113 replies to this topic

[GA1NAX]

Opinion is simple - WASTE OF TONNAGE.

Edited by GA1NAX, 04 August 2017 - 07:16 AM.

[Bud Crue]

GA1NAX, on 04 August 2017 - 07:16 AM, said:

Opinion is simple - WASTE OF TONNAGE.

Bah.

I put two on a warhammer along with six ERML. Finally a build with reasonable heat (1.26), reasonable speed (XL300), and reasonable armor (admittedly shaved the arms a bit) and most importantly looks damn good. Who cares about it being a wast of tonnage when I have symmetry and good looks (plus they sound cool too especially when fired with the ERMLs).

[R Valentine]

Bud Crue, on 04 August 2017 - 10:51 AM, said:

Bah.

I put two on a warhammer along with six ERML. Finally a build with reasonable heat (1.26), reasonable speed (XL300), and reasonable armor (admittedly shaved the arms a bit) and most importantly looks damn good. Who cares about it being a wast of tonnage when I have symmetry and good looks (plus they sound cool too especially when fired with the ERMLs).

I use 2 on the MAD-5M with 5 ERML. It's really the only mech I'd consider L-Gauss on. Both in the same shoulder means all shots hit in the same spot all the time, and it has enough energy points to carry a decent array of backup weapons.

[Jay Leon Hart]

Bud Crue, on 04 August 2017 - 10:51 AM, said:

Bah.

I put two on a warhammer along with six ERML. Finally a build with reasonable heat (1.26), reasonable speed (XL300), and reasonable armor (admittedly shaved the arms a bit) and most importantly looks damn good. Who cares about it being a wast of tonnage when I have symmetry and good looks (plus they sound cool too especially when fired with the ERMLs).

Maybe swap to 4 ERSL and 2 LPPC, to look *even cooler* ?! (And be even *less* effective )

[Shadowomega1]

But two on a JM6-A 997m Optimal range, 2k max range, 2500 m/s projectile speed, and a quite quick recharge rate. Now I would only change anything on the weapon with after a lot more of the quirks are pulled from the game.

[Y E O N N E]

Shadowomega1, on 04 August 2017 - 11:07 AM, said:

But two on a JM6-A 997m Optimal range, 2k max range, 2500 m/s projectile speed, and a quite quick recharge rate. Now I would only change anything on the weapon with after a lot more of the quirks are pulled from the game.

RFL-3C with 35% range boost and 22% cooldown. Gun is still bad. Extra velocity is pointless, hitting things is not the issue.

[Bud Crue]

Jay Leon Hart, on 04 August 2017 - 10:55 AM, said:

Maybe swap to 4 ERSL and 2 LPPC, to look *even cooler* ?! (And be even *less* effective )

That's the spirit. I'll bet the combo of sounds of all three weapons systems will sound great. Will give it ago tonight.
Ya know...if it weren't for the more than three ghost heat on the LPPCs I would consider dumping all the ERML for 4 of the things. That would look pretty sweet.

[ManDaisy]

Found its a pretty good a heat neutral weapon paired with 2 medium lasers for dancing on the red line... but otherwise there are much better uses for its tonnage. Ac 5 strait up beats it by a long shot in my opinion. Get rid of charge up or lower cool down so its more in line with the ac 10.

Edited by ManDaisy, 04 August 2017 - 12:06 PM.

[The6thMessenger]

Khobai, on 30 July 2017 - 09:00 AM, said:

Light Gauss should be 10 damage, 4.25+0.5 cooldown, 810m/1620m range, and 2200m/s velocity.

10 damage may be too much of a step up from the AC10 considering everything else. If 10 damage, it should have 13 tons at least, else just 8 damage for 12 tons.

Cooldown should be at 3.00 + 0.50s charge, at 810/1620m range, 2400m/s velocity, with 25 shots/ton.

Khobai, on 30 July 2017 - 09:00 AM, said:

And Clan Gauss should be 12 damage, 4.25+0.5 cooldown, 750m/1500m range, and 2000m/s velocity.

In terms of stats, Clan Gauss should be in between Light Gauss and IS Std Gauss. Because it weighs 3 tons less than IS Std Gauss so theres no way it should be as good as IS Std Gauss.


Lastly, Heavy Gauss should be 22 damage, 6.0+1.0 cooldown, 570m/1140m range, and 1500m/s velocity (and possibly a ghost heat penalty if you fire 2 heavy gauss simultaneously)

Heavy Gauss isnt gonna work as a brawling weapon. It cant compete against IS ultra autocannons. It needs longer range so it functions more like an actual Gauss weapon.

Calm your teats. OP's asking only for Light Gauss.

Edited by The6thMessenger, 04 August 2017 - 10:47 PM.

[FupDup]

The6thMessenger, on 04 August 2017 - 10:41 PM, said:

10 damage may be too much of a step up from the AC10 considering everything else. If 10 damage, it should have 13 tons at least, else just 8 damage for 12 tons.

Maybe try 9 damage at first to see if that's enough?

[The6thMessenger]

FupDup, on 04 August 2017 - 10:42 PM, said:

Maybe try 9 damage at first to see if that's enough?

Maybe I guess.

[Khobai]

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10 damage may be too much of a step up from the AC10 considering everything else. If 10 damage, it should have 13 tons at least, else just 8 damage for 12 tons.

light gauss would be fine at 10 damage.

because its the UAC10 thats putting the AC10 out of business

it makes no sense to try and balance the light gauss with the AC10 when the UAC10 is outright better anyway.

if youre worried about keeping the AC10 viable, you need to worry more about the UAC10.

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Cooldown should be at 3.00 + 0.50s charge

nah its dps shouldnt be higher than regular gauss.

at 10 damage it should be 4.25+0.5 cooldown

ive given light gauss enough other advantages over standard gauss to be worth considering in builds that want to snipe at 810m.

Quote

Calm your teats. OP's asking only for Light Gauss.

what the OP asked for still doesnt change the fact that clan gauss needs to be nerfed.

its a full three tons lighter than IS gauss with no real downside. so yeah clan gauss needs a major nerf.

Quote

Maybe try 9 damage at first to see if that's enough?

9 is still crap needs to be at least 10

10s a good number because it allows it to crit equipment with 10 health in one hit.

Edited by Khobai, 04 August 2017 - 11:01 PM.

[The6thMessenger]

Khobai, on 04 August 2017 - 10:51 PM, said:

light gauss would be fine at 10 damage.

because its the UAC10 thats putting the AC10 out of business

it makes no sense to try and balance the light gauss with the AC10 when the UAC10 is outright better anyway.

if youre worried about keeping the AC10 viable, you need to worry more about the UAC10.

At 12 tons vs 13 tons, of course I'm gonna balance by AC10 than UAC10, cause the AC10 is the same tonnage as the LGR. Yes it makes sense to balance the LGR with AC10. UAC10 gets a pass by being 1 ton heavier.

You might say that the GR is balanced against the AC20 despite being 1 ton heavier. Until you realize that's 15 damage for 660m, that flies at 2000 m/s, versus 650m of the AC20 at only 270m.

You are ignoring roles they are meant to do.

Khobai, on 04 August 2017 - 10:51 PM, said:

nah its dps shouldnt be higher than regular gauss.

at 10 damage it should be 4.25+0.5 cooldown

ive given light gauss enough other advantages over standard gauss to be worth considering in builds that want to snipe at 810m.

GR has 2.608695652173913 DPS (15 dmg / 5.75s), while my LGR setup has 2.285714285714286 dps (8 / 3.5s)

Versus right now of 8 / 4.25 (3.75 + 0.5s), pathetic 1.882352941176471 DPS. I could get better DPS by putting 2 AC2s together.

Of course the LGR even on my permutation won't be better than 2x AC2 DPS wise, but it has other things such as better PPFLD, better velocity.

Khobai, on 04 August 2017 - 10:51 PM, said:

what the OP asked for still doesnt change the fact that clan gauss needs to be nerfed.

its a full three tons lighter than IS gauss with no real downside. so yeah clan gauss needs a major nerf.

I don't agree with Clan Gauss, but agree with the rest. Just put it somewhere else, come on. This is borderline spam.

Khobai, on 04 August 2017 - 10:51 PM, said:

9 is still crap needs to be at least 10

10s a good number because it allows it to crit equipment with 10 health in one hit.

Maybe they're not meant to do that in the first place.

[Khobai]

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UAC10 gets a pass by being 1 ton heavier.

nobody is gonna take an AC10 when they can take a UAC10 for 1 ton more.

its potentially double the damage for only 1 ton extra

so no UAC10 does not get a pass for being 1 ton extra. Its silly to even suggest that.

Basically no one is using AC10s anymore because UAC10 is so much better.

Quote

Versus right now of 8 / 4.25 (3.75 + 0.5s), pathetic 1.882352941176471 DPS. I could get better DPS by putting 2 AC2s together.

and two AC2s should do more dps than a light gauss. working as intended.

gauss isnt an autocannon. the purpose of gauss isnt to do dps. its to snipe.

in order for light gauss to be better at sniping it needs to do more damage and have more range. it doesnt need more dps. if you want a dps ballistics thats what autocannons are for.

turning light gauss into a fast firing ballistic weapon just blurs the line between gauss weapons and autocannons.

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I don't agree with Clan Gauss, but agree with the rest. Just put it somewhere else, come on. This is borderline spam.

Clan Gauss weighs 3 tons less than IS Gauss. You havent convinced me why Clan Gauss shouldnt be worse than IS Gauss.

3 tons is not a small difference. Its a significant amount of tonnage. There needs to be a downside for that tonnage savings.

Quote

Maybe they're not meant to do that in the first place.

Why not? The weapon is not good at 8 damage. Making it do 10 damage makes it better. Not just because it does 25% more damage but also because it makes it better at critting equipment.

So seems like it should do 10 damage to me.

Light Gauss should be the ballistic equivalent of the ERPPC. 10 damage 810m range.

Edited by Khobai, 05 August 2017 - 12:40 AM.

[The6thMessenger]

Khobai, on 05 August 2017 - 12:26 AM, said:

not really. nobody is gonna take an AC10 when they can take a UAC10 for 1 ton more.

its double the damage potentially for only 1 ton extra.

Basically no one is using AC10s anymore because UAC10 is so much better.

What, you represent the entire player base? You think people are stopped from using AC5 just because the UAC5 is just 1 ton away? I'm actually using the LB10X for the exact reason that it's -1 ton and -1 slot versus the AC10. I still use AC5 time to time over UAC5. But hey I guess i'm nobody.

No the UAC10 gets a pass, because it's 1 ton heavier, which affects how builds are done, and the availability of the builds. Because that +1 slot and ton, can mean less ammo, less heat-sink, less engine rating, less armor, and so on and so forth.

The LGR just needs to be worth it's weight, cause its not supposed to compete with the UAC10 anyways, just with the AC10 cause they have the most similar roles and exact tonnage. The LGR only goes farther with less DPS.

Khobai, on 05 August 2017 - 12:26 AM, said:

and two AC2s should do more dps than a light gauss. working as intended.

gauss isnt an autocannon. the purpose of gauss isnt to do dps. its to snipe.

in order for light gauss to be better at sniping it needs to do more damage and have more range. it doesnt need more dps. If you want a dps ballistics thats what autocannons are for.

But you can snipe, and still do decent damage overtime. Being quick on your shots isn't really against the rules. It's not supposed to beat the AC2 damage wise, but it's not supposed to be a complete pain long range either.

Also the 20 damage could also be potentially op over really long range, especially being easier to land versus ERPPCs, and colder too.

Khobai, on 05 August 2017 - 12:26 AM, said:

turning light gauss into a fast firing ballistic weapon just blurs the line between gauss weapons and autocannons.

No it doesn't, the difference with mechanics and range changes that. Not because you can shoot fast means it's DPS, landing a well placed shot would still be a factor considering it's range where it's meant to be used.

Same thing with RAC to UAC.

Khobai, on 05 August 2017 - 12:26 AM, said:

Clan Gauss weighs 3 tons less than IS Gauss. You havent convinced me why Clan Gauss shouldnt be worse than IS Gauss.

3 tons is not a small difference. Its a significant amount of tonnage. There needs to be a downside for that tonnage savings.

Not the ******* thread for it. Likewise you're not the ******* autoritah for it. I don't post in this god damn forum to ******* convince you.

Khobai, on 05 August 2017 - 12:26 AM, said:

Why not? The weapon is not good at 8 damage. Making it do 10 damage makes it better. Not just because it does 25% more damage but also because it makes it better at critting equipment.

So seems like it should do 10 damage to me.

Light Gauss should be the ballistic equivalent of the ERPPC. 10 damage 810m range.

And it seems to me that it shouldn't do 10 damage, cause that would be too powerful, considering it's tonnage. Even if it crits equipments better, it does not mean it's balanced. That's still a step up from AC10 that puts it into obscurity, like the UAC10 doesn't already puts it in it's place.

No, LGR should be it's own thing.

Edited by The6thMessenger, 05 August 2017 - 12:54 AM.

[Aggravated Assault Mech]

Honestly, IS Gauss could have the charge removed and still be balanced.

[Khobai]

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What, you represent the entire player base? You think people are stopped from using AC5 just because the UAC5 is just 1 ton away?

we arnt talking about the AC5 or UAC5 though. thats a different discussion entirely and has no bearing on the current discussion. Mostly because AC5 is a way better weapon than the AC10, it has more advantages that merit taking it than the AC10 does. The AC10 is just a bad weapon, it always has been bad. Theyre not really comparable.

Were specifically talking about the AC10 and UAC10. And there is no reason not to pay the 1 extra ton for the UAC10. its foolishness to use an AC10 or LB10X instead of a UAC10. the UAC10 can do potentially twice the damage (10 extra damage!) for only 1 more ton.

Quote

Also the 20 damage could also be potentially op over really long range, especially being easier to hit.

Not really. AC5/ERPPC builds are more than capable of that already.

Light Gauss would perfectly be fine at 10 damage

For its absurd 12 tons, it needs to do 10 damage, or there is no reason to use it.

And turning light gauss into an autocannon is not a solution, because it will be flat out worse than the UAC10. to make light gauss different from the UAC10 it needs to significantly outdamage the UAC10 at longer ranges.

Edited by Khobai, 05 August 2017 - 01:03 AM.

[The6thMessenger]

Khobai, on 05 August 2017 - 12:54 AM, said:

we arnt talking about the AC5 or UAC5 though. that is a different discussion entirely and has no bearing on the current discussion.

Were specifically talking about the AC10 and UAC10. And there is no reason not to pay the 1 extra ton for the UAC10. its foolishness to use an AC10 or LB10X instead of a UAC10. the UAC10 can do potentially twice the damage for only 1 more ton.

But apparently HGR, GR, and C-GR bleeding into the discussion is fine. And who the ******* **** are you to represent the entire player base? To declare that nobody would use it?

No, it's actually relevant. Those that i pointed out outline what one more ton can do. Yes there is reason to not to pay the extra 1 ton for the UAC10, and that is to allot that 1 ton someplace else, that could be another laser, another heat sink, another ton of ammo -- or less of it -- or better engine rating, better armor.

Not to mention that the AC10 does 10 PPFLD versus the UAC10 doing 2x 5 PPFLD. Yes that's minimized by being able to put both shells at a single location, but then you don't have to with the AC10.

So the **** what if the UAC10 can potentially do the 2x damage? 1 ton can still mean a lot considering other possibilities than just damage. Likewise, the UAC10 have a completely different role to fulfill, because specialization.

The LGR doesn't need to compete with the UAC10, it just doesn't need to suck at it's role. The two has completely different tonnage and roles, and the reason to use LGR should come out when a player choose to participate at a certain role. Don't you ******* forget that.

Khobai, on 05 August 2017 - 12:54 AM, said:

Not really. AC5/ERPPC builds are more than capable of that already.

Until you realize that the LGR you proposed has 2200 velocity, at 810m range, making the AC5 build moot. The ERPPC however, goes hotter versus the LGR that would let you shoot much more frequently, and has way revealing bolt which makes it less ideal for sniping, as well as Stealth-armor builds -- Thanatos 5S comes to mind, and that's it's ******* stock loadout.

You're looking at the weapons too narrowly, especially how you think that the 4x AC5 is supposed to be for sniping at a comparable range of the LGR.

Khobai, on 05 August 2017 - 12:54 AM, said:

Light Gauss would perfectly be fine at 10 damage

For its absurd 12 tons, it needs to do 10 damage, or there is no reason to use it.

No it would be OP. And what's more absurd is doing 10 damage at 810m, 2200 projectile speed, at a meager 12 tons. When the weapon of equivalent has worse ballistic behavior, making it already less popular. And it's balanced to match a 13 ton weapon.

There is a reason to use it, you're just too damn narrow cause you can't look past damage, range, and DPS. Being a weapon with a fringe specialization, of course it would fall under fringe roles. That's far from "no reason".

Khobai, on 05 August 2017 - 12:54 AM, said:

And turning light gauss into an autocannon is not a solution, because it will be flat out worse than the UAC10. to make light gauss different from the UAC10 it needs to significantly outdamage the UAC10 at longer ranges.

Lol no, it doesn't. It's still a sniping weapon considering it's range and velocity, likewise 3.5s between shot, and the inferior DPS. It's already different because the different specializations. You think that the LGR at my current suggestion would out DPS at UAC10 range? What about the UAC10 outranging the LGR? You think that those two are interchangeable on builds and would do the same performance?

No it's not supposed to match the UAC10, those two doesn't have the same weight.

Edited by The6thMessenger, 05 August 2017 - 03:53 AM.

[Mahpsy]

Steel Claws, on 30 July 2017 - 08:02 AM, said:

o I've tried these and my opinion...They just weigh too much for the damage they do. All the other gauss rifles do at least one point damage per ton. LG is .667 damage per ton.They either need to drop the weight to 8 tons or increase the damage to 10-12. There is just no compelling reason to take them.

Sounds like another weapon we have *cough*ac2*cough*.. jeez sorry I live in washington. Pretty smokey over here right now.

[The6thMessenger]

Ragingdemon, on 05 August 2017 - 01:18 AM, said:

Sounds like another weapon we have *cough*ac2*cough*.. jeez sorry I live in washington. Pretty smokey over here right now.

Maybe the AC2 should do 6 damage/shots instead? The AC5 does 8 damage, the AC10 does 12 damage, and the AC20 does 14 damage.

After all, the GR does 1 damage/ton. *sarcasm

Edited by The6thMessenger, 05 August 2017 - 01:29 AM.