19 replies to this topic

[Pixel Hunter]

the title says it all, If IS mechs pop easy with XL engines, why not just give them bonuses to frontal armor on the side torsos? I was tempted to say also back armor, but that feels a bit OP

[Carl Vickers]

Why not just redo the armor values so ST's arent as gimped instead.

Game needs less quirks, not more. Another idea would be to normalize the XL's so IS XL doesnt die on a ST loss.

[Vxheous]

Most IS mechs have side torso structure quirks to help account at least a little bit for the XL

Edited by Vxheous Kerensky, 04 April 2017 - 06:38 PM.

[Kaeb Odellas]

It would take a substantial bonus to make an XL-equipped IS mech equal to the same mech with a Clan XL.

I still prefer my Titanfall-esque doom state for IS mechs that lose a side torso with an XL engine. It would make for more differentiation between IS and Clan playstyles.

[Pixel Hunter]

Kaeb Odellas, on 04 April 2017 - 06:43 PM, said:

It would take a substantial bonus to make an XL-equipped IS mech equal to the same mech with a Clan XL.

I still prefer my Titanfall-esque doom state for IS mechs that lose a side torso with an XL engine. It would make for more differentiation between IS and Clan playstyles.

well side torso armor quirks AND a doom state would about do that

[justcallme A S H]

Vxheous Kerensky, on 04 April 2017 - 06:38 PM, said:

Most IS mechs have side torso structure quirks to help account at least a little bit for the XL

Those BLR2C ST Structure quirks the OP has clear unawares...

[Alexander of Macedon]

This is already a thing. A lot of IS 'mechs that rely on XL engines have armor/structure quirks. It still doesn't help. Even if the STs have an extra 30p of armor people will still just pop them, especially given the way a lot of typical XL-runners have honking big ones.

I'm kinda-sorta okay with it in IS lights (and I say that as a light jockey), but when you can kill a heavy or assault by popping one ST that's pretty ****** no matter how generous the quirking is.

[Pixel Hunter]

Alexander of Macedon, on 04 April 2017 - 07:01 PM, said:

This is already a thing. A lot of IS 'mechs that rely on XL engines have armor/structure quirks. It still doesn't help. Even if the STs have an extra 30p of armor people will still just pop them, especially given the way a lot of typical XL-runners have honking big ones.

I'm kinda-sorta okay with it in IS lights (and I say that as a light jockey), but when you can kill a heavy or assault by popping one ST that's pretty ****** no matter how generous the quirking is.

I totally agree, that happend to me just today, had a hot assault with a damaged center torso, just came out of shut down after me hammering him, all he did was alpha one of my side torsos...engine destroyed

[dario03]

There have been multiple mechs that had enough structure and other quirks to make up for the ISXL. The Blackknight, Warhammer, and Grasshopper were all very highly rated when they had their big quirks. Having the extra health and mobility to spread the damage made it so you could live a long time IF you spread the damage. If you didn't spread the damage then yeah you died quick but hey if you don't spread the damage and get CT cored or double legged you die in CXL mechs too. But a lot of IS mechs had extra health on all of those parts too.

[MauttyKoray]

Gimpy117, on 04 April 2017 - 06:34 PM, said:

the title says it all, If IS mechs pop easy with XL engines, why not just give them bonuses to frontal armor on the side torsos? I was tempted to say also back armor, but that feels a bit OP

As a Clan pilot that love to take his IS mechs (KELL HOUNDS FOR LIFE!) out in quick play, I believe the IS XL should be changed from death on one torso death, to simply a LARGE handicap (like Clan XL but far worse) when losing a side torso.

[El Bandito]

Vxheous Kerensky, on 04 April 2017 - 06:38 PM, said:

Most IS mechs have side torso structure quirks to help account at least a little bit for the XL

Wish my non-2C Battlemasters had some structures. Actually, I wish Battlemasters were not reliant of quirks in the first place.

MauttyKoray, on 04 April 2017 - 08:31 PM, said:

As a Clan pilot that love to take his IS mechs (KELL HOUNDS FOR LIFE!) out in quick play, I believe the IS XL should be changed from death on one torso death, to simply a LARGE handicap (like Clan XL but far worse) when losing a side torso.

Why though? IS XL already is bulkier than Clan XL. Shouldn't more slot saving Clan XL have more penalty in torsi loss than that of IS XL, in exchange for the removal of many durability quirks? Logically, I mean.

Edited by El Bandito, 04 April 2017 - 08:37 PM.

[Dee Eight]

Ultimately the only solution is to jump the timeline to post-dark age mid 32nd century period, allow free tech mixing, and just price the best stuff out the highest. Clan XL engine in an Atlas ? No problem...costs more though than the IS XL engine. Or throw out anything to do with original rules from CBT that stands in the way, like the engine crit/side torso loss one.

[Carl Vickers]

Due to IS using more side torso slots they should get a smaller penalty for losing a side torso, clans at 40%, IS get 25-30%. All things in balance.

[Jackal Noble]

MauttyKoray, on 04 April 2017 - 08:31 PM, said:

As a Clan pilot that love to take his IS mechs (KELL HOUNDS FOR LIFE!) out in quick play, I believe the IS XL should be changed from death on one torso death, to simply a LARGE handicap (like Clan XL but far worse) when losing a side torso.

Why stop there... why don't we just make it so that anytime a side torso is popped a clutch of Elementals jumps out.

[Kaeb Odellas]

MauttyKoray, on 04 April 2017 - 08:31 PM, said:

As a Clan pilot that love to take his IS mechs (KELL HOUNDS FOR LIFE!) out in quick play, I believe the IS XL should be changed from death on one torso death, to simply a LARGE handicap (like Clan XL but far worse) when losing a side torso.

Or still kill it, but more slowly. Like give the pilot 30 seconds to do as much damage as he can before the mech shuts down for good.

[Pixel Hunter]

Kaeb Odellas, on 04 April 2017 - 09:30 PM, said:

Or still kill it, but more slowly. Like give the pilot 30 seconds to do as much damage as he can before the mech shuts down for good.

maybe 30 seconds where you get LARGE bonuses to DPS and heat does not matter

[Ghogiel]

Gimpy117, on 06 April 2017 - 02:54 PM, said:

maybe 30 seconds where you get LARGE bonuses to DPS and heat does not matter

lol How much is large?
In 30secs even with regular dps and no heat cap a decent player would be putting half the enemy team down.

[Tarl Cabot]

dario03, on 04 April 2017 - 07:07 PM, said:

There have been multiple mechs that had enough structure and other quirks to make up for the ISXL. The Blackknight, Warhammer, and Grasshopper were all very highly rated when they had their big quirks. Having the extra health and mobility to spread the damage made it so you could live a long time IF you spread the damage. If you didn't spread the damage then yeah you died quick but hey if you don't spread the damage and get CT cored or double legged you die in CXL mechs too. But a lot of IS mechs had extra health on all of those parts too.

Just wanted to highlight that part. Quirks have come and gone, changed each time the dart lands a specific spot for that week/month... But the quirks were there more for the geometry layout as most IS mechs are broad humanoid when compared to first few Clan rounds.

And for the OP, PGI is not completely faithful to the TT rules. The current setup is ST gone, check ISXL= Death vs CXL= movement/heat penalty. Actual engine crits have no effect on mech performance nor durability. And each time PGI makes a change to how CXL are affected, they note it is a stand-in until they can get truly functioning engine crit system introduced but still leaving the ISXL to bear the maximum negative effect of only part of the rules.

[Revis Volek]

Ghogiel, on 06 April 2017 - 03:02 PM, said:

lol How much is large?
In 30secs even with regular dps and no heat cap a decent player would be putting half the enemy team down.

2 or 3 lights could win matches no problem before fatties even made it there lol.

[Pixel Hunter]

Ghogiel, on 06 April 2017 - 03:02 PM, said:

lol How much is large?
In 30secs even with regular dps and no heat cap a decent player would be putting half the enemy team down.

not sure, i'm not an expert on tweaking balance