4 replies to this topic

[Insanity09]

I'm not talking about a friendly push. That's a whole different subject, and certainly merits some attention. I've seen that topic covered in several threads. I recommend folks read them, and of course the best is https://mwomercs.com...ics-101-comics/

I'm talking about when the fact that the enemy is pushing is made public (or even when it is pointed out where a significant concentration of the enemy is), what should your team do?

Now, from recent experiences, I'm clearly in the minority here, so I'd love to be corrected.

Enemy is pushing along a particular line, or around a specific obstacle/object (e.g. along the H line, coming over the top in HPG, etc.)

In my thinking, since no enemy team ever is in perfect lockstep, they won't all appear at the same time, so....

Option A:
My first thought, practically an instinct, is if a significant part of your team is more or less in position, organize, get ready to call targets, arrange yourselves (firing line) so that you will be able to see the enemy as they appear from behind cover, and shoot the enemies that show first (calling them out as you do).

That seems like a good idea to me, because often the enemy will be appearing somewhat gradually, allowing everyone time to respond, and frequently showing up in very predictable spots, helping your team focus fire. Focusing fire will likely either kill the enemies as they show, &/or cause them to back off, ruining the enemy team's momentum, thus spoiling their push.
Usually very little maneuvering would be required for this, making it quick, and, to me, a no-brainer.

Option B:
If only a small number of your team is on station (or you are seriously out-tonned, numbered, or gunned), you bug out, preferably doing so in good cover, trying to link up with the bulk of your team so you can go back to option A.

What I am seeing instead of Option A (or B ) :
(The following often happen even when folks on comms (sometimes me) are telling people to get ready, defend, form a firing line, etc.)

Charge! Individuals on the team charge into the bulk of the enemy in a disorganized (and unannounced) fashion, dying quickly and painlessly (for them). Particularly prevalent on Polar.

Hide! Some folks pull back deeper into cover so they can't see the enemies as they slowly appear, but only when multiple enemies are in view. That lets the enemy focus fire, which would seem to be the opposite of what you want, yes?

Scatter! The most common option I'm seeing at present, is where a large group of my team, say 6-8 of us, suddenly and completely disperse to all directions of the compass, making no effort to engage the enemy moving in. Again, this is happening in a totally disorganized way, no communication that I hear. The most baffling part is how that large piece of the team, previously moving together, suddenly becomes a random selection of people all acting individually.
I could almost understand this if it were a form of Option B, but even if mildly outnumbered, a coordinated defense can usually stop a push (and depending on the terrain....), but the scattering part? Confusing.


Please help me out here, what am I failing to understand/do?

I'm tired of being abandoned by my team when WE were in a previously solid, defensible position when I'm in something heavier, and tired of supporting no defense from the edges when I'm in something faster.

Edit: fixed the run-on and the inappropriate smiley.

Edited by Insanity09, 29 May 2017 - 09:49 PM.

[Rogue Jedi]

Unfortunately this is human nature, if people are under threat they tend to panick, and often do something stupid, this happens much less often in group queue but does still happen even there

It is the same thing as one Mech pinning down 10 Mechs because they are unwilling to take a single AC2 shell,
if someone calls a push because the enemy have 4 Mechs completely seporated from the rest of their team, the whole team pushes then 5 seconds later you notice that there is only 1 other Mech with you because the enemy lance has a single LRM boat or Mech with AC2s or AC5s, someone gets the "warning incoming missiles" or screen shake from an AC hit and stops, then everyone behind that id10t stops as well figuring if (s)he has stopped there must be a good reason leading to 2 of your pilots being shredded by the lance you were going to shread while the rest of the enemy team moves on your teams terrible position then they have your team in a pincer and your team looses all 12 Mechs with ^{(sometimes much)} less than 3 kills.

To stop this sort of thing you need to trust the team and they need to trust you, unfortunately unless you know the players (or in group 1 from each alied group) you will not uave that trust so they will not follow the plan after the fighting starts because they are scared about loosing their Mech.

[Insanity09]

I thank you, Rogue Jedi, for your response.

Sadly, I've been seeing this even in group queue of late (though less of the total scatter thing there), but that is perhaps a decent start.

I'm baffled and frustrated.

Maybe I should just start talking in a soothing tone when an enemy push is mentioned, to cut down on the panic?
I might need to be careful with that, however, I've noticed in RL I can put people to sleep under some circumstances.

[Leone]

So, an addendum to the firing line strategy. Some fine tuning, if you will.

Whilst shooting the first couple a mechs is a great plan, and a good easy focus firing oppourtunity that often needs not be called, I find shooting the third mech is the way to foil a push. In my experience, most folk who lead a push are ready and willing to walk into a field of fire for their team. Often, same with the second. Their leading the push, they expect what's coming.

Now, it's not always the case, but far too often, I find the third or further back mech'll be the one whose pilot'll balk at a bit of incoming fire. As Rogue Jedi mentioned, folk panic. And panic can stall a push easy.

As for charging, sometimes if your outta position when the push comes, there's no hope of getting behind cover if you're getting focused. Charging the enemy gives one a chance to get some damage in as well as having the potential to disrupt a push. Also, it buys one's team some time to get a firing line up.

I admit, most the time in Quickplay, my charges don't amount to much as the team'll often evaporate. But hey, that's why I play CW. Quickplay's mostly training and exercise environment for me.

~Leone

[TripleEhBeef]

Rogue Jedi, on 29 May 2017 - 01:47 PM, said:

To stop this sort of thing you need to trust the team and they need to trust you, unfortunately unless you know the players (or in group 1 from each alied group) you will not uave that trust so they will not follow the plan after the fighting starts because they are scared about loosing their Mech.

I think part of this is that some players think of armour as "health" when they should be thinking of it as more of a "resource". You're never going to finish a game with zero damage taken. Every time you get into a firefight, you are going to "spend" armour/structure HP. Obviously you don't want to throw all your points away in the early game pokes, but in push/counterpush situations, you need to go all in. Of course, skills like torso twisting come into play to manage damage.

Even if you're out of ammo or had your weapons shot off, you can still make use of your remaining armour/structure. Say you're a brawler Griffin and you ran out of SRMs and lost your laser arm. Don't run off and power down. Put yourself in front of a baddie bearing down on a teammate and make him eat through that left side to kill you. You're making him damage you instead of a friendly who can still shoot back. That's still something you can put into the fight.