Pretty open ended question. What is the new tech like, how is the meta, are pugs still potatoes or has the game god granted us mercy? I have 8 patches I need to download, so I got a bit of time and thought I'd drop a forum post for some information.
Peace, and Have Fun.
2
Been Off For A Long Time. How Is The New Tech.
Started by Kimberm1911, Aug 08 2017 06:33 PM
16 replies to this topic
#3
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Posted 08 August 2017 - 06:47 PM
FutureTech™ generally isn't as good as old stuff
Gauss Vomit is the new powerful loadout, with gimped PPC+Gauss
You know, Circa 2014-15
Gauss Vomit is the new powerful loadout, with gimped PPC+Gauss
You know, Circa 2014-15
#4
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- Ace Of Spades
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Posted 08 August 2017 - 06:49 PM
LFEs are cool for some IS builds going from STD Engine & Ferro, to LFE Engine & LightFerro,
ERML are cool, their range and heat make them a good weapon but not one that obsoletes MLs,
IS UACs are fun, and fire in Bursts 1less Shell than Clan(IS-UAC10=2ShellBurst) (IS-UAC20=3ShellBurst)
MRMs are interesting, and have their ups and downs, same with Heavy and Light Guass,
Heavy Lasers are ok, help some OmniMechs, but dont work well on others,
ATMs are just as MRMs abit of a mixed bag,
LaserAMS is cool for both sides and opens up for interesting anti Missile options,
not very helpful, but ok,.....
ERML are cool, their range and heat make them a good weapon but not one that obsoletes MLs,
IS UACs are fun, and fire in Bursts 1less Shell than Clan(IS-UAC10=2ShellBurst) (IS-UAC20=3ShellBurst)
MRMs are interesting, and have their ups and downs, same with Heavy and Light Guass,
Heavy Lasers are ok, help some OmniMechs, but dont work well on others,
ATMs are just as MRMs abit of a mixed bag,
LaserAMS is cool for both sides and opens up for interesting anti Missile options,
Davegt27, on 08 August 2017 - 06:36 PM, said:
sucks
not very helpful, but ok,.....
#5
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- Bad Company
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Posted 08 August 2017 - 07:38 PM
I came back to try it out, and overall I would say its fun to play around -- its new and shiny.
Shiny is pretty!
Shiny is pretty!
#6
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- Ace Of Spades
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Posted 08 August 2017 - 07:39 PM
Wow....... Still Gauss vomit meta? Glad I didn't sell the Night Gyr then. Is it still the monster it was a while back?
#7
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- The Nimble
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Posted 08 August 2017 - 07:43 PM
Kimberm1911, on 08 August 2017 - 07:39 PM, said:
Wow....... Still Gauss vomit meta? Glad I didn't sell the Night Gyr then. Is it still the monster it was a while back?
No, it is not. It's been gutted twice; agility cut down to nothing and the offending payload rendered mostly impotent.
#8
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Posted 08 August 2017 - 07:54 PM
Laser AMS is nice, a bit hot.
Heavy lasers are a colossal bust, IS rotary ac are cool niche weaps but not the most efficient, not really sure why heavy/light mg and gauss exist instead of adding some real cool stuff or fixing things like underpowered LBX, but hey it is what it is.
Oh, and atm's are meh.
Heavy lasers are a colossal bust, IS rotary ac are cool niche weaps but not the most efficient, not really sure why heavy/light mg and gauss exist instead of adding some real cool stuff or fixing things like underpowered LBX, but hey it is what it is.
Oh, and atm's are meh.
#9
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Posted 08 August 2017 - 09:41 PM
Kimberm1911, on 08 August 2017 - 06:33 PM, said:
Pretty open ended question. What is the new tech like, how is the meta, are pugs still potatoes or has the game god granted us mercy? I have 8 patches I need to download, so I got a bit of time and thought I'd drop a forum post for some information.
Peace, and Have Fun.
Peace, and Have Fun.
If you're playing IS side then new tech brings a lot of toys to play with (LFE, Stealth Armor, Rotary ACs, etc). Nothing exceptional but you if you like experimenting new builds you have lot of options.
Some minor additions to clan tech instead.
#10
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Posted 08 August 2017 - 10:58 PM
Laser ams good for clan but sucks for IS. Generally an IS ams with 1 tone of ammo will outperform the IS laser ams.
Heavy lasers open up to a new playstyle of hit and run.
Rac5 are mediocre but great fun when you wanna be Rambo for a bit.
Heavy gauss are great when you wanna lob off limbs from mediums.
Light ppc makes no sense but heavy ppc are ridiculously good.
IS UAC are better uac than clan, except in the mech lab.
Heavy machine guns are absolute trash but lmg are the best of all mg.
IS er lasers are great.
Mrms are anti assault weapons, like streaks are anti light. Don't boat them.
Atm are the most OP ****. You can boat them but not anything slower than 81kph or you'll suffer from minimum range and can get into that sweet HE range.
Stealth armour are meme-tasting but overall only useful against potatoes.
Lfe are makes std redundant, unless you are running an assym build.
Heavy lasers open up to a new playstyle of hit and run.
Rac5 are mediocre but great fun when you wanna be Rambo for a bit.
Heavy gauss are great when you wanna lob off limbs from mediums.
Light ppc makes no sense but heavy ppc are ridiculously good.
IS UAC are better uac than clan, except in the mech lab.
Heavy machine guns are absolute trash but lmg are the best of all mg.
IS er lasers are great.
Mrms are anti assault weapons, like streaks are anti light. Don't boat them.
Atm are the most OP ****. You can boat them but not anything slower than 81kph or you'll suffer from minimum range and can get into that sweet HE range.
Stealth armour are meme-tasting but overall only useful against potatoes.
Lfe are makes std redundant, unless you are running an assym build.
#11
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Posted 08 August 2017 - 11:42 PM
Davegt27, on 08 August 2017 - 06:36 PM, said:
sucks
Stop with the agenda pushing.
To answer the OP. It's a mixed bag. IS now has caught up tech wise. Now if only the IS playerbase caught up mentality wise.
#12
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Posted 09 August 2017 - 12:19 AM
IMO...
Heavy lasers, HLL in particular, are murder if you can hold a target for the burn duration. 2xISLL damage for 80% of the tonnage and the same range bracket is nuts (HLLs also pair well with ERML). Just gotta use them on a high-burst midrange eraser build rather than trying to use them for brawling, which is a terrible idea. Don't try to use them as substitutes for the other laser types and you'll be fine. HML and HSL aren't as good because of the way ghost heat limits work, but if you can only take a few lasers it's worthwhile to use them. They have better damage per ton than any other weapon.
MRMs are the first real option for 'Mechs short on M hardpoints to do big damage with a missile weapon. They spread like crazy, but they work well for suppressive fire and they pair well with damage-over-time weapons like UAC10/20 and lasers. It is very easy to run up very high damage with MRMs if you aren't careless, since they deal 300 damage/ton of ammo compared to 180/t for LRMs or 215/t for IS SRMs.
Rocket launchers offer a panic burst potential to builds that can't otherwise generate high alphas... but they are pretty limited otherwise. Still mainly a troll weapon because their one-shot mechanic points that way, but their best uses IMO haven't emerged yet.
IS UAC10 is hands-down the single best IS ballistic weapon right now. UAC20 is also very good. UAC2 is marginal, and all of the new IS LBXs suck bot fly eggs.
LGauss is marginal, and so is HGauss. In the right build, they're great, but there aren't many right builds.
IS ERSL is a useful replacement for ISML on any build which called for multiple MLs as backup weapons. It isn't a great primary because it has low damage-per-weapon, but it's fantastic as a tonnage-saver on UAC or missile builds that need a decent "break glass in case of oh crap" gun.
IS ERML is wonderful. It's still got bad damage-per-ton and range compared to CERML, but that almost doesn't matter. Its range syncs up almost perfectly with ISLL and ISLPL, with a burn time roughly midway between the two, so it is an amazing backup weapon on any build using either as a primary. It also works great with Gaussvomit builds. Between ERML and ERSL, standard ISML is effectively obsolete on nearly every build- either one or the other is usually better because of range or damage/ton.
LFE is a breath of fresh air. It isn't as good as Clan XL and never will be, but it is a straight upgrade to 90% of the STD-engine IS builds in the game. 'Mechs that under-performed before now move faster, or hit harder- or both- and that's a more welcome buff than any quirk. My STD325 builds became LFE350 for a net gain of an extra ton, and my sub-300 STD builds gained the ability to actually move. Out of ~90 'Mechs (after several cleanout passes) I have three STD-engined builds left where there were about 20 before. It's just that much better.
Light ferro is also endlessly useful. It yields a fairly small return, but fits on many more builds than FF does. Half a ton here or there is an engine rating, or some ammo, or armor. It makes a difference.
Stealth armor... dunno. People haven't gotten used to it yet. Depending on the level of opposition you're facing it's either godlike or totally worthless.
Clan light TAG and light CAP are very good. They add ECM-neutralizing and lock-accelerating potential to builds which otherwise wouldn't have that because of tonnage limitations.
IS targeting comps... meh? They're good if you have spare tonnage, but don't trade a weapon for them or anything. Same as Clan TComps, really.
ATMs... undecided. I don't much like locking weapons, so I don't know if I'll ever really get into these. They do a lot of damage when they hit, but are super vulnerable to AMS.
LAMS runs way too hot to be worth it most of the time.
HMGs and LMGs are, shockingly, pretty damned decent. LMGs have enough of a crit bonus to gut open components from ML/ERSL ranges, and HMGs shred up close. Neither is recommended as a primary weapon, but if you have space you migth as well grab a few of whichever.
Heavy PPCs are amazeballs. They're big, and they're hot, but as long as you have a 'Mech that can afford the mounting cost they offer better stopping power than any other energy weapon in the game. Being able to bring two without tripping ghost heat for 50% more damage than the no-GH limit of any other PPC type is also very nice.
Snub PPCs are a decent enough alternative to LPL. They aren't a game changer, but they're a good partner for big-bore ACs.
Light PPCs IMO really shine when you pair one with a HPPC as a substitute for 2xPPC, because then you're spending one fewer ton and the same number of slots for a 2xPPC build and saving a ton with hot weapons is always nice. They're also a decent low-tonnage PPFLD option for light 'Mechs, so that's good too. The GH limit is too low at three, however. Four would be more reasonable.
RACs are heavily dependent on what kind of enemy you're facing. They deal great DPS, but terrible burst, so if an enemy has their wits about them they can twist your damage and burst your CT while you're trying to sandblast their face off with your RACs. Fortunately, PUGs are fairly slow to grasp the interplay between facetime and vulnerability, so RACs are super effective in solo queue. They're less effective in group, unless you have lots of support to take advantage of the distraction they cause.
Something something, disclaimer, grain of salt, something something.
Heavy lasers, HLL in particular, are murder if you can hold a target for the burn duration. 2xISLL damage for 80% of the tonnage and the same range bracket is nuts (HLLs also pair well with ERML). Just gotta use them on a high-burst midrange eraser build rather than trying to use them for brawling, which is a terrible idea. Don't try to use them as substitutes for the other laser types and you'll be fine. HML and HSL aren't as good because of the way ghost heat limits work, but if you can only take a few lasers it's worthwhile to use them. They have better damage per ton than any other weapon.
MRMs are the first real option for 'Mechs short on M hardpoints to do big damage with a missile weapon. They spread like crazy, but they work well for suppressive fire and they pair well with damage-over-time weapons like UAC10/20 and lasers. It is very easy to run up very high damage with MRMs if you aren't careless, since they deal 300 damage/ton of ammo compared to 180/t for LRMs or 215/t for IS SRMs.
Rocket launchers offer a panic burst potential to builds that can't otherwise generate high alphas... but they are pretty limited otherwise. Still mainly a troll weapon because their one-shot mechanic points that way, but their best uses IMO haven't emerged yet.
IS UAC10 is hands-down the single best IS ballistic weapon right now. UAC20 is also very good. UAC2 is marginal, and all of the new IS LBXs suck bot fly eggs.
LGauss is marginal, and so is HGauss. In the right build, they're great, but there aren't many right builds.
IS ERSL is a useful replacement for ISML on any build which called for multiple MLs as backup weapons. It isn't a great primary because it has low damage-per-weapon, but it's fantastic as a tonnage-saver on UAC or missile builds that need a decent "break glass in case of oh crap" gun.
IS ERML is wonderful. It's still got bad damage-per-ton and range compared to CERML, but that almost doesn't matter. Its range syncs up almost perfectly with ISLL and ISLPL, with a burn time roughly midway between the two, so it is an amazing backup weapon on any build using either as a primary. It also works great with Gaussvomit builds. Between ERML and ERSL, standard ISML is effectively obsolete on nearly every build- either one or the other is usually better because of range or damage/ton.
LFE is a breath of fresh air. It isn't as good as Clan XL and never will be, but it is a straight upgrade to 90% of the STD-engine IS builds in the game. 'Mechs that under-performed before now move faster, or hit harder- or both- and that's a more welcome buff than any quirk. My STD325 builds became LFE350 for a net gain of an extra ton, and my sub-300 STD builds gained the ability to actually move. Out of ~90 'Mechs (after several cleanout passes) I have three STD-engined builds left where there were about 20 before. It's just that much better.
Light ferro is also endlessly useful. It yields a fairly small return, but fits on many more builds than FF does. Half a ton here or there is an engine rating, or some ammo, or armor. It makes a difference.
Stealth armor... dunno. People haven't gotten used to it yet. Depending on the level of opposition you're facing it's either godlike or totally worthless.
Clan light TAG and light CAP are very good. They add ECM-neutralizing and lock-accelerating potential to builds which otherwise wouldn't have that because of tonnage limitations.
IS targeting comps... meh? They're good if you have spare tonnage, but don't trade a weapon for them or anything. Same as Clan TComps, really.
ATMs... undecided. I don't much like locking weapons, so I don't know if I'll ever really get into these. They do a lot of damage when they hit, but are super vulnerable to AMS.
LAMS runs way too hot to be worth it most of the time.
HMGs and LMGs are, shockingly, pretty damned decent. LMGs have enough of a crit bonus to gut open components from ML/ERSL ranges, and HMGs shred up close. Neither is recommended as a primary weapon, but if you have space you migth as well grab a few of whichever.
Heavy PPCs are amazeballs. They're big, and they're hot, but as long as you have a 'Mech that can afford the mounting cost they offer better stopping power than any other energy weapon in the game. Being able to bring two without tripping ghost heat for 50% more damage than the no-GH limit of any other PPC type is also very nice.
Snub PPCs are a decent enough alternative to LPL. They aren't a game changer, but they're a good partner for big-bore ACs.
Light PPCs IMO really shine when you pair one with a HPPC as a substitute for 2xPPC, because then you're spending one fewer ton and the same number of slots for a 2xPPC build and saving a ton with hot weapons is always nice. They're also a decent low-tonnage PPFLD option for light 'Mechs, so that's good too. The GH limit is too low at three, however. Four would be more reasonable.
RACs are heavily dependent on what kind of enemy you're facing. They deal great DPS, but terrible burst, so if an enemy has their wits about them they can twist your damage and burst your CT while you're trying to sandblast their face off with your RACs. Fortunately, PUGs are fairly slow to grasp the interplay between facetime and vulnerability, so RACs are super effective in solo queue. They're less effective in group, unless you have lots of support to take advantage of the distraction they cause.
Something something, disclaimer, grain of salt, something something.
Edited by WrathOfDeadguy, 09 August 2017 - 12:22 AM.
#13
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- Elite Founder
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Posted 09 August 2017 - 07:47 AM
Rocket launchers are hilarious. My centurion had extra space and missile hardpoints so I was able to swap one ASRM6 for 3x20 RL. Just ran into a MCII who was packing LRMs and lasers. Watching him go instantly from undamaged to yellow and orange all over was glorious. I'm ok with the minimum range.
Not that they're great. But fun.
Not that they're great. But fun.
#14
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- Bad Company
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Posted 09 August 2017 - 08:26 AM
Nice shiny toys for the IS. Heavy lasers for Clan are basically for those that can only mount to lasers and that's for more stare time and heat. ATMs are fun but with the current dead range not as good as they can be.
Other than that, me and my MCII are having a blast. I take good care of her, she takes good care and of me.
Other than that, me and my MCII are having a blast. I take good care of her, she takes good care and of me.
#15
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Posted 09 August 2017 - 08:31 AM
InfinityBall, on 09 August 2017 - 07:47 AM, said:
Rocket launchers are hilarious. My centurion had extra space and missile hardpoints so I was able to swap one ASRM6 for 3x20 RL. Just ran into a MCII who was packing LRMs and lasers. Watching him go instantly from undamaged to yellow and orange all over was glorious. I'm ok with the minimum range.
Not that they're great. But fun.
Not that they're great. But fun.
Yeah same kind of deal with this mrm 70, uac20 cyclops build I have run a few times, it splatters that damage everywhere on targets unless point blank, but damn is it fun, I just use it like the old srm/lbx combo which was probably more effective really, but so far, less fun.
I am glad most of the new tech isn't OP, there were so many potential meta-breaking weapon changes they could have made, but instead they just seemed to have expanded it a little at least by giving IS LFEs and the bigger weapon variants rather than the actual new tech, which still has room to be buffed etc.
#16
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- Shredder
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Posted 09 August 2017 - 11:30 AM
More options are always good. The game was getting a bit stale with all the same weapons, it needed new tech to open up peoples' creativity and coming up with builds instead of just going with cookie cutter builds.
I don't feel like the new weapons are super powerful or super weak. Maybe some are a tad on the weak side, but they are fun enough on their own. And its nice that IS finally has bigger UACs
LFE, light fero, and stealth armor are great.
I don't feel like the new weapons are super powerful or super weak. Maybe some are a tad on the weak side, but they are fun enough on their own. And its nice that IS finally has bigger UACs
LFE, light fero, and stealth armor are great.
Edited by Gristle Missile, 09 August 2017 - 11:32 AM.
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