46 replies to this topic

[MadHornet]

Although I'm late on this, the C-SPL nerf destroyed the Gargoyle's alpha potential and made possibly it's best and only viable build noticeably weaker.

There's no more builds to keep it's head above the water in the current game.


Press F to pay respects

[El Bandito]

Heavy lasers say hello.

[Angel of Annihilation]

El Bandito, on 10 August 2017 - 06:36 PM, said:

Heavy lasers say hello.

Wow. Two for two tonight. I have to agree with you again. I have a 7 Heavy Medium Laser Gargoyle that does just fine with its 70 point alpha. In fact I predict it will improve on the 15th when the Gargoyle E releases for C-bills and you will be able to move some of the lasers to the side Torsos.

Edited by Viktor Drake, 10 August 2017 - 06:42 PM.

[MadHornet]

Viktor Drake, on 10 August 2017 - 06:42 PM, said:

Wow. Two for two tonight. I have to agree with you again. I have a 7 Heavy Medium Laser Gargoyle that does just fine with its 70 point alpha. In fact I predict it will improve on the 15th when the Gargoyle E releases for C-bills and you will be able to move some of the lasers to the side Torsos.

Linebacker can do almost the same, all high mounted and with good heat efficiency at 104 kph. Gargoyle is best when you utilize all of its numerous hardpoints. The heavy lasers do not have what it takes to be a brawling weapon under any circumstance, not even heavy smalls. Ghost heat limit of four screws up your chance of mounting 12 HVY SML, and low-slung arms make it inferior to other 'mechs with similar HVY ML builds.

Edited by MadHornet, 10 August 2017 - 06:47 PM.

[Khobai]

heavy medium lasers are garbage compared to oldschool CSPLs

[SteelMantis]

It's getting a bit of a buff with 4 torso mounted laser hardpoints and a missile slot (LT 2 Energy 1 Missile, RT 2 Energy) on the new C-bill variant in a couple of days

It's not gonna make it great but it opens up some ballistic with laser backup builds.

[InspectorG]

I heard good things about 12 ERML on Gargles.

[Dr Mlem]

Khobai, on 10 August 2017 - 06:48 PM, said:

heavy medium lasers are garbage compared to oldschool CSPLs

Basically this. Heavy Mediums and Heavy Smalls are not worth it. The only good one is 2 Heavy LLs paired with ER-Mediums. Gargle can do that fine, but it runs super hot.

Edited by Lazer Doggo, 10 August 2017 - 07:02 PM.

[MadHornet]

SteelMantis, on 10 August 2017 - 06:53 PM, said:

It's getting a bit of a buff with 4 torso mounted laser hardpoints and a missile slot (LT 2 Energy 1 Missile, RT 2 Energy) on the new C-bill variant in a couple of days

It's not gonna make it great but it opens up some ballistic with laser backup builds.

Maybe 14 ERSML will work.

But for now I think it died. Maybe not for too long, but it certainly is dead.

[Alexander of Macedon]

Lazer Doggo, on 10 August 2017 - 07:01 PM, said:

Basically this. Heavy Mediums and Heavy Smalls are not worth it. The only good one is 2 Heavy LLs paired with ER-Mediums. Gargle can do that fine, but it runs super hot.

Dunno what you've been driving, all of the heavy lasers are solid for pretty much the exact same reason as the larges.

Granted if you're wanting pure laservom you're better off doing something like heavy LLas with MPLas, but the mediums and smalls are great for lights/mediums and to supplement heavy primary weapons.

[Khobai]

Quote

Basically this. Heavy Mediums and Heavy Smalls are not worth it. The only good one is 2 Heavy LLs paired with ER-Mediums. Gargle can do that fine, but it runs super hot.

yep. gargles is dead.

even the excutioner sucks now

oldschool x12 CSPLs + x1 LPL = 85 damage for 46 heat with half the beam duration and half the cooldown of CHML

none of the new executioner builds even come close

executioner is basically incapable of energy brawling now. it will lose to anything with ballistics.

Quote

Dunno what you've been driving, all of the heavy lasers are solid for pretty much the exact same reason as the larges.

yeah solid like lightsabers because their beam durations are miserably long. and their cooldowns are even worse. waiting 6.5s for a HML to recycle? no thanks.

heavy lasers are crap dude. the only reason to ever use them is on a mech like a shadowcat where your energy hardpoints are really limited.

Edited by Khobai, 10 August 2017 - 08:03 PM.

[El Bandito]

MadHornet, on 10 August 2017 - 06:46 PM, said:

Linebacker can do almost the same, all high mounted and with good heat efficiency at 104 kph. Gargoyle is best when you utilize all of its numerous hardpoints. The heavy lasers do not have what it takes to be a brawling weapon under any circumstance, not even heavy smalls. Ghost heat limit of four screws up your chance of mounting 12 HVY SML, and low-slung arms make it inferior to other 'mechs with similar HVY ML builds.

You don't have to brawl with Gargles. You can just use its incredible Medium mech level accel/decel to corner hump with assym builds. Like so. GAR-D Corner Humper

Edited by El Bandito, 10 August 2017 - 07:47 PM.

[Gas Guzzler]

Well, we are getting 2 E hardpoints per side torso on monday. I feel like the Gargoyle will do great with 2 HLL and ER ML spam.

[Fleeb the Mad]

You might not like this, but nerfing one powerful build that was propping up the chassis might do a lot to get it the attention it actually needs.

Given that balancing is mostly done by metrics, a drop in performance on the most popular build might actually trigger buffs to make the more diverse options viable.

[Athom83]

El Bandito, on 10 August 2017 - 07:45 PM, said:

You don't have to brawl with Gargles. You can just use its incredible Medium mech level accel/decel to corner hump with assym builds. Like so. GAR-D Corner Humper

But teh mechanic I was specifically abusing was the only thing that made me happy, so its dead for everyone because I say so.

[Felicitatem Parco]

Viktor Drake, on 10 August 2017 - 06:42 PM, said:

I have a 7 Heavy Medium Laser Gargoyle that does just fine with its 70 point alpha.

It's technically not an alpha strike if yo have to split it between 2 firing groups that fire 0.5 seconds apart....


(;-p)

[Khobai]

Quote

It's technically not an alpha strike if yo have to split it between 2 firing groups that fire 0.5 seconds apart....

even if you fired them all in one group I still wouldnt really consider it an alpha strike because of the atrocious 1.45 beam duration. The beam duration spreads out damage way too much compared to other weapons, its just not very lethal. an alphastrike needs to do all its damage within a reasonable timeframe and 1.45s is not really reasonable IMO.

Edited by Khobai, 10 August 2017 - 08:36 PM.

[Karl Streiger]

CSPL Boating was a Abomination of Blakes will.
It needed to be nuked from orbit.
Not that a 6 ERM TC6 Gargle is any better

Its just one of those cases, when bad game mechanics meet bad concepts

[MechaBattler]

Well no shet. CSPL was too strong. I was hoping the IS would see it's small lasers brought up to the level of the CSPL. But instead they nerfed the CSPL to bring it inline with IS smalls. So, sorry, but not sorry it was bound to happen.

[Khobai]

Quote

CSPL Boating was a Abomination of Blakes will.

CSPL was too strong

but now its completely useless

it wasnt balanced correctly at all