32 replies to this topic

[A Really Old Clan Dude]

Viktor Drake, on 23 May 2017 - 11:25 AM, said:

Warning or no warning, there shouldn't be a cost to repec into a node you already purchased. I mean you already have to grind out tons of C-bills and XP to unlock maybe 150+ nodes in order to be able to experiment with your skill builds. Adding a fairly huge XP requirement on top of that just to re-use a node you already purchased is insult to injury.

Honestly this is one of the few issues I have with the new Skill Tree system. The other is that we should be able to go to the testing grounds and test out various builds BEFORE we commit the points. I have at least 2-3 sacrificial mechs that I threw a test build on to see what effect a specific build had on them that now have between 30-50 wasted points on them that I will now have to regrind due to this missing feature.

I posted this way back with the first test system for the skill tree when I did this exact same problem experimenting with different builds.
I dont mind the skill tree itself but the lack of trial and testing you can do and the lack of consistency in the game with changing your mech in the mechlab does not make sense.
eg I dont get punished for changing my equipment or weapons on a mech (other than the first purchase) but I get punished for changing my skill set.

Welcome to the painful (stupid) side of the skill tree.

[Daecollo]

Athom83, on 23 May 2017 - 02:31 PM, said:

World of Tanks. World of Warcraft. There are others but they aren't MMOs or RPGs.


Lol, the cost isn't steep. I've even been respecing my mechs occasionally just to try something else. It isn't that bad. It seems bad as you aren't getting SP back to get different nodes for free. However, not only is the node reactivation cost marginal when you actually respec responsibly, but if you take the time to learn the mech you really shouldn't need to respec that much at all.


No, its the users fault for;
1) Not reading the patch notes that explained everything to him.
2) Ignoring the warning on the button that says "respec".
3) Hitting save after they removed all of their nodes, even after the popup window asks for confirmation.
4) Failing to understand what he actually did.

1.) WoW=Pretty much Free Respec. Infact it IS free now; World of Tanks I think is $ respec. However it doesn't take away your skills.

2.) Patch Notes should not be something you have to read to understand a game. Stuff that happens in the game should be explained IN the game. What if I was a new player? Your a real piece of work arn'tcha?

3.) There is NO WARNING. You obviously don't pay attention do you?

4.) What is to understand? It TRICKS you completely. It doesn't explain what it does. GOD it is like you can't read!

A confirmation is not a warning. You literally get asked if you want to switch if you simply move a piece of equipment out. Same "confirmation" as you get with a respec.

THAT IS NOT A WARNING.

Here is an example of what should pop up upon asking to save after respec:

"Warning: Any node you have not activated you had before will have a 400 xp or gxp cost. Are you sure you want to continue?"
"YES" "NO"

Not:

"Are you sure you want to continue?"
"YES" "NO"

Edited by Daecollo, 23 May 2017 - 05:17 PM.

[ingramli]

I would say, the bottom line is, there should be a simulator allow testing the build before proceed to checkout, if a respec fee is necessary at all (and imo there shouldnt be)

[A Really Old Clan Dude]

PS all:

Wait for when PGI changes 1 node or placement of the nodes on the skill tree and it forces you to re-skill all of your mechs as they are invalid builds then.

i can see it now:
Dear players, after reviewing the live skill tree we have noticed that node XXX is to powerful, we have moved or changed the stats of node XXX. we have removed everyone skill for this node which you can apply elsewhere.

(you get to keep all the skills up to that node that are no longer useful or)
(respec away at your cost)

[Athom83]

Daecollo, on 23 May 2017 - 05:11 PM, said:

World of Tanks I think is $ respec. However it doesn't take away your skills.

It costs premium currency. And you do indeed lose the skill.

Daecollo, on 23 May 2017 - 05:11 PM, said:

2.) Patch Notes should not be something you have to read to understand a game. Stuff that happens in the game should be explained IN the game. What if I was a new player? Your a real piece of work arn'tcha?

A returning player to a game that updates every month should look at the patch notes. Anything else and they are just being stupid. And a new player learns, or else he wouldn't be considered new would he?

Daecollo, on 23 May 2017 - 05:11 PM, said:

3.) There is NO WARNING. You obviously don't pay attention do you?

Actually, there were warnings. All in the dev posts, patch notes, announcements, tooltips, etc. Just because you didn't pay attention to them doesn't mean there weren't there?

Daecollo, on 23 May 2017 - 05:11 PM, said:

4.) What is to understand? It TRICKS you completely. It doesn't explain what it does. GOD it is like you can't read!

I understand perfectly. The fact you still think it "tricks" you shows you have yet to understand.

Daecollo, on 23 May 2017 - 05:11 PM, said:

A confirmation is not a warning. You literally get asked if you want to switch if you simply move a piece of equipment out. Same "confirmation" as you get with a respec.
THAT IS NOT A WARNING.

Are you sure you want to jump off the cliff: Y/N?
Are you sure you want to play Russian Roulette with a loaded gun: Y/N?
Are you sure you want to walk into the den of monsters: Y/N?
Are you sure you want to slap a police officer with a loaded weapon: Y/N?
Are you sure you want to keep rage posting: Y/N?

[damonvile]

I wonder what people get out of having this respec cost. Does it really add value to the game or is it just a blind white knight thing ?

I can't really see how being able to change my build after each match how I want to is a negative thing....or how adding a punishing penalty and more grind just to try something else really adds anything of value. Once you've mastered a mech erasing a bunch of xp or having a big debt doesn't make me want to play it longer.

Generally once I've mastered a mech I like to move on to a new one and only play that one for fun. Being able to change builds on it = more fun. Having to gind a bunch of xp so I can try something different....not fun.

Games that are not fun, tend to get played less.

[Citronvand]

Athom83, on 23 May 2017 - 05:22 PM, said:

It costs premium currency. And you do indeed lose the skill.

That's not correct, unless they have changed it since I last played it:

You can reset all of a crewman's learned Skills and Perks. This allows you to change your crew member's Skills or Perks without having to start all over with a new recruit. There are three options available:

• If done for free, it results in the loss of 20% of the crewman's total Skill/Perk experience points.
  
• If done for credits*, it results in the loss of 10% of the crewman's total Skill/Perk experience points.
  
• For 200 Gold**, it results in no loss of experience.

*In-game currency similar to CB in MWO.
**Premium currency similar to MC in MWO.

[sycocys]

Make "apply changes" final, and respec cost $ currency to get your points back like most f2p games!!!

How about we go that route instead of having what amounts to nothing more than small timesink to respec? Because I bet you Russ would be totally behind that.

[Pjwned]

Daecollo, on 23 May 2017 - 01:46 PM, said:

Wait what?

What game does respec different? Name one.

Also, I didn't say they didn't. The cost just isn't so steep and dumb.

So the user is supposed to predict the future and be a mind reader? I didn't know! I guess I will bring my money elsewhere! Since its the 'users' fault he didn't know the future!

The cost isn't even steep, it takes 1 decent match to get way more c-bills than you need to unlock a single node for the first time, and if you don't get 800 XP in 1 match it should only take 1 additional match to get the rest of that 800 XP.

It's not perfect but it is reasonable.

[mike29tw]

Some of you make me laugh.

Of all the places you want realism and immersion, you choose respec cost. Not passive/active radar, heat scales, true DHS, or ramming. Respec cost, a menu operation that doesn't involve gameplay.

Let that sink in.

Edited by mike29tw, 23 May 2017 - 09:14 PM.

[Athom83]

mike29tw, on 23 May 2017 - 09:14 PM, said:

Of all the places you want realism and immersion, you choose respec cost. Not passive/active radar, heat scales, true DHS, or ramming. Respec cost, a menu operation that doesn't involve gameplay.

I've been quite vocal about them adding heat scales, fixing DHS, and changing electronic warfare systems. And ramming is already in the game, it just does little. They'll probably do something with the ramming when/if they ever gt around to adding melee.

[El Bandito]

Respeccing costs measly sum and this is a F2P game. I'd suggest everyone to buy good Clan mechs only, as they are less reliant on quirks, which means less need for respeccing.

[James The Fox Dixon]

Athom83, on 24 May 2017 - 04:28 AM, said:

I've been quite vocal about them adding heat scales, fixing DHS, and changing electronic warfare systems. And ramming is already in the game, it just does little. They'll probably do something with the ramming when/if they ever gt around to adding melee.

Ramming was in the game back in CB. They removed it because of all the light pilots whining about taking a lot of damage to their legs by their fellow team mates and being knocked down by bigger mechs. It will never come back though it should.