22 replies to this topic

[Angel of Annihilation]

This isn't an all inclusive list, just the weapons I personally would consider using.

Clans:

Heavy Large Laser - Still missing something and just not quite there. Honestly I can't place my finger on what they need but to me they feel a little too hot or have a little too long a burn duration or a little too long of a cooldown or some combo of part or all that. I know that is vague but they just don't feel comfortable or good enough to contend against the ER LL or LPL in their current state. If I had to say just one thing, I would say heat is the biggest issue, especially since you tend to have to remove DHS to make room for the extra bulk of the Laser. As they are now, they will only be used on very niche builds.

Heavy Medium Laser - Same kind of issue. They just don't feel quite good enough to make using them an option instead of ER MLs. Too much heat is my gut feeling with the same issue that the HLL has in regards to requiring you remove DHS to make room for these weapons.

ATMs - Pretty close to good. I will still like to see the minimum range reduced to 90m and I do have some concerns about their effectiveness in the face of all the AMS we see in game now. Also they need their ammo count increased because as is they run out of ammo way too fast.

IS:

Rotary ACs - They feel close but not quite there. Aside from the heat bug that won't let you use a pair of Rotary ACs together, there are two challenges with using the RACs. 1) The Spin up time doesn't allow you to quickly engage targets and 2) the face time you have to give in order to actually do decent levels of damage with them.

UACs - I almost feel they are too powerful with the lower shot count but until I see them in action in a 12 vs 12 I am reserving judgement.

Heavy PPC - Hate to say it but even at the current damage levels, I still can't justify the extra weight and heat compared to using a standard ER PPC. Maybe if they were cooler or did the full 15 damage without splash but I don't foresee these making it on any of my mechs.

Light PPC - Great weapon. My only issue is that they have the 90m minimum range. It would be nice if that went away or if not away, we saw the damage scale down at below minimum range rather than go away all together.

Snub Nose PPC - A-Ok. Its in a good place and works fine. No changes needed.

ER ML - Seems pretty good but a bit too hot but maybe I am just spoiled by how cool standard MLs run considering they do the same damage.

ER SL - Seems in a good place. No Issues.

Light Gauss - Love'em, perfect. No changes here.

Heavy Gauss - Honestly have a really bad feeling these are going to be OP at least on mechs that can mount pairs, not so much mounted or used singly. Hate to say it but they should make it so you can only charge one Heavy Gauss at a time or else we are going to have the equivalent of dual AC/20 Jagers running around again, only this time it will be dual Heavy Gauss Maulers and I can guarantee the forums are going to be lit up with complains.

MRMs - Again feels a little off. I think the issue is have the same issue as the LBX cannons, they don't do any sort of concentrated damage. I mean the MRM10 weighs as much as a SRM6 but does 2 less damage and has 4 times the spread (or so it feels) at 270m let alone at its 400m max range. Also lets face it, having that extra 130m is nice but its very hard to hit a moving target at those ranges with relatively slow missiles so its not really all that effective at those extended ranges. Also at point blank range, you can get those SRMs to concentrate into just one section of the enemy mech, while the MRMs will still splatter everywhere even at those ranges. Those factors combined make it really hard to justify taking a MRM over an SRM so it seems MRMs need something more to set them apart. Maybe even faster missiles or a tighter spread.

Anyway, those are my thoughts for now. Eagerly awaiting Revision 3 on the PTS to see where they take things next.

[Khobai]

Heavy Lasers - some of them still need cooldown and heat reductions. The beam durations seem fine now.

ATMs - needs min range removed. lower the damage if you have to but FFS remove the min range. reduce max range to 810m. increase health per missile to 1.5 and increase ammo per ton to 90.

MRMs - needs lower volley delay. they stream out too slowly and have issues hitting moving targets. velocity probably also needs to be increased more. And possibly increase the max range to 540m.

RACs- double the length of time they can fire before the jam bar reaches the end. but make them automatically jam 100% of the time when the bar reaches the end. That way they do decent burst damage and also reward people for managing the jam bar and making sure it doesnt jam

Heavy PPC- damage is fine but the heat needs to be lowered to 12.5-13.

Light PPC- increase ghost heat limit to 4 (should be able to fire 4 without additional heat)

Light Gauss- increase the damage to 10 and slightly increase the cooldown to compensate for the additional damage. It just doesnt hit hard enough to justify the tonnage.

Heavy Gauss- make it so you can only charge one heavy gauss at a time. that way heavy gauss can be significantly buffed without having to worry about dual heavy gauss being overpowered. Increase the optimum range to 270m, decrease the max range to 720m, reduce the chargeup time, reduce the cooldown, get rid of the reticle shake. If knockdowns get readded, heavy gauss should have a chance of knocking mechs down when it hits them.

ERML/ERML- fix the fact they have longer max range than their clan counterparts. Lower the max range below their clan counterparts and possibly reduce the heat.

Edited by Khobai, 03 July 2017 - 08:05 PM.

[LordNothing]

i think i can make the medium heavies work on my light mechs. its like a 40 point alpha for only 4 tons. hll is still obsoleted by the lpl. i think its niche needs to be damage/tick while firing. heavies in general can fill the alpha strike hole left by the nerfing of the other lasers, and its more restrictive heat keeps heavy laser alphas from becoming op.

atms and mrms become the denizens of qp and especially at the lower tiers. ironically the rocket launchers will probibly be carried by is units in fp. if they can get everyone to stick a couple rl20s on their mechs for gen rushes. its destined to be reserved as a troll weapon in qp.

ppcs will all have their place, especially the lppc. the hppc will probibly be the go to single ppc option. the snub is actually the least useful ppc imho. its too hot for what is essentially a smaller short range ppc. heat needs to come down to at least 9 for it to start being worth carrying. a brawly ppc needs to be cool enough to brawl with.

gauss is going to be great. lgauss in particular will help the gauss rifle uptake as more mechs can start carrying them than the regular gauss. hgauss is going to be an assault favorite now for single gauss builds. dual builds will be rare, but they will still be an issue.

uac i kind of agree with you, too powerful. but their higher cost over the clan counterparts cancels it out i think. spheroids just do guns better. the 10 feels right now that it got its heat knocked down a point, but the 20 hardly jams at all. im not sure if this is intentional or just another glitch.

ers and m, they are what they are. they will have their place whenever someone wants a medium laser boat with slightly more range. i really didnt play with them exclusively but i did use them as backups. i should try a hunch 4p or other light/medium laser boats. same goes with micros, they have their niche i just havent found it yet. i guess its for filling out a laser points that would normally be left empty because of the heat. i need to go in and play with more energy weapons while the test server is still up.

racs, most anticipated and most disapointing. i dont really need to say any more. you will never see one in a compeditive drop deck, and those who bring them will be ridiculed and called potatoes. it sits there in the same space as lerms and lbx, sub-optimal weapons that serious players usually ignore.

[Vellron2005]

Heavy lasers:

1) Needs less burn time
2) Needs better heavy/deep sounding firing sound

Micro Laser:

1) Needs it's own color
2) Needs to be a laser version of the machine guns - fire until button pressed, heat the user like flamers maybe, or a little less


LAMS:

1) WAY less heat.. My Iron Dome Nova has 3 AMS and heat efficienty 1.21.. With a SINGLE LAMS equipped, heat efficiency goes down to 0.56?! Why would I ever use this? And no, the excess ammo tonnage cannot be converted into enough heat sinks to counteract this..

RACs:

1) Still too much heat. Needs more ammo per ton.

Stealth Armor:

1) Basically every troll build ever will now feature this, and it will make mechs like the pirates bane totally OP. I suggest it be removed from the game completely.

ATMs:

1) Needs more ammo per ton
2) Needs a tiny bit less heat
3) Needs minimum range removed or made into like clan LRM
4) Needs less damage on the big launcher.. ATM12 doing 36 damage is just absurd.. 4 ATM12 does 144 damage alpha up close.. No light can survive that, which makes SSRM's obsolete. No other weapon in the game can do that except perhapse the MRM.. suggest lowering the damage of all 30> damage weapons to 30. Otherwise, TTK will go down dramatically.
5) At max range, needs to do less damage than LRMs, otherwise, LRMs are obsolete. Suggest buffing LRM damage to 1,5, or ATM damage at max range to 0.7. per missile.

Rocket Launchers:

1) Same as with ATMs damage is excessive, expecting troll builds that one-shot atlases from the front, and introduce a whole new class of potato players. Suggesting removal from the game. They are useless unless heavily boated, when they turn OP.

LFE:

Seems great, very helpful to IS mechs.

MRMs:

1) Needs less spread
2) 1 MRM20 should be equal in weight to 2 MRM10. Right now, a MRM20 weighs 1 ton more, and makes the smaller launchers a superior choice outright.

[Kaptain]

OP beside heavy gauss I agree with you mostly.

I don't understand why anyone thinks the HGR is OP. Its currently 11 crits, 18 tons, high damage range is short, bad ammo per ton negates its range potential, slow charge, slow cooldown, only torso mounted AND it explodes. Ultras20s are far better and IMO even the ac20 is better.

[Angel of Annihilation]

Kaptain, on 04 July 2017 - 03:45 AM, said:

OP beside heavy gauss I agree with you mostly.

I don't understand why anyone thinks the HGR is OP. Its currently 11 crits, 18 tons, high damage range is short, bad ammo per ton negates its range potential, slow charge, slow cooldown, only torso mounted AND it explodes. Ultras20s are far better and IMO even the ac20 is better.

Its not OP when used as a single heavy Ballistic option, in fact unless heat is a major factor, I would say the AC/20 is superior because of it actually allows a LFE to be used, has more ammo per ton and no charge up time. However I am worried about Dual HGR setups which is why I am suggesting being able to charge up only one at a time. The thing is, even though they have a optimal range of only 180m with the proper skills you can extend this easily out to 226m plus the HGR will still be doing 15 damage or the same damage as as normal Gauss Rifle out to around 400m and 10 damage at about 500m. Point is that is still significant damage out to mid-range with these beasts of a weapon.

Let me talk about one of my Mauler Builds on test, the Dual HGR Mauler.

SP Build:
Max Survival
Max Mobility
Firepower Optimized for Range, Cooldown, Gauss Rifles and Ammo Capacity.

Damage required to destroy front CT = 194.
Damage required to destroy ST = 137

HRG optimal Range = 226m

Damage at 226m = 50 PPFLD w/Zero Heat
Damage at 400m = 30 PPFLD w/Zero Heat
Damage at 500m = 20 PPFLD w/Zero Heat

HGR cooldown = 5.9 seconds

Top Speed: 57.1 KPH.

So does anyone see the problem here? Sure it is a slow Assault but it can still manage dual Guass Rifle damage levels at 400m and can still be effect beyond that so it isn't completely limited to brawl range. In brawl range it is 50 PPFLD or enough to shatter the armor on just about any medium mech that shows its face and even an Assault mech is going to feel that hit. Compounding this is the fact, with a full survival tree it has a crapton of armor with which to soak damage.

So yeah, OP comes to mind very quickly or if not OP, at least powerful enough to create a whine heard by thousands.

Edited by Viktor Drake, 04 July 2017 - 10:50 AM.

[Oberost]

Viktor Drake, on 04 July 2017 - 10:47 AM, said:

Its not OP when used as a single heavy Ballistic option, in fact unless heat is a major factor, I would say the AC/20 is superior because of it actually allows a LFE to be used, has more ammo per ton and no charge up time. However I am worried about Dual HGR setups which is why I am suggesting being able to charge up only one at a time. The thing is, even though they have a optimal range of only 180m with the proper skills you can extend this easily out to 226m plus the HGR will still be doing 15 damage or the same damage as as normal Gauss Rifle out to around 400m and 10 damage at about 500m. Point is that is still significant damage out to mid-range with these beasts of a weapon.

Let me talk about one of my Mauler Builds on test, the Dual HGR Mauler.

SP Build:
Max Survival
Max Mobility
Firepower Optimized for Range, Cooldown, Gauss Rifles and Ammo Capacity.

Damage required to destroy front CT = 194.
Damage required to destroy ST = 137

HRG optimal Range = 226m

Damage at 226m = 50 PPFLD w/Zero Heat
Damage at 400m = 30 PPFLD w/Zero Heat
Damage at 500m = 20 PPFLD w/Zero Heat

HGR cooldown = 5.9 seconds

Top Speed: 57.1 KPH.

So does anyone see the problem here? Sure it is a slow Assault but it can still manage dual Guass Rifle damage levels at 400m and can still be effect beyond that so it isn't completely limited to brawl range. In brawl range it is 50 PPFLD or enough to shatter the armor on just about any medium mech that shows its face and even an Assault mech is going to feel that hit. Compounding this is the fact, with a full survival tree it has a crapton of armor with which to soak damage.

So yeah, OP comes to mind very quickly or if not OP, at least powerful enough to create a whine heard by thousands.

And?

SCORCH

50+10 damage at 660 meters, faster with good hitboxes. Now that the IS has the potential of 50 damage at 180 meters is that a problem?

Come on...

Edited by Oberost, 04 July 2017 - 11:54 AM.

[Angel of Annihilation]

Oberost, on 04 July 2017 - 11:54 AM, said:

And?

SCORCH

50+10 damage at 660 meters, faster with good hitboxes. Now that the IS has the potential of 50 damage at 180 meters is that a problem?

Come on...

One problem with that Scorch build though, It has ZERO armor. Not sure if you noticed that when you did your build.

Edit: You could technically still build it out with a 300 XL engine which would give it about the same speed as the Mauler however unlike the Mauler build you have quite a bit of heat build up with those ER PPCs. Also unlike the Mauler, your weapons are in your arms which are quite easy to knock off a Marauder. The Mauler actually strips his arms and adds them as armor to protect his STs where the HGR is mounted. Then you have to consider that the HGR's are mounted up much higher in the Mauler which makes it much better at hill humping. Also there is a bit more of a skill component to syncing up ER PPCs and Gauss Rifles but lets call that a minor difference. You do have a much higher optimal damage range though, there is that.

Also wanted to thank you for bringing the Scorch up because you have just proved my point. I think most people like to point out how powerful the Scorch Dual ER PPC, Dual Gauss build is and hold that up as a shinning example of why the Clans and the Marauder IIC are so OP yet the Mauler build I describe actually has quite a few advantages over it which would mean that it would be even more OP right? Overall it kind of proves my point so thanks.

Edited by Viktor Drake, 04 July 2017 - 12:36 PM.

[MadRover]

Oberost, on 04 July 2017 - 11:54 AM, said:

And?

SCORCH

50+10 damage at 660 meters, faster with good hitboxes. Now that the IS has the potential of 50 damage at 180 meters is that a problem?

Come on...

that scorch is build is so impractical no one uses it so you just made a baseless argument for no reason.

heres what i see to be a problem though. dual IS UAC20s with no ghost heat, throw in some range nodes and do 80 damage in 2 taps, 120 damage in 3 taps and maybe jam, kill a mech or leave them crippled to the point that mech might as well be dead on the 4th tap. all in 4 taps are made in about 6-10 seconds. that to me is a huge balance issue.

Edited by MadRover, 04 July 2017 - 01:21 PM.

[Angel of Annihilation]

MadRover, on 04 July 2017 - 01:18 PM, said:

that scorch is build is so impractical no one uses it so you just made a baseless argument for no reason.

heres what i see to be a problem though. dual IS UAC20s with no ghost heat, throw in some range nodes and do 80 damage in 2 taps, 120 damage in 3 taps and maybe jam, kill a mech or leave them crippled to the point that mech might as well be dead on the 4th tap. all in 4 taps are made in about 6-10 seconds. that to me is a huge balance issue.

Hmm. Didn't know that the IS UAC/20s didn't have ghost heat, in fact expected to have the same GH as AC/20s. Guess I will add that to the list as well. Add GH to UAC/20s.

[Oberost]

Viktor Drake, on 04 July 2017 - 12:25 PM, said:

One problem with that Scorch build though, It has ZERO armor. Not sure if you noticed that when you did your build.

SCORCH

You're completely right, I f****d up the build in Smurfy. This revised one still has better speed, better damage and better hitboxes, not to speak about its biggest advantage: range.

I don't see the advantages of the Mauler with double HGR over the Scorch with double Gauss+ERPPC. It has two better things, the shielding arm and the bit higher position of its guns, but these things are nothing to speak about compared to the advantages that the Scorch has over it.

Oh, and at 810 meters, (max range of the HGR) the Scorch delivers about 40+10 damage. Mauler OP?

Come on...

Edited by Oberost, 05 July 2017 - 08:11 AM.

[MadRover]

Oberost, on 05 July 2017 - 03:55 AM, said:

SCORCH

You're completely right, I f****d up the build in Smurfy. This revised one still has better speed, better damage and better hitboxes, not to speak about its biggest advantage: range.

I don't see the advantages of the Mauler with double HGR over the Scorch with double Gauss+ERPPC. It has two better things, the shielding arm and the bit higher position of its guns, but these things are nothing to speak about compared to the advantages that the Scorch has over it.

Oh, and at 810 meters, (max range of the HGR) the Scorch delivers about 40+10 damage. Mauler OP?

Come on...

Before I smash that build down let me start by saying splat damage is irrelevant. It does nothing but tickle the adjacent parts if at all.

Now here are the problems with that build. Armor on the arms are a joke on the Scorch and any range Scorch pilots need to be ashamed for even trying. The next is the heat gen vs cool down vs overall output, why would I want to even use this build over any other brawling build? The Scorch is meant for brawling not ranged combat. Also, considering that the Scorch is a priority target at all times means you are susceptible to being LRMed to death, rushed by every light in the game, and overall this build for the Scorch is more of a meme and not practical making this frowned upon especially when considering the expectations of every Assault pilot.

So there's your reasons why the Mauler shouldn't be even using gauss anyway as well as the Scorch. It is impractical. Now I never said it wouldn't be fun.

[Rekkon]

ATMs need increased velocity (somewhere between LRMs and SRMs) and missile health (1.5-2.0) to reduce their vulnerability to AMS. If one fires 15 LRMs and 15 ATMs at an AMS protected target, more of the ATMs should get through because the player is paying more tonnage for that launch capacity, as well as having far fewer missiles per ton of ammo.

ATMs are not going to replace LRMs for long distance fire because LRMs have far better efficiency in that bracket, both in terms of damage per ton of launcher and damage potential per ton of ammo, plus the indirect fire capability.

[Oberost]

MadRover, on 05 July 2017 - 08:21 AM, said:

Before I smash that build down let me start by saying splat damage is irrelevant. It does nothing but tickle the adjacent parts if at all.

Now here are the problems with that build. Armor on the arms are a joke on the Scorch and any range Scorch pilots need to be ashamed for even trying. The next is the heat gen vs cool down vs overall output, why would I want to even use this build over any other brawling build? The Scorch is meant for brawling not ranged combat. Also, considering that the Scorch is a priority target at all times means you are susceptible to being LRMed to death, rushed by every light in the game, and overall this build for the Scorch is more of a meme and not practical making this frowned upon especially when considering the expectations of every Assault pilot.

So there's your reasons why the Mauler shouldn't be even using gauss anyway as well as the Scorch. It is impractical. Now I never said it wouldn't be fun.

WTH???

Why do you suppose that the build I linked before is for brawling? It's a long range poke build and it's mean to be used from long ranges, not at point blank brawling range. I used this build to show that a 50 PPFLD brawling build with a Mauler sporting twin HGR is not OP at all, because right now we have mechs like the Scorch than have this 50 PPFLD (plus 10 splash that you seem to belive that it's useless. Hint: it's not...) with better speed, damage and RANGE.

The twin HGR Mauler is impractical, the Scorch is really good...

[Kaptain]

Viktor Drake, on 04 July 2017 - 10:47 AM, said:

Let me talk about one of my Mauler Builds on test, the Dual HGR Mauler.

SP Build:
Max Survival
Max Mobility
Firepower Optimized for Range, Cooldown, Gauss Rifles and Ammo Capacity.

Damage required to destroy front CT = 194.
Damage required to destroy ST = 137

HRG optimal Range = 226m

Damage at 226m = 50 PPFLD w/Zero Heat
Damage at 400m = 30 PPFLD w/Zero Heat
Damage at 500m = 20 PPFLD w/Zero Heat

HGR cooldown = 5.9 seconds

Top Speed: 57.1 KPH.

So does anyone see the problem here?

Not really, no? To start you talk about using it at range but don't state how much ammo you have. You also criticize clan builds with 40% heat efficiency. That't actually pretty decent staying power where as your build is 100% ammo dependent and with low yield per ton of ammo is strongly encouraged not to fight from range.

You know it doesn't take 137 point of damage to destroy the ST right? As soon as your armor (85ish) is pierced(like the very second it occurs) that HGR is going crit, explode and unless you are also running case, do its best to take that ST with it. For all intents and purposes that side torso is worthless, if not destroyed.

HGR cooldown is another thing to consider at 5.9seconds. That can be easily rushed in a brawl and your opponent can torso twist knowing that even if you are cooled down you can't hold charge forever. All they have to do is quickly torso twist back and put their full alpha onto that ST one more time and the 'op" HGR is gone. Do you have back up weapons? I assume you used the few tons that could be used on ERSLs or ERMLs or MPLs to pack more ammo in so you can use your HGRs from range? I think that is another thing to consider. If your 50 damage FLPP alph doesn't kill your target or destroy the intended component you are helpless for 6 seconds while they try to cause a GR explosion. Kinda rambling but that brings me to another point. One your guass rifle explodes your sing HGR is just meh. 25 damage in a brawl with limited ammo, long cooldown, long charge, a weapon that can be easily destroyed, without any backup weapons, in a mech that is forced to run a 300std and as a result is pretty slow. Meh?

But maybe I'm wrong. Wanna friendly brawl? Brawl being the key word there.

MadRover, on 05 July 2017 - 08:21 AM, said:

Before I smash that build down...

You are clearly just trying to "win" the discussion at any cost. That scorch build is completely reasonable and powerful. One can actually get to 40% heat efficiency by stripping a bit of leg/head and a half ton of ammo for an additional heatsink. Being a clan mech if you do have the armor on the arms pierced you are lucky enough to be protected by case when the GR explodes. If you still feel this is a bad build I offer up the KDK that also does quite well with dual Gass/ppc. Or the limited but jump capable NGR meta build.

Edited by Kaptain, 05 July 2017 - 01:38 PM.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Twin Heavy Gauss Mauler is a joke build, it isn't OP, it is weak.
5 AC5 > 2 Heavy Gauss

Edited by Quicksilver Kalasa, 05 July 2017 - 12:58 PM.

[Kaptain]

Also, Madrover
If you insist on talking about "brawling" the close range Scorch with twinLBX20s and 4xSRM6+As has 88 points of alpha damage. The max armor with Skill Tree on a mauler ST (with all of its armor front loaded and nothing on the back) is 85. That means at close range a scorch can just press delete and %50 of the maulers firepower is gone in a single hit that both pierces the armor AND crits out the guass rifle causing it to explode and do further damage. And it does that damage without charge up every 4 seconds vs 5.9.

Assuming the mauler hits the scorch in the same ST twice as it tries to close that's 80-100 damage. Meaning unless ammo goes critical the scorch still has a side torso and most/if not all of its weapons. Meanwhile for every 2 shots the mauler gets off the scorch got off 3. Even spread out that's a significant armor reduction on the mauler. Now they are both in close range where they both shine the most. Lets say they both delete each-others STs at that point. Pretty reasonable yes? Who is going to win? The mauler doing 25 damage every 6 seconds? or the Scorch doing 44 damage every 4 seconds? Obviously the scorch right? Esp considering it need only pierce the armor of the other side torso (2 hits max) and the other guass rifle is rendered useless.

Dual HGR is not overpowered its not even all that strong.

Edited by Kaptain, 05 July 2017 - 01:43 PM.

[Kaptain]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 05 July 2017 - 12:57 PM, said:

Twin Heavy Gauss Mauler is a joke build, it isn't OP, it is weak.
5 AC5 > 2 Heavy Gauss

Agreed.
25 damage at 620 optimal range every 1.66 second Is very strong yes.
88 damage close range scorch is very strong in a brawl.
50 damage dual erppc/gauss, also very strong at basically any range.
50 damage IS laser vomit also very strong
64 damage mauler (twinLBX20+4MPLs) also strong in a brawl
80+ damage Mauler (twin ultra20s + backups) will be strong even after ghost heat

Daul HGR (even if they were 10crits) is just ok.
VERY ammo limited in a 12v12
Low ammo discourages being used from long range
Lacks decent backup weapons (even with a LFE)
VERY fragile.
Somewhat slow (even with LFE as you would probably opt for more ammo and/or backup weapons)
Contains all of its weapons in only 2 locations
Slow Cool down
Long charge up
Easy to crit
Explodes

Even if you could run a LFE the lack of case means that if one of them pops you're are well on your way to loosing any backup weapons in the associated arm and suffering movement and heat penalties as well.

EDIT:
But seriously lets not all argue about it until infinity lets do some real world brawls and put the snarky !@#$ behind us.

Edited by Kaptain, 05 July 2017 - 03:15 PM.

[MadRover]

Oberost, on 05 July 2017 - 09:36 AM, said:

WTH???

Why do you suppose that the build I linked before is for brawling? It's a long range poke build and it's mean to be used from long ranges, not at point blank brawling range. I used this build to show that a 50 PPFLD brawling build with a Mauler sporting twin HGR is not OP at all, because right now we have mechs like the Scorch than have this 50 PPFLD (plus 10 splash that you seem to belive that it's useless. Hint: it's not...) with better speed, damage and RANGE.

The twin HGR Mauler is impractical, the Scorch is really good...

Sure if someone is dumb enough to stand in front of you and not move. Considering where the hard points are st do you really want to run the risk of becoming a stick faster? Let me repeat the key parts that make this build not as strong as you believe it to be.

First you can get LRMed to death.
Second lights will be more than happy to pick you off because you can't accurately shoot at them from up close
The last one I did forget to mention and it's if a team decides to push, you have to be at the front to share your armor. Are you that stingy with it?

Now I am done arguing about it because we are derailing the topic. Move on.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

MadRover, on 05 July 2017 - 01:50 PM, said:

Sure if someone is dumb enough to stand in front of you and not move. Considering where the hard points are st do you really want to run the risk of becoming a stick faster? Let me repeat the key parts that make this build not as strong as you believe it to be.

First you can get LRMed to death.
Second lights will be more than happy to pick you off because you can't accurately shoot at them from up close
The last one I did forget to mention and it's if a team decides to push, you have to be at the front to share your armor. Are you that stingy with it?

Now I am done arguing about it because we are derailing the topic. Move on.

Lolwut, why is the Scorch anymore susceptible to LRMs than other mechs? Space magic? No, sorry, that is just a silly notion, there is no difference in exposure level compared to the quad ERPPC Warhawk. Second, if you can't accurately shoot lights at short range with Gauss/PPCs, not really sure what to tell you.