs like the Viper, and even the Arctic Cheetah tend to need to pump jets to survive, but having a high # of jets hard locked can build up heat quick.

I tend to find those the most helpful so I only really invest in the minimum amount needed to maximize the Heat shielding.

[Taxxian]

Thanks for testing thats great data!