6 replies to this topic

[Skrapha]

Could PGI turn an upgraded version of the existing mech/pilot/weapon module system into a skill system?

Instead of having a tangled web of skills and having to go through nodes that you don't need or want, you could simply unlock skills "modules" and then upgrade them over time, much like the current module system. Perhaps some modules will have to be unlocked for others to be accessed, and all in all it could be far sleeker and easier to navigate than the currently proposed tree system. I understand what they are trying to do with the tree layout, but from my experience and others, it doesn't work very well.

I don't mind any of the changes they seem to be going for, only the implementation. I love the idea of adding this level of customization to the mech lab, since the lab is one of the most addictive and fun parts of the game to me.

Perhaps:
Take the existing module system --> add structure/armor and mobility sections --> add a nice, easy to navigate multi-module screen to place all these into, with set numbers of module slots in each category = a better skill tree?

Seems like this would work better, and be easier to transition into.....in my humble opinion.
I know we all have our own ideas of how the skill tree could work better, so id love to hear about any ideas the community has,(or how my idea might be complete nonsense

[Scyther]

I take it you mean something like simply having one node for 'Cool Run', then buying Cool Run 1, Cool Run 2, Cool Run 3, etc by clicking on that node and selecting Upgrade.

In that case you can eliminate the 'tree', eliminate having to select unwanted/unrelated nodes, and make a much more compact Skill UI.

Pah. It's crazy talk.

But I like it.

(Back in a minute, I have a skill tree to go boil down)

Edited by MadBadger, 28 April 2017 - 01:05 PM.

[C E Dwyer]

No P.G.I are wanting lots of hexagons.

It's ironic that the developers of S.W.T.O.R have come to the conclusion that choice for players is a pointless thing because they soon discover there is only one correct way to skill a PvP or PvE build, and so streamlined their games progression system.

This benefits less experienced players, because less options means they make less errors, while not effecting experienced players who get out the spread sheets to make a build.

P.G.I go the other way, making a big confusing system that will confuse the hell out of new players

Edited by Cathy, 28 April 2017 - 01:12 PM.

[Scyther]

I tend to agree with what Cathy is saying. Although the Skill Tree 2 will be minmaxed, it at least has enough options for some variety.

Anyways, back to Skrapha's idea. If you trim each sub-tree down to it's unique nodes, you get:

Firepower: 12 nodes vs 73
Survival: 5 nodes vs 35
Operations: 5 nodes vs 25
Mobility: 8 nodes vs 40
JumpJets: 4 nodes vs 20
Sensors : 7 nodes vs 27
Auxiliary: 11 nodes vs 22
---------------------------------
Total Reduction: 242 nodes requiring 7 separate screens become 52 nodes.

Mobility and JJ can be merged, 12 nodes 1 screen.
Survival and Operations can merge, 10 nodes 1 screen.
Sensor and Auxiliary can merge, 18 nodes 1 screen.
Firepower stays 1 screen, 12 nodes.

242 nodes become 52. 7 Screens/windows become 4.

Now they will want a compact representation per node, and they will still want some tiering/unlock limits.

So, each node becomes a meter:

Cool Run [][][]^[][]
Heat Containment [][][]^[][]
==============
Quick Ignition [][][]^[][]

Each [] is a current node unlock, each ^ is a 'points spent total' you need to pass in that category before you can unlock more, the ========== line is a tier you unlock when you spend enough points above it.

Basically similar to skill trees that have been used in other games. Pretty much functionally identical to Skill Tree 2, except that it is way more compact, visually more easily processed, and allows similar function without needing to go through specific 'do not want' skills in order to unlock skill X. Also probably more flexible than the current tree.

(Edit: Snazzier graphical representation would of course be something like an upward sloping curved power meter, but we leave that sort of thing up to the graphics boffins)

Edited by MadBadger, 28 April 2017 - 01:40 PM.

[NextGame]

Cathy, on 28 April 2017 - 01:10 PM, said:

No P.G.I are wanting lots of hexagons.

It's ironic that the developers of S.W.T.O.R have come to the conclusion that choice for players is a pointless thing because they soon discover there is only one correct way to skill a PvP or PvE build, and so streamlined their games progression system.

This benefits less experienced players, because less options means they make less errors, while not effecting experienced players who get out the spread sheets to make a build.

P.G.I go the other way, making a big confusing system that will confuse the hell out of new players

SWTOR became boring as hell though with an MMO just getting funnelled down into a single player storyline.

Complexity is a good thing, but it cant be something whereby conclusions are reached by selecting the order of progress via raffle.

[Skrapha]

MadBadger, I like how you trimmed that down and gave the figures, it seems so much sleeker than the forest of trees we currently have in skill tree 3.0. Taking the current skill system (basic/master/elite) and combining it with our modules system (with level up upgrading) and allowing players to apply these to any mech regardless of the amount of chassis owned (doing away with rule of three nonsense) would work well.

Once you unlock the upgrade you can then keep increasing it, though that would take away from the total amount of upgrades allowed. This would put a cap on maxing out all sections, and forcing a give and take between efficiencies. Allowing the player to experiment would be important, so if a user decides to go another direction with their modules/upgrades they should get a full refund, into that specific mechs XP bank.

[Accused]

Skrapha, on 28 April 2017 - 12:37 PM, said:

Could PGI turn an upgraded version of the existing mech/pilot/weapon module system into a skill system?

You're talking about an alternative called a "tech tree".

What PGI is proposing is actually...intentional. Forget their reasons about why (they're ******* lying), their intent is to reduce ttk and do a global nerf to mechs by forcing points being spent on nodes you may not need or want. So nothing as basic as a tech tree for us.