16 replies to this topic

[The6thMessenger]

So here's an idea, what if as opposed of hardpoints only, Omnipods instead offer fixed equipment instead. Yes, currently Jump Jets are fixed in the omnipod for some, like KFX-S or TBR-S.

But what if something else than just Jump-Jets? Deliberately just for unique fixed equipment, at the cost of understandably bad hard-points that would under-gun the mech?

Example:

Spoiler

Quote

TBR-J

The Timber-Wolf J is a non-standard variant used during the Civil War. Uncommon in the battlefield, it is notoriously slippery with a pair of Jump Jets on the left torso, and a MASC-IV on the right torso. It sports a hodgepodge of weaponry, capable of participating at most ranges but it's not particularly heavy in firepower. An ATM-6 on the right arm with two tons of reload allowed this mech to have considerable punch, while a NARC Beacon with one-ton of ammunition helped it identify and mark targets, with common tactics of jumping over cover to mark a target and then retreating back into cover. A single UAC5 on the Left Torso allowed it to pepper enemies, while a pair of ER Medium-Lasers of the Left-Arm complemented it. For backup, it has a pair of ER Small-Lasers, one in each side torso, and then a Streak SRM-4 on the Center-Torso with one ton of reload.

How i came up with this is that, i wanted it to be both restrictive and gives a bit more options.

Obviously the CT and the LA with missiles is a big deal. Now 7 LRM5s possible, it can be disturbing. But that's how it could be unique.

However the RT is filled by a massive MASC IV, 4 tons 4 slots, it really eats up some weight and slots. It also only have 1 energy hardpoint. The addition of the Fixed MASC and the little amount of hardpoint is my way of balancing this omnipod -- energy allows it to still have one big weapon with little ammo required, yet it has locked 4 slots and 4 tons of MASC. I also deliberately steered away from a missile hardpoint to make it so that it needs the TBR-J Arms to have a full house of 4 missiles. And to make use the CT for SRMs would mean that it's not Artemised.

The LT is for the sake of Symmetry with the TBR-S RT with 1E and 1B mix, however i really wanted it to not be able to mount a Gauss rifle, so i kept the two Jump Jets just for that reason. It can still house an LB10X or UAC10 + some 1-slot energy weapon though.

Would it be good or bad for the game?

Edited by The6thMessenger, 27 October 2017 - 03:11 AM.

[RestosIII]

Eeeeeh. I wouldn't be a fan. Locked equipment should exist solely for lore reasons, and should b rolled back a bit anyways. (Looking at you, Myth Lynx cAP.) So I don't find the prospect of new pods that add equipment to mechs as a good plan. Especially your example of giving a damn Timber Wolf MASC.

[The6thMessenger]

RestosIII, on 08 June 2017 - 01:06 AM, said:

Especially your example of giving a damn Timber Wolf MASC.

Overkill on the mobility perhaps? Though the Engine Desync really hit TBR hard on the mobility that considerable investment on the Mobility Tree is a must.

RestosIII, on 08 June 2017 - 01:06 AM, said:

I wouldn't be a fan. Locked equipment should exist solely for lore reasons, and should b rolled back a bit anyways.

MASC is in the "lore" on the TBR, on the made-up non-canon anyways.

Edited by The6thMessenger, 08 June 2017 - 01:10 AM.

[Battlemaster56]

The6thMessenger, on 08 June 2017 - 12:57 AM, said:

So here's an idea, what if as opposed of hardpoints only, Omnipods instead offer fixed equipment instead. Yes, currently Jump Jets are fixed in the omnipod for some, like KFX-S or TBR-S.

But what if something else than just Jump-Jets? Deliberately just for unique fixed equipment, at the cost of understandably bad hard-points that would under-gun the mech?

Example:

Spoiler

How i came up with this is that, i wanted it to be both restrictive and gives a bit more options. Obviously the CT and the LA with missiles is a big deal. Now 7 LRM5s possible, it can be disturbing. But that's how it could be unique.

However the RT is filled by a massive MASC IV, 4 tons 4 slots, it really eats up some weight and slots. It also only have 1 energy hardpoint. The addition of the Fixed MASC and the little amount of hardpoint is my way of balancing this omnipod -- energy allows it to still have one big weapon with little ammo required, yet it has locked 4 slots and 4 tons of MASC.

The LT is for the sake of Symmetry with the TBR-S RT with 1E and 1B mix, however i really wanted it to not be able to mount a Gauss rifle, so i kept the two Jump Jets just for that reason. It can still house an LB10X or UAC10 + some 1-slot energy weapon though.

Would it be good or bad for the game?

I have to agree we my man Restosll locked equipment should only be there for lore reasons and only be rolled back if nesscary. Also adding new locked equipment other than what was already in it is against omnimech rules in turn the only possible way for the Timber to have masc is to turn it into a battlemech, some lorelord may know more than me about such rules, Sarna don't have much info of such rules that I can find.

[RestosIII]

The6thMessenger, on 08 June 2017 - 01:08 AM, said:

Overkill on the mobility perhaps? Though the Engine Desync really hit TBR hard on the mobility that considerable investment on the Mobility Tree is a must.



MASC is in the "lore" on the TBR, on the made-up non-canon anyways.

'shrugs' Call me a stick in the mud, but I just personally don't care for the idea. And that's only slightly because it would almost definitely weaken my lore builds by comparison.

[G4LV4TR0N]

Take a look at Executioner it already has locked JJ's and MASC and plenty of people complaining that they want extra pod space instead.

[The6thMessenger]

Battlemaster56, on 08 June 2017 - 01:14 AM, said:

I have to agree we my man Restosll locked equipment should only be there for lore reasons and only be rolled back if nesscary. Also adding new locked equipment other than what was already in it is against omnimech rules in turn the only possible way for the Timber to have masc is to turn it into a battlemech, some lorelord may know more than me about such rules, Sarna don't have much info of such rules that I can find.

What about Jump Jets? Those are fixed equipment. Is there really a different rule about MASC or just Jump Jets?

RestosIII, on 08 June 2017 - 01:17 AM, said:

'shrugs' Call me a stick in the mud, but I just personally don't care for the idea. And that's only slightly because it would almost definitely weaken my lore builds by comparison.

I honestly don't know about weakened lore-builds.

I calculated it's firepower, and it's dreadfully under gunned. Of course that's within my expected firepower, of 49. (* assuming an ATM-6 is worth 12 firepower).

But I don't know your point of view so I can't really tell.

G4LV4TR0N, on 08 June 2017 - 01:22 AM, said:

Take a look at Executioner it already has locked JJ's and MASC and plenty of people complaining that they want extra pod space instead.

Yeah, but you can't switch on or off with the MASC, it's locked there at any omnipods you're using. What i am talking about is an equipment fixed to the omnipod, not to the mech as a whole. That is changing omnipods will either unlock or lock the MASC on the specific component.

Edited by The6thMessenger, 08 June 2017 - 01:25 AM.

[Cy Mitchell]

They could have avoided the min/max-OP omni-mech thing completely if they would have locked all equipment and weapons in the omni-pods. You could still have min/maxed to some extent but imagine if all the weapons had been locked to the pods so when you moved that LRM arm on the Summoner (for example) you would have still had to use LRMs. It would have made it a lot harder to break the game in the Mech lab and Clan omni-Mechs would have been a lot less likely to have been considered OP.

MWLL originally planned to have a MechLab in the game and that is how the developers planned for it to work. Pods could have been bought or moved but the weapons and equipment would have went with them.

[The6thMessenger]

Rampage, on 08 June 2017 - 01:25 AM, said:

They could have avoided the min/max-OP omni-mech thing completely if they would have locked all equipment and weapons in the omni-pods. You could still have min/maxed to some extent but imagine if all the weapons had been locked to the pods so when you moved that LRM arm on the Summoner (for example) you would have still had to use LRMs. It would have made it a lot harder to break the game in the Mech lab and Clan omni-Mechs would have been a lot less likely to have been considered OP.

MWLL originally planned to have a MechLab in the game and that is how the developers planned for it to work. Pods could have been bought or moved but the weapons and equipment would have went with them.

Hmm, kind of like TBR-S RT. With the abundance of it's hardpoints, yet the locked 2-tons and 2 slots worth of Jump-Jets (in addition of nega-quirks) limits it's usefulness.

[G4LV4TR0N]

Technically MASC is fixed to Executioners omnipod and I was wondering if they going to release a hero variant that has no MASC/JJ's but it seem PGI went other route.

[The6thMessenger]

G4LV4TR0N, on 08 June 2017 - 02:33 AM, said:

Technically MASC is fixed to Executioners omnipod and I was wondering if they going to release a hero variant that has no MASC/JJ's but it seem PGI went other route.

I actually liked the MASC on the EXE.

Anyways that's the idea in itself - except the reverse. An omnipod with MASC, but the other variant omnipod doesn't.

[G4LV4TR0N]

On my EXE I got nearly full mobility and half of JJ tree, just for fun. And on some maps like Canyon Network it's really much of fun and pretty effective. But in general terms 90% of time you would rather have 12 extra tons of weapons.

[LordNothing]

i wouldnt mind there being more omnipod variety. even omnipods that dont go with a set but grant specific abilities.

[Andi Nagasia]

i support this, and would love a DWF with MASC(perhaps it could then get out of its own way)

[Andi Nagasia]

Also just noticed you have MASC4, the TBR would have C-MASC3(3Tons 3 Crits)

[Willard Phule]

Well, you see......even then, it would still be being done wrong.

Omni pods are supposed to be designed as "pod space." That specific space, slotwise, is based on the specific variant. Easiest way to demonstrate that is to find an online mech creator for TT. They're everywhere.

Thing is, that "podspace" isn't supposed to be just for weapons. That's how an individual can add jump jets, heat sinks, MASC, ECM, etc to a "standard variant." It's still subject to weight and space limitations, but it has always been the best way to add additional cooling or additional ammo.

And...it's supposed to be what makes an "Omnimech" vastly superior to a "Battlemech."

[Jackal Noble]

No god no, egad no nope big heaping side of nope sauce. Stop trying so hard.