18 replies to this topic

[ingramli]

Some mechs are hardly seen in action in FP, such as PNT-10P. Please PGI, bring them back into play, so that we can see more variety than the infamous Locust (PB), thank you.

[Ced Riggs]

Popularity of a mech is seemingly a metric our Balance Overlord does not take into account, but merely individual performance in a vacuum. Ironically enough, the Panthers aren't doing too hot there, either, but there are so many chassis that are doing badly, it leaves one befuddled as to how a Night Gyr gets nerfed, but none of the weak chassis get buffed to make them enjoyable and viable.

Yet, +10% PPC velocity on top of preexisting quirks isn't going to fix a Panther. These mechs all work in the binary LoS situations of tabletop, but in MW:O, where hardpoint location is paramount to performance, mechs like the Panther are relegated to brawling (which they aren't good at), and for brawling, they have no quirks. After a lot of experimenting, a mix of lasers and SRM came out as the best performing loadout for these mechs for me. If I try to go with the historic role of a fire support PPC sniper, I eat ****.

[jss78]

PNT-10P is a funny example, because it's a non-canon variant that for made specifically for MWO. Yet it works even worse in the game than the lore variants. Interesting that they'd spend man hours on an excercise like that :-P

[Bud Crue]

Buff "unpopular" mechs.

Nope.

Look at the 10P.
It has by current PGI standards "god tier" level of quirks. Unless you can figure out a way to buff it without adding to those offensive quirks, and keeping base line agility sort of close to relevant to chassis mates, then the current balance overlord is not interested by his own statements. Defensive quirks appear to be acceptable for use, but how much more do you give the 10P? Double the arm armor? What else can you do with it -that PGI would be remotely likely to go for, and not be an unprecedented buff over other mechs? (I for one would give it added 25% ammo space quirk and a maybe a similar reduced quirk chance quirk but I cannot even imagine PGI going for that...in their realm of balance any additive needs a subtraction and I don't see what you would want to take away from the 10P).

[BlueFlames]

Buff for the unpopular mechs? Of course not. Everything else will get nerfed, until the currently-unpopular mechs are "overperforming," and then they'll get nerfed too.

[C E Dwyer]

I just think they should finish changing the structure bonuses to armour, a project they still haven't completed and then go from there.

[BlueFlames]

Cathy, on 16 July 2017 - 07:42 AM, said:

I just think they should finish changing the structure bonuses to armour, a project they still haven't completed and then go from there.

Anything worth doing is worth half-assing.

[Kanil]

Bud Crue, on 16 July 2017 - 07:32 AM, said:

reduced quirk chance quirk

I'm pretty sure the 10P's quirk chance quirk is basically rock bottom as-is.

[JC Daxion]

LFE will change this mech.. tank with left side, dual PPC's, should be fun.


But honestly, some mechs are hard mode.. But i do find it interesting how people say so many mechs are dead, yet a good player can totally destroy in them. For instance, how often do you see a "Fang" in game? Almost never.. yet you can put up 1k+ in it in an average good game and a lot easier than many other mechs. Though these days, art strikes are just puffing stats. Use a couple and you can boost your damage by 500+ easy. I had a match that i had a rare DC, came back, dropped 2 air/arts and a few shots and died...(most of the team was dead) I did 650 damage. The last event was simple.. Use an air strike, and basically you got your 100 match score.

People are just so stuck on what ever they think the meta is. Another example, Black Knight. People whine about it that it was nerfed.. I decided to finally play mine for the last month, and it has become my highest rated mech after playing 200+ matches between a couple of them. I have over 130 mechs, and to have one stand out as great, yet folks say they suck, i just don't get.

[Angel of Annihilation]

Ced Riggs, on 16 July 2017 - 07:08 AM, said:

Popularity of a mech is seemingly a metric our Balance Overlord does not take into account, but merely individual performance in a vacuum. Ironically enough, the Panthers aren't doing too hot there, either, but there are so many chassis that are doing badly, it leaves one befuddled as to how a Night Gyr gets nerfed, but none of the weak chassis get buffed to make them enjoyable and viable.

Yet, +10% PPC velocity on top of preexisting quirks isn't going to fix a Panther. These mechs all work in the binary LoS situations of tabletop, but in MW:O, where hardpoint location is paramount to performance, mechs like the Panther are relegated to brawling (which they aren't good at), and for brawling, they have no quirks. After a lot of experimenting, a mix of lasers and SRM came out as the best performing loadout for these mechs for me. If I try to go with the historic role of a fire support PPC sniper, I eat ****.

Actually I disagree. If a mech is popular PGI is sure to nerf it. Seriously if a mech is popular then it is usually for a reason and that reason is usually because it performs well. Popularity basically puts the mech under PGI's microscope and nerfs are sure to follow.

And for the unpopular, why would PGI bother because no one is playing them?

[Alan Hicks]

Somehow, it already happened with the skill tree. A portion of old mechs returned and people are now using them. Is all about digging up good old ones and testing other alternatives.

Of course some mechs abandoned in oblivion are still not very good no matter how you configure them with a build or in the maze tree.

More new mechs are coming, and after that, more and more...I doubt they are going to address buffing specific and unpopular ones anytime soon.

[Angel of Annihilation]

JC Daxion, on 16 July 2017 - 08:36 AM, said:

LFE will change this mech.. tank with left side, dual PPC's, should be fun.


But honestly, some mechs are hard mode.. But i do find it interesting how people say so many mechs are dead, yet a good player can totally destroy in them. For instance, how often do you see a "Fang" in game? Almost never.. yet you can put up 1k+ in it in an average good game and a lot easier than many other mechs. Though these days, art strikes are just puffing stats. Use a couple and you can boost your damage by 500+ easy. I had a match that i had a rare DC, came back, dropped 2 air/arts and a few shots and died...(most of the team was dead) I did 650 damage. The last event was simple.. Use an air strike, and basically you got your 100 match score.

People are just so stuck on what ever they think the meta is. Another example, Black Knight. People whine about it that it was nerfed.. I decided to finally play mine for the last month, and it has become my highest rated mech after playing 200+ matches between a couple of them. I have over 130 mechs, and to have one stand out as great, yet folks say they suck, i just don't get.

Your absolutely right. I am in the same boat. I have several mechs I think are absolute monsters that most people think are crap. Your Black Knight example is great. I bought a couple for the first time during that Renissance Mech sale a month or so ago and I was shocked at how good of a mech it is, however those low mounted hardpoint require you to play the mech completely different to be successful with as compared to your typical high mount requirement for a mech to be considered meta. If it is not meta, it is crap right? Not really but try convincing the masses of that.

[JC Daxion]

Viktor Drake, on 16 July 2017 - 08:39 AM, said:

And for the unpopular, why would PGI bother because no one is playing them?

How many unpopular mechs become OP over the years? 20-30+ Every year there are a bunch of older mechs that become OP because of changes. (or in a good spot, Like the dragon, HBK, Commando to name a few) New tech is going to add event more. I will not be surprised to see Victors, with an LFE become a nasty brawler. I know i can't wait to stomp in mine. The ST and changes buffed it a bit, but upgrading to an LFE from an STD is going to make this mech crank.


Commando's are totally wrecking things as lights now. So much in fact it makes me worry it will get nerfed.. Would anyone of said, watch out for the commando 2 months ago? You would not of even seen one in a match outside of the rare DK drop.

[JC Daxion]

Viktor Drake, on 16 July 2017 - 08:45 AM, said:

Your absolutely right. I am in the same boat. I have several mechs I think are absolute monsters that most people think are crap. Your Black Knight example is great. I bought a couple for the first time during that Renissance Mech sale a month or so ago and I was shocked at how good of a mech it is, however those low mounted hardpoint require you to play the mech completely different to be successful with as compared to your typical high mount requirement for a mech to be considered meta. If it is not meta, it is crap right? Not really but try convincing the masses of that.

Yes, you are correct, they do take a totally different play style. Its all about corner poking, or a major Brawl push. But to be honest i hate hill humping. Maybe that is why people don't play the BK much. But as is, that mech is a beast. I am not sure why folks say it was nerfed into uselessness. I can consistently be in the top 3 on the team in that mech. I can't say that about most mechs i play.

[LORD ORION]

ingramli, on 16 July 2017 - 06:21 AM, said:

Some mechs are hardly seen in action in FP, such as PNT-10P. Please PGI, bring them back into play, so that we can see more variety than the infamous Locust (PB), thank you.

Opposite...
eg: trying to figure out WTF to do with my TDR-9SE

[Spheroid]

If you want more variety in FP, the obvious solution is force faction tables and associated modifiers to promote variation from the optimum. Everyone responds to money, its just a matter of the amount needed to achieve that end.

The 10P as a non-canon design really doesn't need to be promoted.


Also do you seek visual variety or weapon variety? Winning generally revolves around brining the proper loadout to an associated map and gamemode regardless what form the gun bag resembles(within reason).

Edited by Spheroid, 16 July 2017 - 09:29 AM.

[ingramli]

JC Daxion, on 16 July 2017 - 08:50 AM, said:

I can consistently be in the top 3 on the team in that mech. I can't say that about most mechs i play.

Sure pilot skills play a bigger role than the strength of the mech. Having said that, in highly competitive environment where every bits count, i dont really see those "unpopular" mechs used by the champions or contenders, for some reasons, most likely because those mechs simply doesnt perform as good as others under the exisitng "rule" of the game. Nerfing a couple of so-called OPed mechs wont bring them back to action, unless all other mechs get nerfed to perform the level close to them, i afraid...

[Bud Crue]

Kanil, on 16 July 2017 - 08:24 AM, said:

I'm pretty sure the 10P's quirk chance quirk is basically rock bottom as-is.

oops. I of course meant reduced crit chance. Lol.

[Bud Crue]

JC Daxion, on 16 July 2017 - 08:46 AM, said:

How many unpopular mechs become OP over the years? 20-30+ Every year there are a bunch of older mechs that become OP because of changes. (or in a good spot, Like the dragon, HBK, Commando to name a few) New tech is going to add event more. I will not be surprised to see Victors, with an LFE become a nasty brawler. I know i can't wait to stomp in mine. The ST and changes buffed it a bit, but upgrading to an LFE from an STD is going to make this mech crank.


Commando's are totally wrecking things as lights now. So much in fact it makes me worry it will get nerfed.. Would anyone of said, watch out for the commando 2 months ago? You would not of even seen one in a match outside of the rare DK drop.

You named a few but...so? Just not sure where you are going with the comment.

For every old mech that is made competitive (I refuse to believe that either the Dragon or the Commando is "OP", but merely viable and competitive in very specific niches) there are two or three new mechs that are instantly OP and several existing mechs that are allowed to stay OP for YEARS.