74 replies to this topic

[Battlemaster56]

Greeting mechwarriors, I would like to discuss heavy lasers in the pts that I'm currently downloading. What coming at is the duration on them is extremely ridiculous even surpassing the old cerll duration values.

https://mwomercs.com...st-session#clan
But Battlemaster56 they do alot of damage when fired, imagine the 30-40 damage from only 3-4 HML's it's balance, I call bantha fodder on that one since a huge chunk of the damage gonna be spread around like butter while you can potential take two alphas in the face just to get the damage in. IDK a way to make them atleast bearable to bring into their respected ranges for the damage potential but I say cut the duration by 10-15% just to see how it feels maybe 18% if pushing a little to much.

Edited by Battlemaster56, 28 June 2017 - 11:06 AM.

[Luminis]

Luminis, on 24 June 2017 - 06:41 AM, said:

Expect: 50% max range (675m), ~1.5 seconds duration because of QQ and a cooldown to rival PPCs and more heat than you can handle...

Well, I was wrong on the max range...

[DGTLDaemon]

Let's put it this way: you have to be AFK to stand still under fire for 1.7 seconds without even bothering to twist your torso. I expected the heavy lasers to have reduced range and/or unfavorable damage/heat ratio, but not this kind of bullsh*t...

[Escef]

Yeah, they are rather light saber-y. Still, the damage to hardpoint to tonnage ratio is nothing to sneeze at.

[Battlemaster56]

Luminis, on 28 June 2017 - 11:12 AM, said:

Well, I was wrong on the max range...

I expect the max range to be the same as std.lasers, just my main problem is huge duration, I know they want to offset some of the huge damage potential but they could find a middle ground rather than the deep end of the spectrum. after the test and messing with the nodes I'll most likely rarely equip them since it's not even favorable in brawling range it better to use pulses and clan er smalls for that.

DGTLDaemon, on 28 June 2017 - 11:16 AM, said:

Let's put it this way: you have to be AFK to stand still under fire for 1.7 seconds without even bothering to twist your torso. I expected the heavy lasers to have reduced range and/or unfavorable damage/heat ratio, but not this kind of bullsh*t...

Yep HLL's is not even worth in mid range poking since most of the damage is wasted or you take a huge backlash just for attempting to poke one guy who can shot twist and shoot again while you still burning through the remaining of the duration.

[Battlemaster56]

Escef, on 28 June 2017 - 11:18 AM, said:

Yeah, they are rather light saber-y. Still, the damage to hardpoint to tonnage ratio is nothing to sneeze at.

If the risk of long face time and heat for it is worth it, with full laser duration nodes you could make HSL's bareable at best, HML pushing it but manageable, HLL's you only hope the enemy is a potatoe and take the full duration at 1.53 second burn time.

[Luminis]

Battlemaster56, on 28 June 2017 - 11:19 AM, said:

I expect the max range to be the same as std.lasers, just my main problem is huge duration, I know they want to offset some of the huge damage potential but they could find a middle ground rather than the deep end of the spectrum. after the test and messing with the nodes I'll most likely rarely equip them since it's not even favorable in brawling range it better to use pulses and clan er smalls for that.

I was hoping to use the HML as a secondary weapon on a quad LPL build I intend to run on my MCII, but lol nope. Not gonna touch these light sabers with a ten foot pole. I'd rather drop four damage per laser and get that damage on target (especially considering the range, too).

[Y E O N N E]

I winced visibly when I saw the stats on basically everything.

IS SL still garbage, now not even okay for poking in pairs as a poor-man's MPL since the ERSL out-ranges it completely.

IS ERML is about half-point too hot.

cSPL remains equally useless and none of the new lasers help.

Heavy Lasers have ridiculous duration and even more punitive heat than I expected.

Light Gauss and LB-X have literally nothing going for them. Heavy Gauss is being penalized on top of the massive built-in penalties it already has.

Light PPC is pointless with identical cooldown to standard PPCs and worse damage over heat. Heavy PPC has been overly neutered on damage. Only the Snub has a place, but it is too slow and too hot for its bracket.

Man...PGI went overly conservative for this first draft. There is a lot of tightening up to do, because this helps the IS way less than it needs to and even goes out of its way to ensure Clans retain long-range PPFLD superiority. Gross.

[Battlemaster56]

Luminis, on 28 June 2017 - 11:24 AM, said:

I was hoping to use the HML as a secondary weapon on a quad LPL build I intend to run on my MCII, but lol nope. Not gonna touch these light sabers with a ten foot pole. I'd rather drop four damage per laser and get that damage on target (especially considering the range, too).

Yea was hoping to use them as some type of armor cutter then use some srms or large ballistic to bust them, and just looking at the duration with full clan laser nodes you get it at cerll burn times but still not usable in it's range bracket since it's too easy spread.

[Battlemaster56]

Yeonne Greene, on 28 June 2017 - 11:28 AM, said:

I winced visibly when I saw the stats on basically everything.

IS SL still garbage, now not even okay for poking in pairs as a poor-man's MPL since the ERSL out-ranges it completely.

IS ERML is about half-point too hot.

cSPL remains equally useless and none of the new lasers help.

Heavy Lasers have ridiculous duration and even more punitive heat than I expected.

Light Gauss and LB-X have literally nothing going for them. Heavy Gauss is being penalized on top of the massive built-in penalties it already has.

Light PPC is pointless with identical cooldown to standard PPCs and worse damage over heat. Heavy PPC has been overly neutered on damage. Only the Snub has a place, but it is too slow and too hot for its bracket.

Man...PGI went overly conservative for this first draft. There is a lot of tightening up to do, because this helps the IS way less than it needs to and even goes out of its way to ensure Clans retain long-range PPFLD superiority. Gross.

Yep the ppc's and er lasers were most disappointing and somewhat confusing seeing that they're either neutered or unnecessarily punished added with their inbuilt drawbacks. I feel like they were to scared to release the raw stats and just work upon them with the test.

[r4plez]

disappointment

Edited by r4plez, 28 June 2017 - 11:36 AM.

[Gas Guzzler]

12 Dmg heavy PPCs? Seriously?

And that Heavy Gauss with 180m optimal range? AND reticle shake? Man...

Also 1.7 second duration is ridiculous. So is 1.6.

Edited by Gas Guzzler, 28 June 2017 - 11:42 AM.

[PaquIS]

Yeah pretty disappointed to see all those stats.

IS ERML is too hot, heavy gauss and heavy PPC seem pointless with their tonnage/slot requirement for what they can do and the clan heavy lasers... that duration!

The clan micro lasers seem pretty useless to me as well.

Also I was hoping the IS machine guns would have been 0,25 tons for light, 0,5 for normal and 0,75 for heavy.

But one can only hope this is just a very carefull first presentation and the stats will be adjusted before they go live.

Edited by PaquIS, 28 June 2017 - 11:46 AM.

[Rekkon]

I suspect Heavy PPCs splash 1.5 damage to either adjacent location, just like 2.5 splash present on Clan ERPPCs.

[Morderian]

well i can understand the shake on the heavy Gauss makes it less viable for a HG to laser vomit but the range is a bit too short should have AC20 range,

then the heavy lasers well there might be a place for the small one but the rest will most likely see no use except the HLL in the shadowcat for scouting for all others way too long burn time you will lose half your mech before you stop firing and then there is the huge amount of spreading

PPCs well we will see, light might be good depending on the GH

Edited by Morderian, 28 June 2017 - 11:52 AM.

[Paigan]

Heavy Large Lasers are funny:
- They are not interesting for their damage per heat value because it is below 1.0 (lolwut?)
- They are not interesting for assault Mechs due to their high slot count AND low range.
- They are not interesting for their damage per second as it is lower than that of a cERLL.
- They are not interesting for their duration (because it's aweful, hands down).
- They are not interesting for their range.
- They are not interesting for their heat per second, as even that is rather bad.

Their ONLY somewhat remotely not totally sucking value is "alpha per hardpoint". But even that is kind of ruined by the bad duration. It can hardly be called an "alpha" at all. More like a "stream".

Which Mechs have the speed to compensate the short range AND enough free slots and tonnage but not enough tonnage and/or hardpoints to just equip more of the far superior cERLL or cLPL right away?
The Gargoyle? But why not use cERMLs instead?
A brawler Shadow Cat, maybe?
A ... I dunno ... brawler MLX? No, wait, even the sucky MLX would rather just equip 3 cERMLs and 1 DHS instead of one HLL.

Completely useless weapon.

Edited by Paigan, 28 June 2017 - 12:03 PM.

[Kargush]

"Now witness the firepower of this fully armed and operational Nova! You may fire at will, warrior!"

[Tordin]

Needs some tweaking for sure.
I know the hamsters are busy with the servers right now. Do Chris and Paul have doser underlings, doing balance? I smell some balance sabotage here and there...

[Bud Crue]

1.7 seconds...think of heavy lasers as the energy LBX? Hey, there ya go PGI increased crit chance for the light saber! Waaalhaa: balanced!

-snort-

[MustrumRidcully]

Kargush, on 28 June 2017 - 11:56 AM, said:

"Now witness the firepower of this fully armed and operational Nova! You may fire at will, warrior!"

Nice. But the animation is to short for heavy lasers.